Platinum/Palladium problems with Malde-Ware Methodology - Urgent help needed

[PatrickMarq]

For my upcoming exposition I have chosen for 25 Platinum-Palladium prints.
The sizes are 30x30cm and 30x40cm.
As these size are to large for me to make this at home, I have rented a darkroom for 4 days, friday is my last day.
They have an ‘standerized’ process, from digital negative to the actual print, but they use Malde-Ware Methodology 3, 50-50 Platinum-Palladium Neutral Tones
and not from Bostic & Sullivan what i’m use at home.
On the darkroom advice I have ordered 50ml for all prints.

Today was a bit of a complete disaster, from the 5 prints only 3 are acceptable.
Everything below 30% is gone on the two first prints.

So this is my flow there:
A new Kobayashi 4” brush place it in water, and gently remove excess water
Paper Arches Platine 310gr
Pour 2,5ml of Malde-Ware on the paper and use the brush to cover the 30x30cm area.
8 min expose under a professional UV light.
All according to there process.
—-

The prints that are acceptable there I have changed the exposure time to 10min, but i’m getting in trouble with the blacks.

My impression is that I need more solution but as I don’t know the product this will take to much time and money.
Does anyone here have some knowledge of Malde-Ware or some tips ?

Using a test strip won’t change anything because I think it’s the volume that I need to use. The paper is not deep yellow after applying the 2,5 ml.

[Alan9940]

I only have experience with Methodology 1 50-50 mix, but I doubt Methodology 3 would be all that different. If it's any help at all, these are the steps I follow:

1. Pre-coat hydration at 70-80% relative humidity for about 5 mins

2. Mix sensitizer (sounds like you're using the pre-mixed stuff from Cone which is what I use). I say mix here because I add Tween and Glycerin, depending on the paper being coated.

3. I coat with a rod, but your 2.5ml sounds about right when using a brush for the print size you're making.

4. Air dry for 5 mins in the dark.

5. Hydrate coated paper for 1 - 2 hours at about 74% relative humidity. I don't think the timing here is critical, but I've never gone over 2 hours.

6. Load printing frame and expose. I use a single layer of a cut up ZipLock bag between the paper and the back of the printing frame to minimize moisture wicking from the paper as it's exposed.

7. I do a post-exposure hydration for about 2 - 3 mins, but this is optional.

8. Clear in 1st bath of Disodium EDTA for 10 mins.

9. Rinse in fresh water for 30 seconds.

10. Clear in 2nd bath of Sodium Sulfite for 15 mins. This bath is used for only a couple of prints, then a fresh bath is made.

11. Rinse in fresh water for 30 seconds.

12. Clear in 3rd bath of Tetrasodium EDTA for 15 mins.

13. Wash for about 30 mins.

14. Drain and dry.

The color of the coated paper before exposure is a very light yellow, as you describe above. It's very different looking from "normal" developing out pt/pd mix after coating (this being a much darker yellow color.) It wouldn't help for me to give you my exposure times because we're using different papers, different negative generation, different light source, etc. I would high recommend making some small prints until you get everything locked in. Don't forget that with this process you can open one side of the frame and see how it's going. If the print is too light, close the frame and stick it back under the burner for a couple of minutes. It will take a bit of experience to judge proper exposure before clearing because the image is yellow(ish) before clearing, and the whites will change a bit if you do the post-exposure hydration.

Hope something I said here helps. Good luck!

[Alan9940]

Just looked up the Arches Platine recommendation in the "bible" and, no Tween but he states 0.05ml of Glycerin 15% per 1.5ml of sensitizer.

[tgtaylor]

Partick, I have not printed pt/pd but have printed beaucoup salt, kallitype, etc. using a cheap ($2) Chinese hake brushes that buy from Blick's. I once tried dipping the brush in DW and squeezing it out but that didn't work as I reasoned at the time that the bristles retained enough water to throw the sensitizer off. So I first dip the bristles in the sensitizer to allow them to saturate and then apply the coating by first going horizontally across the page to the bottom, re-saturating the bristols and going horizontally up, re-saturating going back down and then backup horizontally and then re-saturating and coating vertically down from right to left, re-saturating and back vertically, re-saturating and then on a diagonal starting from one corner and then from another corner. Finally horizontally up and down until the paper takes on a waxy-like sheen which tells you that the paper is properly coated. This method uses more sensitizer but if you get a bad print it wont be from a lack thereof. Always check for Hake hairs: they are easier to remove while the sensitizer is moist.

[PatrickMarq]

I only have experience with Methodology 1 50-50 mix, but I doubt Methodology 3 would be all that different. If it's any help at all, these are the steps I follow:

1. Pre-coat hydration at 70-80% relative humidity for about 5 mins

— I have not done that there, but always do that at home

2. Mix sensitizer (sounds like you're using the pre-mixed stuff from Cone which is what I use). I say mix here because I add Tween and Glycerin, depending on the paper being coated.
— No Glycerin, not sure if I can find this on time.

3. I coat with a rod, but your 2.5ml sounds about right when using a brush for the print size you're making.
— This was my idea for tomorrow, to be honest never liked the whole rod thing.

4. Air dry for 5 mins in the dark.

5. Hydrate coated paper for 1 - 2 hours at about 74% relative humidity. I don't think the timing here is critical, but I've never gone over 2 hours.
— There is a box there for doing this.

6. Load printing frame and expose. I use a single layer of a cut up ZipLock bag between the paper and the back of the printing frame to minimize moisture wicking from the paper as it's exposed.
— It’s a huge UV machine from a printing shop that also do vacuuming.

7. I do a post-exposure hydration for about 2 - 3 mins, but this is optional.

—Steps 8 - 14 I have followed

8. Clear in 1st bath of Disodium EDTA for 10 mins.

9. Rinse in fresh water for 30 seconds.

10. Clear in 2nd bath of Sodium Sulfite for 15 mins. This bath is used for only a couple of prints, then a fresh bath is made.

11. Rinse in fresh water for 30 seconds.

12. Clear in 3rd bath of Tetrasodium EDTA for 15 mins.

13. Wash for about 30 mins.

14. Drain and dry.

The color of the coated paper before exposure is a very light yellow, as you describe above. It's very different looking from "normal" developing out pt/pd mix after coating (this being a much darker yellow color.)
— this is quite helpfull about the color.

It wouldn't help for me to give you my exposure times because we're using different papers, different negative generation, different light source, etc. I would high recommend making some small prints until you get everything locked in. Don't forget that with this process you can open one side of the frame and see how it's going. If the print is too light, close the frame and stick it back under the burner for a couple of minutes.
— Yes, I could take my own frame with me to test this. Just coat a large pice of paper with the 2,5 ml and expose some test strips.
— I have today taped the negative onto the paper, and so added 2 more minutes to a exposure.

It will take a bit of experience to judge proper exposure before clearing because the image is yellow(ish) before clearing, and the whites will change a bit if you do the post-exposure hydration.

Hope something I said here helps. Good luck!

This was a great help Alan, especially with the hydration.

[PatrickMarq]

Partick, I have not printed pt/pd but have printed beaucoup salt, kallitype, etc. using a cheap ($2) Chinese hake brushes that buy from Blick's. I once tried dipping the brush in DW and squeezing it out but that didn't work as I reasoned at the time that the bristles retained enough water to throw the sensitizer off. So I first dip the bristles in the sensitizer to allow them to saturate and then apply the coating by first going horizontally across the page to the bottom, re-saturating the bristols and going horizontally up, re-saturating going back down and then backup horizontally and then re-saturating and coating vertically down from right to left, re-saturating and back vertically, re-saturating and then on a diagonal starting from one corner and then from another corner. Finally horizontally up and down until the paper takes on a waxy-like sheen which tells you that the paper is properly coated. This method uses more sensitizer but if you get a bad print it wont be from a lack thereof. Always check for Hake hairs: they are easier to remove while the sensitizer is moist.

Thomas,
You have quite good described what I have seen. With the first paper I have dipped the brush into the solution and I saw at the end some waxy-like sheen.
As this was a new (larger) brush I thought this was from something on the hairs and put the brush several times in the water.
Probably ending up to much saturated.
My movement are exactly as you do.

Again a great advice.

[tgtaylor]

Patrick you probably already do this but to clarify I make a complete pass with the brush before re-sensitizing. For example, the sensitizer is usually depleted about 2/3's of the way down on the first pass but I continue it to the end before re-sensitizing. That way I reason that I am laying down an even coat. Keep re-sensitizing until the paper looks "wet" and then coat without re-sensitizing until the paper taken on that waxy sheen. Once that sheen appears you risk brush marks by continuing. I use 1 drop of 5% Tween for each print.

[PatrickMarq]

I have tried to look this up, but what is Tween ?
I’m from Belgium so I have no clue

https://www.labshop.nl/tween-20-polysorbaat-20/


perhaps ?

[PatrickMarq]

Patrick you probably already do this but to clarify I make a complete pass with the brush before re-sensitizing. For example, the sensitizer is usually depleted about 2/3's of the way down on the first pass but I continue it to the end before re-sensitizing. That way I reason that I am laying down an even coat. Keep re-sensitizing until the paper looks "wet" and then coat without re-sensitizing until the paper taken on that waxy sheen. Once that sheen appears you risk brush marks by continuing. I use 1 drop of 5% Tween for each print.
I have see this happening, the brush marks. I don’t see this with Bostic & Sullivan pt/pd

[Alan9940]

I have tried to look this up, but what is Tween ?
I’m from Belgium so I have no clue

https://www.labshop.nl/tween-20-polysorbaat-20/


perhaps ?

Yes. Polysorbate 20

[PatrickMarq]

Alan & Thomas,

Some feedback on the prints that I have made today.
- I switched over to a rod
- Did hydrate the paper
- Followed my gut, and used not the recommendation of the darkroom and increased the exposure time from 8min to 10 or 11min

All prints (7) were successful today.

Almost halfway but I need to buy one bottle of Maldeware, hopefully it will not take along time. Because the end of the school year here is coming and then the darkroom will be complete occupied for weeks.

Again thank you both

[tgtaylor]

Alan is correct about not using tween with Arches paper: https://www.bostick-sullivan.com/product/tween-20-10-sol-25-ml/ Currently I use Hahn Platinum Rag and use a little less than 1 teaspoon (<15mL) of sensitizer per 8x10 print. The Relative Humidity does make a difference and I wont print unless it is above 50%. However I live inland about 20 miles from the seashore where the RH is routinely above 50%. Right now it's 56%.

[Alan9940]

Alan & Thomas,

Some feedback on the prints that I have made today.
- I switched over to a rod
- Did hydrate the paper
- Followed my gut, and used not the recommendation of the darkroom and increased the exposure time from 8min to 10 or 11min

All prints (7) were successful today.

Almost halfway but I need to buy one bottle of Maldeware, hopefully it will not take along time. Because the end of the school year here is coming and then the darkroom will be complete occupied for weeks.

Again thank you both

Great to hear! Glad we could help.

[PatrickMarq]

I’ll think when all this is over i’m going to build a larger UV box.
Being self sustaining would make everything more efficient, everyone has his own way of working and switching over to something you don’t know causes a lot of stress and problems.

I have put some images on my facebook page when working in the darkroom: https://www.facebook.com/AnalogeFotografie