PDA

View Full Version : Which Modern Lens to Start Upgrading an Older Lens Set?



Michael Heald
15-Jul-2006, 07:09
Hello! I've been treading carefully getting into 4x5 LF, starting with an Orbit Monorail and a PaceMaker Speed Graphic. Currently, I use a Tachihara, mostly for landscape and some architectural photography

Currently, I use a 210mm single coated Ilex-Calumet-Caltar and a single coated 90mm Calumet Caltar II W (German make).

Since my wife and children always tell me they never know what to buy me for birthday/Chistmas, and I've been thinking about adding a modern 135-150mm lens, I'm considering suggesting a lens to them. The archives suggest a Sironar-S, Nikor-W, Fujinon CM, or G-Claron would fit the bill.

This isn't a "what one lens . . . ." question, but I would probably own such a lens for years. Among these 4, is there a consensus that one lens of these 4 would be slightly better than the others for general work and that folks would feel comfortable recommending as an upgrade from older lenses? Best regards.

Mike

Christopher Perez
15-Jul-2006, 07:30
Just about any multi-coated lens manufacturered over the past 25 years will probably meet your need. The most recent lenses (Sironar-S and Symmar-L) offer slightly more coverage than their earlier models. But that's just about it and the differences may not be great enough to quibble over.

If the lenses are built correctly (Fuji and Schneider and Nikon all appear to be consistant in this regard) then you won't be able to tell the difference between them in the real world. I should modify this; I couldn't tell the difference between them. When it takes 160x magnification to show they are largely equal, then they are largely equal to me. :) :)

Ron Marshall
15-Jul-2006, 07:33
Go for either the APO-Sironar or the Fuji CMW, as they have a bit more coverage for movements.

Bruce Watson
15-Jul-2006, 07:35
There seem to be a couple of lens sets that people like. There's the 90-135-210, and there's the 110-150-240. There are doubtless a couple of others. Clearly, you fit in the first group however.

I would go for the Sironar-S 135mm. I have the 150mm version, and it's just amazing. Small, light, razor sharp, excellent for both infinity landscapes and macro flower work.

But really any of the ones you name should be fine. Keep an eye on the used markets - this is a popular size and finding a used one shouldn't be that big a problem IMHO. Depending on how patient you are of course.

Bill_1856
15-Jul-2006, 08:02
"If you don't know what you need, then you don't need it."

Ted Harris
15-Jul-2006, 08:06
Assuming the budget will permit I'd recommend an Apo Sironar S 135. Small and lightweight, superb performance and a lens that many consider their standard lens. I would also consider a Super Symmar 110 XL but now we are getting very pricy. If I could only carry one lens and was shooting 4x5 it would be one of those two. Weight and size not being a consideration it would be the 110 otherwise the 135.

Eric Leppanen
15-Jul-2006, 11:09
I also would go with the 135 APO Sironar S. The Sironar S series with its ED glass has a general reputation for being the "best" of the modern plasmats (at least until Schneider introduced its latest APO Symmar L lenses, which do not support a 135mm focal length); it provides a nice, dramatic contrasty look without being too harsh; it does an excellent job of retaining sharpness at the edge of the image circle, and has bokeh that many find quite pleasing. The Sironar S is smaller and lighter than the Fuji. The Nikkor W, APO Symmar and APO Sironar N (and their Caltar equivalents) have their adherents and would be cheaper than the Sironar S, but these lenses are no longer in production and have smaller image circles. I am not aware of a 135mm G-Claron (to my knowledge the 150mm was the shortest focal length made); this lens has also been discontinued, is only single-coated (probably not a big deal unless you shoot at or near the sun), and in any event I think a 135 better fits your lens lineup (90-135-210).

APO Sironar S lenses do not show up often (or remain for sale long) on the used market, and sell for a high fraction of their new price. This says a lot about their perceived value.

John Kasaian
15-Jul-2006, 21:10
But...but what is it thats wrong with the lenses you already have?

JW Dewdney
15-Jul-2006, 23:05
If the lenses are built correctly (Fuji and Schneider and Nikon all appear to be consistant in this regard) then you won't be able to tell the difference between them in the real world. I should modify this; I couldn't tell the difference between them. When it takes 160x magnification to show they are largely equal, then they are largely equal to me. :) :)

I would agree with Chris. But, by extension, you also probably won't be able to tell the difference between the new lens and your existing one. Seriously. Just remember these words years down the road. Why don't you ask them for FILM? Forget about the equipment and invest in your progress as a photographer...! A new lens won't do that for you - especially not in this case.

Michael Heald
16-Jul-2006, 04:58
Hello! Thank you for the feedback. I'll keep and eye out for these 135mms. I find I use the 90mm more in my photos than the 210mm.

I plan on keeping my 210mm and 90mm lenses. The reason I was thinking of a 135-150mm is that I've had several situations where the lens would have worked, but I didn't have one. I made a mistake - the 210mm is actually uncoated. I'm not sure if the Caltar II is single coated of multi-coated - it doesn't say on the lens. I've had a couple of situations that flare was pronounced after I developed the negative and I misjudged on teh ground glass.

So, I thought if a 135mm would be helpful for some situations that I'm encountering, I'd like to spend a little more and get a modern multi-coated variety that (hopefully) promises to reduce flare and provide extra performance when I am in exacting situations. Thanks again and best regards.

Mike

Jack Flesher
16-Jul-2006, 07:31
If you are buying new, you simply cannot go wrong with 135 or 150 Rodenstock APO S or Schneider APO L lenses. IMO the biggest advantage to these lenses is they generally hold sharpness further out in the image circle -- IOW if you use a lot of movement in your compositions these may provide better resolution near the edges of your frame.

That said, almost any relatively modern plasmat from Fuji, Nikkor, Schneider or Rodenstock will be very good -- as will many of the older Tessars -- and even more so if you don't use extended movemnts.

FWIW, resale value on the APO S and APO L are excellent as is the ease of re-selling them, -- but then you won't pay nearly as much to begin with for one of the older lenses.

Cheers,

Eric Leppanen
16-Jul-2006, 11:19
...the 210mm is actually uncoated...I've had a couple of situations that flare was pronounced after I developed the negative and I misjudged on the ground glass.

There is a significant difference in flare performance between uncoated and single-coated lenses, more so than between single-coated and multi-coated. Rather than ante up for a top-of-the-line 135mm APO Sironar S, perhaps you'd get the best "bang for your buck" by purchasing a "second-tier" (but still quite good) multi-coated 135mm lens (Fuji, APO Symmar, APO Sironar N), and use the savings to finance an upgrade of your 210mm to a single or multi-coated model.

For example, a new or used 135mm APO Sironar S will cost you around $825 or $650, respectively. In comparison, I would reckon you could get a good used multi-coated 135mm plasmat for around $400, and Midwest Photo Exchange currently has a used 9+ 210mm Caltar II-N (APO Sironar N, presumably multi-coated) for $299. If you don't want to bother selling your current 210mm, Midwest could give you credit for it as a trade-in. You could always upgrade the 135mm down the road if you have the inclination.

Just a thought...

Michael Heald
26-Jul-2006, 15:50
Hello! After considering what I shoot, I've decided to trade in my uncoated 210 Ilex-Calumet-Caltar for a 210mm Sironar N. If I consistently find a hole in my shooting focal lengths, then I'll get teh 135mm. Best regards.

Mike