Horse and Mule Pack Trip from Sabrina to John Muir - interested?

[Ed K.]

Hello large format friends -

Sometimes I've pursued the ways of Wile E. Coyote, always trying to get the Road Runner somehow, be it with helicopters, odd cameras, car mounts or this time, mules! I'm at it again, and looking for some help...

As the snow is melting enough to allow the use of trails again ( soon at least ), it would be nice to get some serious gear up into the woods. While scouting last year, we met some outfitters who were willing to transport people and their gear up into the John Muir wilderness starting from the Lake Sabrina area high above Bishop, CA. They had friendly enough horses and mules that didn't seem too ornery.

If we can put together at least a few brave souls, it should be possible to create a group that can be "photographers only", or at least photographers plus people who know how to, and expect to, put up with photographers and their needs. If enough people can go, they will provide a cook as well as the usual wranglers. I'm considering an overnight trip, however even a day trip really early might be fun.

I'm not thinking of a workshop, or any kind of situation where I make money from participants. While certainly, a small amount of help between everyone might be available, there won't be any formal teachers or anything like that. I also can't take responsibility for people falling off mules or whatever - basically, I just wish to aggregate enough similarly interested folks who can put this together. I would like to arrange it so that if someone wants a photo, and perhaps even is willing to just stay somewhere while others move around the area, that could be done. In other words, getting some good photos should be considered to be important.

So - a bit of self-reliance, tolerance to higher altitudes, desire to make images, and willingness to get along with four legged critters are good.

If there are enough people who are serious about doing it - we'll get it done. Think of it - crisp clean alpine skies, streams, woods; no cars, no paved roads, no motorized vehicles; large format cameras - and nature to be had.

My team of two is definitely into doing this pretty soon here, so if anyone is interested, please let me know.

Now...back to your regular channel...

[Hugo Zhang]

Ed,

It's a very tempting idea. What is the date in your mind? Overnight camping? Cost?

Thanks.

[Ron Marshall]

Hi Ed, I am interested, could you give me some idea date and cost.

[Ed K.]

I will send each of you a private email if you don't mind, so that we can discuss the details. It seems that posting for the whole Internet is not approprate for security reasons.

Okay, Hugo - you can't accept emails, so I can't send you one. Send me an email for more details. Anyone else, feel free to email me on this subject, ok?

When we have enough people agreed on the plan, I'll post here to say that this trip is booked.

[Ed K.]

Update - June 3 2006

Okay - while nothing is certain, enough people have expressed tentative interest, and I have received a few emails. Instead of replying to everyone immediately, I will now make the necessary telephone calls to nail down the options. By Monday or Tuesday, I'll have the options. From there, I'll send out an email to those who have responded. I'll have a couple of general date ranges in mind, and a pretty full plan. This will make it easier to figure out who can or cannot do it.

Anyone else is free to write, and when you do, please tell me your available date ranges for June-July, along with your preference for a one day, an overnight, or longer. Also please let me know whether weekdays are possible or is you are up for a weekend only. This will help when I make tentative arrangements on Monday. I'm going to try to find the options that allow the optimal setup for all ( can't promise it ) - so your schedule window is important.

Stay tuned.

[Ralph Barker]

I'm confident that you realize, Ed, that those of us who can't participate in this excellent adventure will expect full photographic documentation of the trek, along with a summary of any horse tales told around any camp fire. :D

If it's whiskey for the men, and beer for the horses, what do the mules drink?

[Capocheny]

If it's whiskey for the men, and beer for the horses, what do the mules drink?

Ralph,

Too funny! :) The mules will be the smart ones drinking water since they're also going to be the ones doing all the work.. hauling all that gear! :)

Ed,

It sounds like a fascinating trip! Have fun! :)

Cheers

[Forrest Atkins]

As a follow up to my initial reply, am pretty open as to date, duration and can do weekdays. Thanks

[Ed K.]

Update

I have created an information site that has most every question answered that I can answer at this time. It will be updated during the week as more information comes in on specifics and as more people give me their input. I have proposed some initial date ranges and plans plus options and other information.

Everyone who emailed me should have received the link to it. If you did not, please email me again, ok? I noticed two messages that LFinfo told me about that were not in my LF inbox, so these were apparently lost somehow.

Now you other guys who can't come - I'm sure the mules will drink water, and I'm sure not giving them any beer! I do hope that we can have some snapshots together or perhaps a grand LF group shot with all the cameras. There is also an alternate mini-conference plan idea in the mix, where some of those who cannot do the high elevations might attend. I think it would be great to get a huge group portrait of "turn of the century" LF people and thier rigs!

As to campfire stories, who knows, but I sure hope that we don't rerun that scene from Blazing Saddles with the beans around the campfire!

And as a precaution, while I'm going to do everything I can to make this happen, it could be canceled at any time up to booking for a variety of reasons beyond my control.

Ok - there it is - a plan has been started, let's take it from there.

[Ed K.]

Information portal site upated, new information and preminary numbers. Please let me know as soon as you can if you are joining us or what your wishes are. A few specifics from you are needed at this time to get the final pricing and dates. Thanks much. The portal site will be updated nearly daily until finalized. Please check there as I won't post here about it after this. If you haven't received the portal site address or have not heard from me, please email me again. If just a few can afford the time and money - we're probably good to go.

[Ed K.]

Portal updated again - June 8th, 2006. Please read and respond. Have optimized trip and costs, as well as confirmed first "real" numbers and dates. Feedback needed. Hope you can make it.

[John Berry]

If it's whiskey for the men, and beer for the horses, what do the mules drink? Wine of course, fine vintage in a box.

[matthew blais]

Can you post the link to your "portal" Ed?
Thanks.

[Ed K.]

Hello Matthew,
I'm trying to limit it from a Google crawl, etc. and have it semi-private. I'm sending the link to you via email/private message.

[Ed K.]

NOTICE - POTENTIAL EXPEDITION MEMBERS!
Things are firming up. I need your votes on what you want, and you need to fill in the trip vote form right away so that reservations can be made. When you visit the portal, refresh your browser and look at all pages, because they have changed daily. Thanks to all who have sent good wishes, considered it, or decided to join us.

Changes have been made that should accomodate even modest budgets, especially if you end up walking in, camping with us, and then walking out.

I'm going to commit to plans no later than Thursday next week, and if there are enough certain members prior to that, then prior to that.

Again, thanks to all.

There WILL be an informal LF conference in Independence, CA later this year, probably September or early November. I will announce that soon, and I hope to see many LF cameras and people there for some fun shooting, good visiting and all that. That will be less complex by far!

[Ed K.]

Trip Closed. Wile E. Coyote misses the road runner again. Tune in next time for the reworked rocket shoes. Thanks to all who considered it and also thanks for kind words. Good light to you all, hope you get many great photos this year!

[Ed K.]

Well, we actually did go. It was a grueling little adventure. We ended up with one amazing photographer from this forum who managed to not only walk the distance we rode on muleback, but still have the stamina to shoot his LF camera at 11,200ft altitude, in a very agressive swarm of mosqutoes, thunderstorms with lightning, and soggy boots from stream crossings! True dedication, I tip my hat... hmm, well, I lost it during a lightning storm, to him.

The mules were terrrific, and highly recommended - a fantastic way to get up into the high country, plus very capable at fording streams, climbing very steep rocky trails and hauling gear. They effortlessly climbed stuff that whooped the rears of some hard core hikers, and the view from atop the mule was just grand.

More later, perhaps from the other photographer if he elects to show a photo or make comments.

While most parts of the trip were just plain miserable due to man eating insects, it was a rare adventure, and one that gives deeper appreciation to those who have done work in the great outdoors!

Attached photo - snapshot of our gear headed across one of many stream crossings on the way up to Moonlight Falls.

Another commandment to the "Crusing for Snaps" thread - thou shalt heed the weather report, bug reports, and believe what they say about thunderstorms, plus bring thy bug slaying armour!"

Hmmm, another commandment - "When traveling far afield, thou shalt eat thy Wheaties, bring less equipment than ever imagined possible, and be ready for anything"

The next adventure should be much improved, however I wouldn't have missed this one for anything.

[John Kasaian]

Ed K.,

It sounds like you guys had a blast! I wish I could have gone along but other obligations conspired against me. I'll bet the night sky was awesome! When I was in the mule business, we'd sleep out under a canopy of stars watching them spin around (in between checking on the stock if they became restless for some confound reason or other)

I'm sure everyonne who went brought back great memories to last a life time (especially if anyone ate beans at that elevation ;) )

Thanks for posting the thumbnail!

[Ralph Barker]

Sounds like a great trip, Ed. I'm sure I'm not the only one who is looking forward to seeing the results.

The third "person" from the front of the pack train looks like me. Pure coincidence, I'm sure. ;)

[Jeffrey Sipress]

I'd like to do this in the fall after the mosquitoes are gone. I know the area pretty well, having backpacked ther a few times.

[Ed K.]

Well, the memory of the trip seems to improve as my muscles ache and the welts gradually stop oozing!

For the very fit and enthusiastic, or those who can really psyche themselves into the ordeal every moment, great possibilities for LF photography exist in the high country. For many of the rest of us, just having energy left, and courage to endure non-stop insect attack and general discomfort is much more challenging than operating a camera - so much so, that it's easy to peak out of the tent in the morning, mumble something like "hmmm, a shot of a lifetime. I'll just go back to sleep now".

The sky at 11,200 feet was indeed awesome. It just doesn't get better, and I have not seen such a sky anywhere outdoors in many years. If one could pack an astrophotography rig up there, wait until just after a storm, and then shoot, I'm sure the results would be stunning.

I passed up many grand shots on the way up, being more interested in trying all of this out, getting to our destination in one piece, and making notes of how to improve the experience. This was plenty for me, as I learned a great deal.

For sure, a fall trip would not have as many bugs, and possibly less heat too - just those two factors alone would make a backcountry trip quite harmonious with photography. Or, for a shorter distance, early in spring, just walking, could work. I believe that Fall would be ideal. Anything but the mosquitoes and I’ll be the happiest darn packer / camper you ever met, able to meditate, enjoy the light, wait for the light and really get into it. With the bugs though…it might be a year or two before I’d want to try again!

To that end, I do believe that I will take another, much easier day ride mule trip, from McGee Meadows or so, and commission it as a photo trip with planned stops, sunup to sundown. Probably this Fall, just after the temps drop. That will allow larger format and comfort at the same time. When it really cools down, I would like to propose a desert get together for several people to bring their Jeeps / Trucks, etc. We could all enjoy some time out shooting, and still have the mobility of vehicles. If interested in any of these sorts of things, drop me a line, I'll put it together, ok? Whatever, I'm game for the trip again, up to Dingleberry or so instead of Hungry Packer, and in the Fall with ( fewer ) mosquitoes. That trip I could indeed walk down just fine from, and ride up with no issues. If anyone wants to do it, you have to start planning NOW for it, if you want a group. Again, drop a line.

We ended up using Bishop Pack Outfitters, which is run by Mike and Tess Morgan. Our main pack manager was Sheila. They were better than fantastic. Just good, honest, talented and amazing people who know how to get the job done, understand photographer’s needs, and bend over backwards to make it work out so that everyone has a super time of it. I can only give them my highest recommendation, gratitude and respect for their hard work. And while some people thought it was expensive, it was not. They earned every cent of their money and then some. Everything was just as agreed, and far beyond my expectations.

Some thoughts -

1. Whatever gear you have, you'll really do great if you pick one lens, one camera, a light support system, and color correction filters, because the light temp up there is really cold, about 8500k in the early morning. Keep it more simple than you could imagine normally.

2. If you don't need it, whatever it is - GPS and all that, just don't take it. A notebook, compass and a map works fine, really. The GPS does a great job of telling you what you already knew before you fired it up.

3. Bring a pocket cam, and shoot the heck out of it. Documenting the process is vital for future success, plus it can help judge the trick contrast of high mountain terrain.

4. Bring mosquito netting if you're near water. A two dollar net that goes over your face and around your head will be worth a million bucks when you're under attack. Sure, you can go at better times for bugs, as I will in the future, however you'll miss the snow, high water, and delicate mountain flowers. It's a tough call. If you've got what it takes, then it's worth it.

5. Pick your campsite in such a way that it really lets you get around without too many streams to ford, and consider staying at a lower elevation then walking up for day hikes. The lower elevation makes recovery from exertion easier, and is often less barren anyway. We all agreed that things would have been better overall if we only went about 3/4 of the distance up the mountain.

6. The finest luxury a group could have would be a set of satellite phones, so that people could split up more at times yet still communicate changing wishes and new discoveries.

7. If it’s snow melt time and lots of stream crossing areas, bring hiking boots AND rubber waterproof stream or tide shoes, and even consider fisherman's rubber shoes so that you can comfortably haul yourself and gear through water instead of climbing all around the water you want to cross. You can't imagine how much easier it might have been if we could have just walked through the water more often.

8. DEET - the scented kind from the grocery store ATTRACTS mosquitoes. The treatment for your clothes that lasts 6+ days works very well though.

9. Benadryl, the antihistamine allergy stuff, works GREAT at calming itches of bites, plus for most folks, it causes a bit of drowsiness, which makes sleeping easier. Regular pain relievers, such as the ones for headaches also help, while quieting muscle pains a lot. Bactine antiseptic wash, which seems to be dilute "Witch Hazel", is very soothing as a face wash before gold bond, which seems to be the best at making the bites less bothersome.

10. Drink water. Lots of it. Even when you’re not thirsty. What seems like altitude sickness is often dehydration ( be careful of altitude sickness too! ). I felt so much better each time I drank a bit more water. Heat and high elevation dry you out fast. If you avoid the dehydration, you’ll think more clearly and be more comfortable.

More later, I'm still recovering from a good adventure that whooped my ass!

Will try to develop some film today...

Attached, the area we camped in, just under Picture Peak, and another shot of the mules, this time climbing some of the steep steps that wind up into the mountains. Hikers stand aside in the light rain during a stream crossing. My partner, Sandy rides Napoleon, and I'm riding Luke. Luke was a really gentle and SMART mule, who let me know when to get ready for steep drop offs and ascents...

[Michael Graves]

That one horse's head has shown up twice now. You must have thought she was cute.

[Ed K.]

The horse's head - that's Luke's head, Luke is a mule, and it is merely a point of reference to help you have the view from atop a mule. Luke did think Sandy was cute though...

[Brian Vuillemenot]

Hi Ed,

Nice shots! Thanks for the flattering description of my photographic abilities at 11,000 feet- I am not worthy! The trip was quite an experience for me, and on the ride home last night all I could think about in my mind was planning my next trip to the High Sierra. I think the next time I would be more prepared to deal with working in such a challenging environment, with the altitude, thunderstorms, fatigue, and hordes of bloodsucking insects. Lugging aroung two cameras and 5 lenses was a bit much- next time, I think I'll settle on 1 camera and 2 lenses. I think I managed to get some nice panoramics, which I will post as soon as I get the film processed. It was definately a memorable trip- does life get any more exciting than wading waste deep in a freezing mountain stream holding a metal tripod in the air while lightning bolts strike all around you? Anyone out there up for a fall trip to the high country when the aspens are turning?

[Ed K.]

Results?

I did manage to get a few photos with my 4x5 using black and white film which will be very pleasing reminders of where we went. In addition, we have hundreds of photos suitable to document the people, place and experience - perhaps good for a little web site section, which may help others decide to trek into the wilds, and thus enjoy ( or endure ) the experience.

After checking my pictures against the list of topics listed on this board as cliche, I see that I can offer nothing to bring others pleasure by sharing my images here, as, for fun and the feeling of it, I made nothing but cliche images.

[Michael Graves]

Ah, don't worry about it Ed. Post away. For the vast majority of us, all we ever shoot are cliche'ed images. We can't all be Gary Winogrand or Wright Morris. (And Wright's Worke wasn't cliche'ed when he did it. Only after people like me came along and tried to redo it). I'd love to see some of your black and white work.

[John Kasaian]

Ed,

I'm convinced that cliche is mainly in the eyes of an imbittered beholder who seeks out subjects in order to ingraciously deem them to be cliche.

Something might be personally offensive and it is right to object on those grounds, but IMHO to object to somethimg because it can be identified with a genre is laughable---hence my post on that 'other' thread.

I doubt that anything having to do with mules can ever be considered a cliche---unless you happen to get kicked by one (and then we'll probably read about it in the papers!)