View Full Version : Paper for Paper Negatives

Michael Heald
11-Jun-2006, 14:55
Hello! As I try out my 16x20 26 1/2 inch focal length f128 hyperfocal camera, I'll start with VC paper. Negatives cost $10 to $30 a sheet, so I may shoot paper negatives frequently.

Can anyone tell me what brands of VC paper have a blank back, that is, without logos?

I'm interested in trying chromogenic B&W as a negative as well. I only see Oriental Hyper Seagull for this. Are there any other chromogenic B&W brands out there? Does anyone know if there is a logo or other printing on the back of Hyper Seagull?

Anyone have the same information for color papers? Thank you and best regards.


Donald Qualls
12-Jun-2006, 15:56
Michael, if you want to try something in between paper and "conventional" films, both in speed (typical ISO equivalents 25 to 50) and in price, you might look at x-ray films. They come in pretty large sizes, several of them standard LF formats (probably because the X-ray folk started using film after our formats were standardized, and just used what holders they could get before their market outstripped ours); they're not much more expensive than paper, and at least some varieties are orthochomatic without getting weird contrast effects from color subject matter on VC paper. Develop by inspection under red safelight, using Dektol or what have you.

For color, with the right filter pack it's supposed to be possible to reverse RA-4 papers to obtain a direct positive. You'd develop in a B&W developer first, then fog either with white light or chemical foggant, before processing in the regular RA-4 chemistry. The bleach-fix will remove the first developer image along with the silver portion of the color developer image, but you'll get color where the first exposure *wasn't*. Don't know about color accuracy; you might see an effect similar to cross-processing E-6 in C-41 chemistry (substituting cyan for red, or vice versa, etc.).

I've heard of people using Ilfochrome in camera, but it's REALLY slow because all the dyes for max black are in the paper at exposure time...

Louie Powell
12-Jun-2006, 16:11
I may be mistaken (and I'm confident that if I am, someone will point out my error), but I believe that the papers that were known for markings on the reverse have all disappeared from the market. Agfa has disappeared entirely, and Kodak (who put logos on their RC paper but not fiber paper) has abandoned the monochrome paper market.

ronald lamarsh
12-Jun-2006, 19:09
As to using x-ray film. almost all of it is orthochromatic the big problem i see with it is that is has a blue base(don't know what it will do to VC paper curves haven't tried it) and anything other than Mammography film has emulsion on both sides for use with intensifying screens that emit a Grn/Blu light. Mammography film is available only up to 10x12.

Donald Qualls
13-Jun-2006, 18:19
Blue base doesn't seem to cause a problem with Fomapan 100 roll films -- I use a lot of 'em, 120 and recently 35 mm, and print about 99% on VC paper. And I thought I recalled seeing "half speed" films -- that'd be ISO 25 equivalent -- that had the emulsion on only one side also, as well as "high definition" films for industry, essentially the same as mammography film (needs the high resolution to show up tiny cracks etc.) in larger sizes. Haven't actually tried to buy any of them, though -- so far, I shoot only up to 4x5.

Tempting to wonder if one could find a way to either develop only one side, or else bleach one side or strip the emulsion from one side after processing -- if you develop or keep only the side toward the lens, the scatter from the first emulsion should be eliminated, though you'd still be using a film with little or no antihalation (OTOH, paper has no antihalation and a bright, diffusely reflective surface under the emulsion, and people dont' complain too loudly about halation and irradiation with paper negatives).