What is the BEST 4x5 wooden field camera? [Archive]

Scott Rosenberg

7-Aug-2006, 07:35

jack, i'm prepared to take a flogging for this, but i'll weigh-in anyway. much of this is going to depend on what your value, that is to say, what criterion you look for in saying one camera is better than another. the ebony or canham traditional cameras are the most capable and fully-featured. having cut my teeth on metal cameras, i never found any wooden camera that i was comfortable with WRT stability. that's just me. obviously, wooden cameras are stable enough to make sharp pictures, i've just never been comfortable using them. personally, i feel that ebony cameras are simply the camera-de-jour and not worth the buy-in price. i would sooner buy a tachihara and extra lens! if i was forced to use a wooden camera, i'd use a canham traditional, but then again that shouldn't be much of a surprise, as it's really a metal camera in a pretty wooden box.

Frank Petronio

7-Aug-2006, 07:48

Wasn't that Phillips (that you did not sell to me last year!) 4x5 you had the best wooden field camera?

Walter Calahan

7-Aug-2006, 07:49

The one you own.

Ben Calwell

7-Aug-2006, 07:53

I've always been sort of happy with my rosewood Wista DX. It's probably not the best wooden field camera, but it's held up nicely for me. I like its light weight, especially as I get older. I wish it had beefier knobs, and I wish the focus were a bit smoother.

Jack Flesher

7-Aug-2006, 08:16

darr

7-Aug-2006, 08:17

I have owned a few: Wista 4x5", Wisner 5x7", and Ebony SV45U. I did not like the Wisner much as I had a few problems with the back falling off and the bellows extended would jump the rails (no stops I think). I still have the Ebony and find it to be better as far as stability and movements goes, but I love my Arca even more. :)

Ernest Purdum

7-Aug-2006, 08:35

There can't be a consensus because individual requirements vary. To one person, lightness is paramount, while another wants a long extension and a large, sturdy, lensboard. A third is most intersted in the ease of use of very wide angle lenses.

Ron Marshall

7-Aug-2006, 08:55

Canham. Sturdy, fairly light, large bellows draw, 5x7 back, 4x10 conversion.

Brian Ellis

7-Aug-2006, 09:15

Among wooden cameras I've owned a Tachihara, two Ebonys, an Agfa Ansco, and two Deardorffs. As among those I liked Deardorff the best, followed by the Tachihara, followed by the Ebonys (SVTe and SVTi), and Agfa Ansco last just because I didn't like the non-clam shell design.

Eric Biggerstaff

7-Aug-2006, 09:15

Frr lightweight and ease of use, my Tachihara wins. For sturdiness and ability to use more lenses my Zone VI. I don't think there is one best camera, but if I had a boat load of money I would get an Ebony only because of the reputation and the idea of having it. It won't do anything my other cameras won't, I will just feel better when I make bad images!

Ralph Barker

7-Aug-2006, 09:22

The best had to be that one custom Deardorff made of boogabooga wood, which had the color of real Brazilian rosewood, the strength and stability of ebony, the figuring of cocobola, but the weight of basswood. Unfortunately, there was only one small boogabooga tree, and it was harvested specifically for this camera, so replication is impossible. ;)

Consensus? Yeah, right. ;)

Steve Hamley

7-Aug-2006, 09:34

Ralph,

You obviously missed my eBay auction of this camera, so I'll offer you a second chance offer on the boogabooga wood Deardorff, new in box with manufacturer's 10-year warranty. Complete with batteries and manual.

The best camera is one with controls you're confortable using and specifications you can at least live with. Sold an 8x10 Canham woodie because the controls weren't what I was comfortable using, my 4x5 and 8x10 are Ebony. I never even think about the camera while shooting.

My 8x20 is an old Korona, also easy to use. I'd like more movements, but it hasn't killed me yet.

Steve

Alan Davenport

7-Aug-2006, 09:46

Mine is.

Jim Jones

7-Aug-2006, 10:06

Mine is.
That would be a good answer from most of us. I use a B&J flatbed 5x7 because it was cheap ($85). A variety of backs down to 35mm make it versatile. A 21" lens works well on it. It has given good service for more than 30 years. True, it is big and heavy. Many cameras are more rigid. Sometimes my Speed Graphic or B&J press camera with revolving back and good front tilts is more appropriate. Most of you have 4x5 field cameras that are better than my gear, and best for you.

If you walk a mile in my shoes, your feet had better be no larger than mine!

Gordon Moat

7-Aug-2006, 10:35

Lots of mentions of Ebony, which I find to be a great choice. What I am curious about is whether people choose Ebony because of their RW45 cameras, or one of their SV45 cameras? Mahagony or Ebony wood?

I would like to eventually get one, though I will likely keep my current 4x5 too. I had a metal TOYO around six years ago, and never had a wood camera until buying a Shen-Hao HZX45A-II this January.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat
A G Studio

Steve Hamley

7-Aug-2006, 10:42

Gordon,

I actually have both a SV45U and a RW45 (the RW45 was acquired in a trade for a lighter weight option). My answer reflects experience with the SV45U, although I expect the RW45 to be a functional light(er) weight alternative.

You'll know when you have the right camera, it "disappears" during the picture taking process.

Steve

Don Hutton

7-Aug-2006, 10:42

"field camera" covers a lot of ground. For the ultimate "do it all" field camera where price is not a big factor, I think it's very hard to beat an Ebony SV45U, or, if you need more extension, the SV45U2 (I personally don't find rear shift to be a huge benefit on a field camera, although for architectural shooting, it can be very handy). The SV45U is substantially more compact than the U2, handles a 450mm lens in the field just fine and is a joy to use. If you don't need a whole lot of extension, a non-foder may be the answer - I finally swapped my SV45U for a 45SU - the 45SU is a non-folder so it is way quicker to shoot (especially if you keep a lens mounted).

However, there's a lot to be said for a $600 Tachihara too - drop it and you just buy a new one without too many tears...

darr

7-Aug-2006, 10:44

Lots of mentions of Ebony, which I find to be a great choice. What I am curious about is whether people choose Ebony because of their RW45 cameras, or one of their SV45 cameras? Mahagony or Ebony wood?

Gordon, I chose Ebony for a few reasons (movements, bellows extension, 6x9 back) and since you asked about the wood I'll tell you why I chose the ebony version of the Ebony SV45U. I have studied and played classical guitar since age 12 (I'm 48 now) and always favored an ebony fretboard over a rosewood one. I just like the look and feel of ebony wood. :)

Robert Skeoch

7-Aug-2006, 11:03

Right now I use a Wisner 8x10, so I know it's not the best camera. Before that I used a Deardorff 8x10, nice but not the greatest. (Those wingnutty things are too small)
I have a couple Zone VI's and Wisner 4x5's that students use in my workshops... great value but not the best.
In my retail outlet I import and sell both the Ebony's and Canham's. I brought in these two lines because..... I liked them best.... owners I talked with had few complaints.... they're well respected lines..... they had a lot to offer... they both make great cameras.
Of all the cameras I've used or owned my first choice would be an Ebony SV810 in Mahogany. One day I'll sell off the Wisner and make the switch but for now I use the Wisner because it's paid for.
-Rob Skeoch
www.bigcameraworkshops.com

Eric Leppanen

7-Aug-2006, 11:22

If money is not a key consideration, and you are looking for an exceptionally crafted, aesthetically awesome camera that is a lot of fun to use, then an Ebony is hard to beat. The key question is which model to go for.

My set up is a bit similar to yours in that I have a primary camera that I use for the majority of my work (originally an Ebony SV45U2, more recently an SV810U), and a smaller, lightweight camera for longer hikes and general fun use (an Ebony RSW45). I originally bought the SV45U2 because I am a long lens person and it was the only 4x5 camera available (excluding 5x7 cameras with reducing backs) capable of supporting the Fuji 600C lens (it could focus this lens at infinity with a standard lensboard, but I bought a two inch extended lensboard to give more room for movements, etc.). However, I subsequently added the 8x10 and now I do all my heavy-duty work (including long lenses) with that camera, so I sold the SV45U2. The SV45U2 was also a relatively heavy 4x5 camera (7 pounds) and was not the best wide-angle choice (needed a wide angle bellows for significant movements, and required reconfiguration in the "wide angle position" for my shorter wide angle lenses), which also played into that decision.

I now have a "gap" in my LF camera lineup where I'd like something more featured than the RSW45, but much smaller and lighter than the 8x10. I'm debating between 4x5 and 5x7, but if I went 4x5 I'd give serious consideration to the non-folding 45SU. In your case, if you look to your Arca to perform long lens work, then you could get by with less extension in a wooden camera, and the 45SU is a dream to use (the non-folding aspect makes set-up and tear-down much quicker, allows a lens to remain installed even when the camera is stowed, and generally encourages frequent use of the camera). If I had to pick the most fun camera in the Ebony line, I would pick the 45SU for those reasons. You can also order a custom version with 30mm more extension (longer flatbed) or made out of Mahogany wood (a bit lighter) if desired. If you need more extension, the SV45U would be my alternative choice. In either case, the asymmetric rear movements add to the joy of using the camera.

The Ebony cameras are just magnificent to look at, which sounds like one of the criteria you are looking for!

Scott Davis

7-Aug-2006, 12:48

Kirk: Sounds like nirvana LOLOL!

Scott: No heat here -- I understand exactly what you are saying. I have an Arca and want a back-up fun to use camera. I really like the look and feel of wood, so want a wooden field camera just for the fun/nostalgia of using one.

Frank: The Phillips is exceptionally rigid, light and very functional, but is somewhat spartan in its movements and while it is technically wood, the panels are laminate and it wasn't very nostalgic to use ;)
Cheers,

If you're looking for fun and nostalgia in a 4x5, while retaining utility, the Shen Hao 45 HZX II is a hard camera to beat. Teakwood, very full-featured with more movements than some monorail cameras, very solid, and inexpensive. I've had mine for five years and knocked it around quite a bit, and it's always come back for more. If budget is less of an issue, a Canham or Zone VI Ultralight. My 8x10 is a Zone VI ultralight, and it is a gem to use, except for the bellows (which are so long that they tend to sag unless radically extended or radically compressed, so you have to remember to hook the loop over the screw on the front standard so they don't sag into the image area). The Ultralight versions of the 4x5 are still available new from Calumet I believe. Probably won't have that bellows issue either. It's a shame the Zone VI 8x10's went out of production - they are a much overlooked and undervalued camera.

I've got a Canham 5x7 wood field, which is also a wonderful camera. all the controls are super smooth, very silky, easy to adjust. The Canham is a bit quirky though in regards to opening and closing it - it takes a bit of getting used to if you've had something else before. It isn't a one-handed operation, like the Shen Hao 4x5 is.

Brian Ellis

7-Aug-2006, 12:58

"What I am curious about is whether people choose Ebony because of their RW45 cameras, or one of their SV45 cameras? Mahagony or Ebony wood?"

I had one of each of the SV45s. I first bought the Ti (mahagony) because of its lower weight than the ebony wood. However, it was surprisingly loose and imprecise (surprisingly because I read here and elsewhere that Ebonys were the equal of metal cameras in terms of rigidity and precision). I thought maybe the ebony wood (Te) would be better so I traded in the Ti on a new Te. It wasn't any better than the Ti in those respects, plus I hated the three knob focusing system and the way the lens board mechanism used to get stuck as it was being lowered into the front standard when setting up the camera. The Fresnel screen wasn't particularly good so I had to replace it with a BosScreen at a cost of another $150. And the bag bellows didn't fit properly so that caused me to ruin a bunch of negatives. I had to send the bag bellows back to the factory to get it fixed. Anyhow, after a year of frustration I sold the Te and went back to what I started with and should never have disposed of, a metal Linhof Technika. It is my very humble opinion that Ebonys, at least the two models I owned, are overrated and overpriced.

Ted Harris

7-Aug-2006, 13:38

I am oneof those that is not a fan of the Ebony because,while it is extraordinarly nice to look at I don't find that it offers enough additional functionality over the other woo dfields to justify the much higher price (same for Lotus which no one hs mentioned). Bottom line is that I, like others, prefer the more precise feel of a metal field eventhough they are not as pretty (when I want pretty I bring along my Zone VI). OTOH I have been shooting with a Canham Traditional 57/45 for many years and it is the best of all possible worlds. The Canham is basically a wood box with a metal camera inside.

Don Hutton

7-Aug-2006, 14:21

"I don't find that it offers enough additional functionality over the other woo dfields to justify the much higher price"

Ted

I'm a big fan of the assymetric movements for quick field use - it's additional functionality that no other manufacturer offers in a 4x5 field camera. Though the cost is high, that's just an individual preference. I also think that the Ebony "universal" bellows add a lot of real functionality to a field camera.

That said, I still think that you get a lot of camera for your $600 in a Tachihara....

Rick Moore

7-Aug-2006, 16:03

I've used a Tachihara 4x5 since 1977, and if you can live with the short fixed bellows, it's an fine camera. However, I have worked mainly with a Canham wooden 8x10 since 2000 and can recommend Canham products without hesitation. The 4x5/5x7 is not much larger than a straight 4x5, weighs only six pounds, has a 28 inch bellows, and, IMHO, is every bit as much a thing of beauty as any Ebony. In addition, Keith Canham provides outstanding support for his cameras. If you have any questions, call him. He'll call you back promptly and spend whatever time is needed to answer any questions about his products. I've only needed to talk to him twice, but each time, he made me feel like answering my questions was his most important priority.

Eric Leppanen

7-Aug-2006, 16:14

Paying a premium (which I admit is quite steep) for a full-featured Ebony buys the following unique features:

- Asymmetric movements. I agree with Don that these are a big deal, and can save quite a bit of time in the field.
- Universal bellows. This provides enough wide-angle movement for most landscape purposes, although for architectural photography or extreme movements you'll still need a bag bellows.
- Non-folding design. If you don't need a lot of extension and have room in your pack for such a camera, the non-folding aspect is a real time saver.
- Separate controls for rise/fall and axis tilt on both standards. It's nice to adjust tilt without worrying about the standard suddenly slipping down.
- Vertical and horizontal spirit levels are mounted together on the top of the rear standard along with a pivoting mirror, so you can simultaneously monitor both levels while leveling the camera on a ballhead. This is admittedly a tidbit, but a useful one.

Also, on the larger folding Ebony cameras (such as the 8x10) the optional bag bellows is pleated and can be folded with the camera. The bag bellows on my SV810U can accommodate lenses as short as 110mm and as long as 450mm, and I can pack solely the bag bellows for hikes where I know I won't be using longer lenses. I presume the 4x5 cameras operate similarly, but I don't know for sure.

These are all incremental features that make an Ebony camera more fun to use. Whether they are worth the added cash outlay is a personal decision. If one is looking for basic view camera features at the best price, it is hard to beat a Tachi or a Shen-hao, and Canham certainly makes an excellent and highly popular mid-range product. And no wood camera in my experience has matched a metal camera for operational precision, although personally I have not missed this in the field.

My understanding is that the chief difference between the ebony and mahogany wood (aside from weight) is the durability of the finish.

Matthew Cordery

7-Aug-2006, 16:39

I have an Ebony non-folder (RSW 45) and I used to own the Wisner Technical Field. The Ebony beats the Wisner hands down for stability and non-drift of adjustments. As for the focusing screen, it's not that bad. The Wisner's was worse though before I replaced it with a BossScreen. I've contemplated replacing the one on my Ebony with a Maxwell but it doesn't annoy me so much that it's a high priority item.

Bill_1856

7-Aug-2006, 17:41

The best? Gandolfi.
The one I own? Nagaoka.
The best all-round compromise? Linhof Technika (all metal).
The one that everyone should have in their closet? Crown Graphic.
The most perfect one? The one that you're going to get sniped out of on ebay.

Jack Flesher

8-Aug-2006, 06:48

While there are a few that don't or didn't care for them, it looks like there is some consensus for Ebony, followed perhaps by Canham...

Given the minimum focus distance on the Canham with standard bellows being slightly longer than my often-used 65 and given my lenses are already mounted in Tech boards, I'm leaning towards Ebony -- though I actually prefer the "looks" of the Canham.

On the Canham, I have read through some older threads and it sounds like there may be an issue with stability -- can any Canham owners comment?

Thanks for all the feedback so far!

Mark Fisher

8-Aug-2006, 18:02

Come on now, why not go as far away as you can from your Arca (-: I have a Tachihara which I think fits what you want very well, plus it is about as light as you will find in a modern field camera and it deals with short lenses well. It is really a pleasure to pack and use. Now, what I REALLY liked was the Gandolfi I saw at the view camera conference. It worked at least as well at my Tachihara, was absolutely gorgeous, and was just a little quirky.

Ted Harris

8-Aug-2006, 18:02

Two points Jack. First, IIRC, the questions about stabiliity have usually been aimed at the 4x5 Canham DLC, not the Traditional 45/57. Personally, I originally agreed that I thought the DLC was less stable than I would want but after using one off and on a number of times I think it is just fine. The Traditional is one of the solidest cameras I ahve ever used when working with lenses of 450mm and shorter. When you are using longer lenses, well you just have to live with the fact that when you have 600+mm of bellows hangin' out thereyou ahve the potential for some movement when there is any air movement or ground vibration. Second, if you want to tay with your Tech boards, no problem. Keith can change out the front standard so that it is a Tech front standard for $150. That is what I have on mine.

BTW, if you want to use your 65mm lens then just switch to the bag bellows. You can sue the bag bellows up to 210.

Frank Petronio

8-Aug-2006, 18:13

Now I can say it. Get a 5x7 wooden camera so you can shoot some real film. Make that your wooden 4x5 ;-)

QT makes a pretty convincing argument for 5x7 in his article.

David Karp

8-Aug-2006, 18:31

If you are thinking about the tradition of a wood camera, I suggest a Deardorff 5x7 with a 4x5 back. I went out shooting with a friend of mine and another friend of his that I did not know. He had one of those Deardorffs (an old one) and it was really nice. I guess you can now get the same design new from Jack Deardorff.

Jack Flesher

8-Aug-2006, 18:41

Mark: I thought about a Tachi or Nagoaka or Ikeda and even the Shen Hao, but I am willing to pay a bit more for a little better build quality.

Ted: Good to hear the Canham wood traditional is stable and great to hear about the Tech front mod! Having to swap out to a bag bellow for the 65 bothers me a bit, but the other side is I could convert it easily to 5x7 if I ever felt the impulse.

Hmmmm... Decisions, decisions.

Ted Harris

8-Aug-2006, 19:17

Like Frank says, get a 5x7. Make it the Canham. Get a 5x7 to 4x5 Polaroid holder insert that Midwest sells and shoot anything. One point to remember the Canham Traditional is a 5x7 and has its dimensions .... about 9.5 inches by 10+ inches. If the size doesn't bother you all is well because it eighs about the same as lots of 4x5s.

Ron Marshall

8-Aug-2006, 19:32

I had a good look at a Canham woodman 4x5/5x7 and it is a very well built camera, and solid. It is a 5x7 which comes with either a 4x5 or a 5x7 back, which I think is a great concept. If I was to buy again that is what I would get.

There is also a 4x10 back and bellows conversion available. A very versatile camera.

Have a look at the detailed review on this site.

Andrew Ito

8-Aug-2006, 19:47

Hi Jack. Of course through our conversations you know that I love Ebony cameras. I've had a Wista, Shen Hao, Tachihara and several models of Ebony cameras including the RW45, SV45Ti, 23S and the 45SU. Currently, I own the SV45Ti but in retrospect I should have never sold my 45SU. Best compromise of wide angle lens ease of use, reasonable bellows draw, weight and set up ease. IMHO, I'd say the 45SU but of course YMMV.

Rick Moore

8-Aug-2006, 22:47

On the Canham, I have read through some older threads and it sounds like there may be an issue with stability -- can any Canham owners comment?

As I said above, my Canham experience is with a wooden 8x10, not the 4x5/5x7. However, except for size, they appear to be built almost identically, so I think my experience is relevant here.

I find the 8x10 to be very stable. As Ted mentions above, when using a 600 with the bellows extended 30 inches or more, you have quite a large surface area exposed to the wind. I use an umbrella to block the wind, and have never had a shot fail due to camera instability. Don't get me wrong, I've blown many a shot due to my own stupidity, but the camera has always performed flawlessly.

All of the camera's movements lock down tightly. The hard-anodized metal pieces are made for Canham by a company that also makes hard-anodized parts for military fighter aircraft, so the fit and finish are truly first-rate.

Ole Tjugen

8-Aug-2006, 23:34

The one you own.

The one I own isn't wood, but carbon fiber. But I still think it's the best! I was out shooting yesterday, and had neglected to bring the bag bellows along. No problem as it turned out - the 65mm lens focussed quite nicely, and doesn't have enough coverage for serious movements anyway.

And the next shot was with a 355mm G-Claron, with so much movements that I was approaching the edge of that 45cm image circle.

Jack Flesher

9-Aug-2006, 08:39

Okay, we're now down to the Ebony, Canham and Carbon-Infinity as the main conteders -- due to rareity of the Carbon, I would say that leaves me looking at an Ebony or Canham.

I actually use small amounts of rear shift in the field fairly often (admittedly, I'm a tweaker -- and obviously lazy -- when it comes to composition). Canham fills that requirement and current Ebony choices seem to be 45 SVU2 or 45 Te (If I get an Ebony, I want ebony wood). I am leaning toward the Te since it is a touch smaller, a touch lighter and a lot less expensive than the U2.

Anybody have an Ebony or Canham camera they want to sell?

:),

Robert Skeoch

9-Aug-2006, 09:41

I have both for sale.... but I'm the dealer for Canada. You can email me if you're interested in either the Ebony's or Canham's new. I would be happy to chat with you.
You can also see them on the website.
-Rob Skeoch
skeoch@sympatico.ca
www.bigcameraworkshops.com

darr

9-Aug-2006, 09:55

I would try to test drive the Canham and Ebony out before purchase. The photographer I sold my Wisner to had sold her Canham for it. She said she did not like the knobs on the Canham. Whether it was the shape, feel, or how they operated I do not know; just that she made the comment to me. The Wisner knobs were along the lines of the Ebony (circular), but brass instead of titanium.

snuck

9-Aug-2006, 19:08

Anybody know of a Shen-Hao distributor in Canada? (toronto to be exact). I want to retire my military speed graphic before it gets mangled any more. I also want more movements.

Paul-Owen

10-Aug-2006, 02:59

Without a doubt anything made by Ebony!! There are many fine cameras out there to choose from but if you spend the time researching them all you will eventually realise that at this present time Ebony is baout the best wooden camera manufcaturer out there! I have owned the SW45 and currently use the 45SU and the RSW. I have also been fortunate enough to use the SV45 and the RW45E and all share the same high quality craftsmanship and attention to detail as well as being very enjoyable to use.

Robert Skeoch

10-Aug-2006, 06:49

Anybody know of a Shen-Hao distributor in Canada? (toronto to be exact). I want to retire my military speed graphic before it gets mangled any more. I also want more movements.

I don't know of a dealer in Canada, the people that I know who have bought the cameras imported them on their own. It's a hard company to be a dealer for, mostly because they sell direct, so there's no incentive to become a dealer and have capital tied up in stock.

The couple people that I know who bought the cameras resold them about a year later. I don't think it was a problem with the camera, just not what they were looking for.

-Rob Skeoch
www.bigcameraworkshops.com

snuck

10-Aug-2006, 07:11

The couple people that I know who bought the cameras resold them about a year later. I don't think it was a problem with the camera, just not what they were looking for.

The ugly truth is that, regardless of material or make, I seem to break my equipment at the same rate, so I figure that I might as well save!

Cheers

Donald Brewster

10-Aug-2006, 09:58

Jack:

It is the 4x5 Phillips that I DID buy from you (sorry Frank). Why you gave that one up I'll never understand, but I do appreciate it every day.

Regards,

Don

Jack Flesher

10-Aug-2006, 13:06

Jack:

It is the 4x5 Phillips that I DID buy from you (sorry Frank). Why you gave that one up I'll never understand, but I do appreciate it every day.

Regards,

Don

Hi Don:

Glad you are enjoying that camera! It is -- err was -- a sweetheart ;)

One of the things about the Phillips that bothered me was the lack of rear shift. I know it isn't *necessary* in a field camera, but as I explained above I definitely prefer to have it available.

Cheers,

Ed K.

11-Aug-2006, 00:34

I wish I knew which one was the best and that I could afford to have it!:)

You're asking a similar question to one I'd like to know from users here. Which of your LF cameras, in this case, 4x5 cameras bring you the most and best images back? For me, the field camera that seems to do this the most of all is made of, well, plastic! I get more good images with my silly Toyo CF because it is so light and small and something I don't have to worry about too much if it is damaged. But that's for typical street and field shooting where most needed swing and tilt can be done on the front, and of course, very long lenses are out of the question.

In the field, I'm so rough on my equipment that having a priceless piece of art to shoot with is a boost to the ego or the fun of it I suppose, but a real drain worrying about what's going to happen to ruin it. Thus, for just me, the best 4x5 field camera, wooden or otherwise, is the one that just gets the job done and lets me be free to make images.

You on the otherhand, are probably one of those that can keep things nice indefinitely, yet still manage to use them, no?

Not to hijack this, but would people that answer Jack's question mind sharing which of their 4x5s bring back the most good images for them?

Hmmm, it's time to put my Graflexes into the closet to die a lonely death. I haven't used them in some time. I don't know if there is room for this Graflex in the closet ( attached thumbnail ). The body is wood, and it is a 4x5, but I certainly can attest to it being anything but the best wooden field camera!

Scott Davis

11-Aug-2006, 04:24

I don't know of a dealer in Canada, the people that I know who have bought the cameras imported them on their own. It's a hard company to be a dealer for, mostly because they sell direct, so there's no incentive to become a dealer and have capital tied up in stock.

The couple people that I know who bought the cameras resold them about a year later. I don't think it was a problem with the camera, just not what they were looking for.

-Rob Skeoch
www.bigcameraworkshops.com

I can't speak for anyone else who has one, but I've had a Shen Hao for five going on six years now, and it has never failed me. In the studio or at 9000 feet in the California Sierra, it's been a great little camera.

Snuck -

I think you'd be hard pressed to really trash a Shen-Hao, unless you absolutely abuse the thing. If you want one, there are several US dealers who will send you one on approval, to try out - Badger Graphic, Midwest Photo among others. You can also find them new on Ebay.

CXC

11-Aug-2006, 06:57

Try as I may, I cannot find any shortcomings with my Walker (yes it has rear shift). Oh yeah, it's machined out of ABS plastic instead of wood, so I guess that disqualifies it -- nevermind.

The only other field camera I would consider would be a non-folder, for the convenience in set-up and leaving a lens on it when stowed in the backpack. So this is turning into a backhanded vote for Ebony.

Given adequate bellows draw/compression and movements, secondary features increase in importance. Being able to leave the lens on is such a feature.

snuck

11-Aug-2006, 07:24

I think you'd be hard pressed to really trash a Shen-Hao, unless you absolutely abuse the thing. If you want one, there are several US dealers who will send you one on approval, to try out - Badger Graphic, Midwest Photo among others. You can also find them new on Ebay.

That's good to know. I'm just going to sit and wait for now.

Gordon Moat

11-Aug-2006, 11:37

Hello Ed K.,

I had a metal TOYO several years ago when I left large format. This January I got a Shen-Hao, my first ever brand new camera. Between the TOYO and the Shen-Hao, I got to use several different 4x5 cameras, though not an Ebony. I remember the TOYO was more rigid and precise feeling than I think the Shen-Hao moves, but that might just be because I notice more when I make movements on the Shen-Hao. I had considered buying something used, or getting a TOYO CF prior to my purchase.

At first I was a little worried about the rigidity of a (mostly) wood camera. I had one shooting situation of really high winds in which a Quickload packet sleeve was actually shaking and vibrating during a two minute exposure. I thought that shot was probably ruined, so I took another time exposure. When I got the transparencies back from the lab, both images were quite equal . . . in other words, despite what I thought was obvious shaking, that perceived movement did not affect the results. After that incident, I didn't worry about using a wood camera.

The best camera is the one that you want to use and want to take to different locations often. Ideally it should not restrict what you want to accomplish, nor which lenses you would like to use. The folding design of my Shen-Hao, and the way the controls work suits how I want to take photos. I could hope for a faster set-up sometimes, though I don't miss not having that. I sure would like an Ebony, mostly because of that perception that they are nicer, though the difference in spending can get me more lenses and lots more film. I doubt I would be able to pick out images made with a certain camera, especially if I use the same lens and film holder on each. Hopefully that sort of answers your question.

Ciao!

Gordon Moat
A G Studio

Jack Flesher

11-Aug-2006, 11:56

Thank you for all the comments so far!

Here is what I have decided on for the time being.

Since my main goals are to use this for fun and as a back-up to my Arca, ideally the camera I choose would also be a more compact and lightweight option for long treks. But I don't want to sacrifice rigidity for weight, so what I want is as rigid as feasable, compact as possible and if it is lightweight to boot, then that is gravy.

The Canham (and Lotus) looks and sounds like it would be a great camera, however being a 5x7 is significantly lager than a dedicated 4x5 woodie. The Gandolfi, Walker and Carbon Infinity variants sound interesting, but they are not all that available to try out. The Tachi/Ikeda/Wista would work, but from what I have seen by handling them in the past, they are not all that rigid.

Based on what I've read here, that pretty much leaves the Ebony and Shen Hao. I found a reasonable deal on a used Ebony 45Te (which I can return) so I ordered it -- and a the same time ordered a new Shen Hao so I can compare them directly. One will get returned after I can handle them both and I will share my findings here for posterity. If the Shen Hao is even close, it's pricepoint is so attratctive it's going to be tough for the Ebony to compete -- the used 45Te above was 3.5x the cost of the new Shen Hao...

Frank Petronio

11-Aug-2006, 12:35

That will be a great comparision because not many photographers are objective enough to compare an expensive, aspirational camera like an Ebony against the "best bang for the buck" Shen-Hao. Most of us are suckers for branding and rationalizations. Not that you're immune, but I know you are pretty hard nosed about your gear (anyone who would sell a lovely Phillips 4x5 is CHILL and COLD AS STEEL ;) .)

Please keep us posted!

Ron Marshall

11-Aug-2006, 12:47

Jack, since you are looking for a lighter alternative to your Arca have you considered the Toho?

Jack Flesher

11-Aug-2006, 16:25

(anyone who would sell a lovely Phillips 4x5 is CHILL and COLD AS STEEL ;) .)

ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jack Flesher

11-Aug-2006, 16:33

Jack, since you are looking for a lighter alternative to your Arca have you considered the Toho?

Hi Ron:

I actually owned a Toho for about two weeks a year or so ago. (And sold it to yet another forum member here :p ) It was a very nice little camera, certainly lightweight, reasonably rigid and very compact if you took the time necessary to disassemble it. It worked well enough but in the end there was just no love; no connection with it. In a monorail, I much prefer my Arca -- lots of love there!

I did in fact consider another Toho as a valid back-up -- and it would be an excellent choice if that's all I wanted it for -- but I have a bug for a woody :D

Cheers,

Frank Petronio

11-Aug-2006, 16:58

I'm just glad I didn't write Jack into my living will. The way he swaps his cameras around I know he'd pull the plug on my life support at the first opportunity...

CXC

11-Aug-2006, 17:51

Intriguing, that after all this discussion the choice has basically boiled down to the most expensive camera vs. the cheapest.

I might still be using my now-sold Shen Hao (to another forum member) if I had bought the standard instead of the bargain model (discontinued?) with too short a bellows. It's a capable, handsome little camera.

On the other hand, I happen to be in Shanghai right now (I'm a SanFran resident), and it is so hot and crowded that it is hard for me to go out shooting with my Walker. Every possible convenience that eases or speeds up setup, shooting, and tear down would help me in this environment. Also weight has become a much bigger consideration. A 45s would be just about perfect...

Similar arguments could be made for any other inclemencies, such as cold, wind, rain, etc.

Please let us know the results of your side by side comparison.

Jack Flesher

12-Aug-2006, 17:22

I'm just glad I didn't write Jack into my living will. The way he swaps his cameras around I know he'd pull the plug on my life support at the first opportunity...

FTR, I don't really swap my regular cameras around that much Frank. But I do test-drive a variety of alternative styles :D I find I can usually buy any decent piece of used LF gear, try it out and can almost always sell it for what I paid for it if I don't like it -- kind of like free rentals, though it does tie the camera funds up during that time.

Cheers,

Michael Daily

12-Aug-2006, 18:06

Ed K.
To get the picture, for me so far, is a toss-up between my DD 8x10 and my old Busch Pressman D 4x5. It is compact, rugged, reliable, and has been in some tough spots. But with it I have images of a brush fire in southern Greece, Michaelangelo's "Madonna and Child" in Brugge, castles in the mountains in Germany, and it has been in 9 countries over the 34 years that I've had it. It should last for my grandchildren's grandchildren.
Michael