On Photography and Mountains

[Josh Z.]

Ignoring my previous opinions on blogs, I've made my own (http://practicalmotivation.blogspot.com/)... In a round about way the blog is about photography in general (actually practical motivation), and in the future will have some more photography related posts.

For now though, this post may be of interest to some: On Photography and Mountains (http://practicalmotivation.blogspot.com/2006/05/on-photography-and-mountains.html)

Let me know what you think. Hopefully this was the correct forum...

[Patrik Roseen]

Josh, I enjoyed reading your 'On photography and mountain'. It certainly reminded myself of times when I have done the same things, although not necessarily on a mountain. Here is one that might amuse somebody ;-)
One time I went out to shoot a castle and garden close to Stockholm in the evening. I set up my gear and waited for the right evening light. It got colder by the minute. The previous humidity in the air transformed into water and I was litteraly soaking wet as the garden was now filled with evening mist. Then a duck landed and stirred up the pond of water which I had planned to give some nice still reflections. The pond was inside a 'Do not enter-area'...so it did not take long for the guards to show up as I was trying to convince the duck to...(Well, I think you get the picture...)

The good thing with such an experience is that one learns to plan the 'photosession' in a better way...the bad thing is that it is easy to remind oneself of the sad experiences and change ones mind thinking "well do I really want to bring all my gear and end up dissapointed, I'll better wait a day or two". A combination of planning and risktaking might be fruitful. We will climb that mountain again - with success!

[Stephen Willard]

Carrying heavy packs is part of the game and having a good sense of humor can make it a little bit easier. Whenever possible, I will use my llamas to pack camera gear into remote areas.


http://www.stephenwillard.com/documents/photos/DSCN0089.jpg

A good packing llama can carry up to 100 pounds of gear, eat just about anything that can be found along the trail, and their legs are far less wobbly then humans.

[Scott Knowles]

Josh, beautiful country. I used to live in Phoenix (82-87) and visited friends and worked in the Flagstaff Area. Three miles (one way) for 2,400 feet is quite a steep hike, especially with a 50 lb pack and with a large point and shoot camera too. And all for a few photos. Such is the life of a LF photographer. Isn't that motivation enough?

I'm not sure I agree about blogs being on a series on a topic, many columnist aren't consistent in their subject, they look at life and events in the world in a general manner and write about that, and sometimes connecting threads most people don't often see. And many columnists turn their columns into book, reprinting columns over years or on specific topics over decades. I've started a weekly blog this month for that specific purpose, mostly short expressions as I work into retirement, for much of the same reason, motivation.

As I've seen from photo essays on photographers and their life's work, consistency is often seen in hindsight and rarely during the time of the work, so maybe it's best just to do, and see what happens down the road. Every photographer needs to have some themes to focus on, such as areas of interest or type of work, after that you just do the work.

Good column, I'll keep reading. I loved the country there, but I'll still take the Northwest.

--Scott--

PS. You won't get any sympathy from Pat O'Hara. Talking with him a few years ago at the Centennial Celebration of Mt. Rainier NP, I asked him how he carries so much equipment (LF and 35mm) into the backcountry for days, which is often up to 70 lbs for longer trips. He said you simply do what it takes to get the shot, if you can't, you won't get it. To him it's that simple.

[reellis67]

Truely, I was just talking to my wife about a llama. Really. No joke. I'm glad to see that someone is using them.

- Randy

[Donald Qualls]

From my (very, very limited) experience with llamas, their major drawbacks are the same as those of a horse, only less so (expense to house and feed, vetrinary costs, etc., but for a much smaller animal than even a rather compact horse), plus the fact they have a disposition not much better than that of a camel, which itself is one of the most unfriendly animals ever semi-domesticated by mankind. If you owned a horse as hard to get along with as the few llamas I've met, you'd happily shoot it and send the remains to a dog food factory.

If I'm giving llamas a bad rap (and I hope I am), they might be a viable option for folks who live in the country and have space for pasture/paddock, buildings for stabling, and the budget for feed and vetrinary care. Otherwise, folks with somewhat less space might consider a large dog as a pack animal -- they're a lot less "odd" relative to neighbors than a llama, cheaper to obtain as pups, only a little more expensive to feed, and while they carry a little less, they're a lot easier to get along with (though you probably won't wind up wearing their wool as you would with llamas and alpaca). And while a St. Bernard or Newfoundland will drool a bit, they *never* spit...

[MIke Sherck]

As much of a wimp as I am, I truely hate being defeated, especially when I'm losing to myself. I've been in situations before where I was so dog tired that even the effort of taking the camera out of the bag or pack was too much to consider and I've always regretted it later. I make myself go back, better prepared, better knowing what to expect and with a plan as to how to do it right this time. The sense of accomplishment from these returns is gratifying. I suppose that it all boils down to ego, one way or another, and I realize that I'm not God's gift to photography, but I do try to learn from my mistakes. I make plenty of goofs; I don't need to make them twice. Well, most of the time, anyway. Sometimes I can be a slow learner.

One thing I've learned with advancing age -- unless you're planning a wilderness trip, all off on your own for a few days, there's no excuse for a 50 lb. backpack. You've got too much stuff in there, or the stuff you have weighs too much. You ought to think about how you can lighten your load and then try it again. I'll bet the prints or transparencies you get will make it worthwhile.

mjs

[paulr]

"If I thought that the hike up had been murder, the hike back down was torture."

it's SO hard convincing people of this until they spend some real time in the hills with their too-real packs and knees.

[Scott Knowles]

Mike makes two excellent point and I can only differ on one. My photography is more of being there and images from that are extra to me. I do my best and enjoy the results, but it's more to me about the hiking and seeing, and then capturing images. That's each photographer's perspective, experience and choices.

I agree about the backpack. I try to keep mine to about 40 lbs. I prefer long day hikes, up to 8-12 miles round trip, so I don't need tents, stoves, etc., only the essential 10 and extra food and clothes with my camera equipment. I usually pick the photography I will do and choose the lens for that than carrying a variety for different interests. I may take them in the car and trade for different shorter trips or just walking off the highway.

Interesting thread.

[Mike H.]

Josh,

Been there, done that, in some of the same areas: Lockett's (?) Meadow, some of the hills around "The Cinders" by Sunset Crater and the areas around Wapatki (sp?) north of there. I've also tried to start a blog about some of my thoughts and motivations, too - but, I'm not sure that I'm putting the link in correctly. And, most of my subjects are closer to Phoenix. (Cost of gas, of course!) Let me know how crazy you think MY musings and ramblings are. Your's are helpful - hope mine are.

http://spaces.msn.com/ROCKpetroglyphROCK/PersonalSpace.aspx?_c11_BlogPart_blogpart=myspace&_c=BlogPart&_c02_owner=1

Motivation is only part of the problem, although it may be the main part. Knowledge and preparation make up the rest.

[Stephen Willard]

Donald, my experience with llamas has been just the opposite of yours. In the past 7 years I have spent about 21 months in remote areas of Colorado mountains with llamas and they have been absolutely amazing.

Good llamas which have been properly trained and correctly managed in the field can carry up to 100 pounds and they never complain. There have been times when I have had to look over my shoulder to see if my llamas were still there. They never tug on the lead rope. They can be stabled at a fraction of what it cost to stable a horse. They are very sure footed and can go anywhere you can and then some. The only place they will not go is across boulder and snow fields, and between two trees narrower then them with their packs and they know when that happens. Unlike horses they can eat the native vegetation with out getting sick so no special provisions are needed for them in the field, and they need very little water. You can trailer them with a small pickup or a small trailer. You do not big trucks with big horse trailers to haul llamas around.

In the past 7 years I have packed my llamas with about $20k of camera gear and they have never damaged a single item. I trust my llamas completely with my gear more than I trust my wife or my friends. There have been many times when we have marched through complex and risky situations, and I never even looked over my shoulder to see if they will do the right thing to get themselves and the camera gear through it wthout damaging any thing. I know they will do the right thing and if they cannot make it then they will stop and let me know. They have there job to do, and I have mine, and we have worked as a great team without incident for many years.

Of course, I have failed to mention that my llamas have become good friends and great companions over the years. They also have very keen eyes and they smell or hear danger coming before I can. There have been two times when they let me known about the arrival of mountains lions long before they arrived. And I cannot tell you how many times I have gone to get my llamas which were tethered in a near by field only to find that a whole herd of elk, deer, or big horn sheep have bedded down with them.

[Donald Qualls]

Well, clearly I need to get in with a better class of llamas. Maybe the ones I've met were being raised mainly for wool, not getting enough exercise, not getting enough variety in their diets, or even not getting enough companionship and attention from the humans in their lives. All I know is they were most unfriendly. Good to hear they weren't representative (or if they were, that the exceptions not only exist but are accessible).

[Patrik Roseen]

...Let me know how crazy you think MY musings and ramblings are. Your's are helpful - hope mine are.

http://spaces.msn.com/ROCKpetroglyphROCK/PersonalSpace.aspx?_c11_BlogPart_blogpart=myspace&_c=BlogPart&_c02_owner=1

Motivation is only part of the problem, although it may be the main part. Knowledge and preparation make up the rest.

Mike, I read your great 'blogs' also...I found the different eposides very amusing and thoughtful. What you say about the need to make LF photography easier is something I also recognize (even though I only do 4x5") ... motivation by having a clear target/deadline is also good as you say...not driving around searching for anything that might pop-up and coming home empty handed... So much good stuff out there on the web that we do not know about.

Josh and Mike, do you know of any published 'LF-photographer's blog links' on the web? (with or without llamas) Or what kind of search should one do to find yours and similar LF-blogs?

[Josh Z.]

The good thing with such an experience is that one learns to plan the 'photosession' in a better way...the bad thing is that it is easy to remind oneself of the sad experiences and change ones mind thinking "well do I really want to bring all my gear and end up dissapointed, I'll better wait a day or two". A combination of planning and risktaking might be fruitful.


How very true. I recognize that the post on its own seems to be negative. However, that wasn't what I took away from it. While overall the resulting photography that day was probably pretty bad (I don't have much hope for the 2 exposed negatives), the experience was not. I've found that the retelling of a photography trip, however small, is always a positive motivation for me to go out and do it again. Regardless of the outcome. That, in a nutshell, is probably the main reason I started that blog.




I'm not sure I agree about blogs being on a series on a topic, many columnist aren't consistent in their subject, they look at life and events in the world in a general manner and write about that, and sometimes connecting threads most people don't often see. And many columnists turn their columns into book, reprinting columns over years or on specific topics over decades. I've started a weekly blog this month for that specific purpose, mostly short expressions as I work into retirement, for much of the same reason, motivation.

As I've seen from photo essays on photographers and their life's work, consistency is often seen in hindsight and rarely during the time of the work, so maybe it's best just to do, and see what happens down the road. Every photographer needs to have some themes to focus on, such as areas of interest or type of work, after that you just do the work.


I agree and have always had trouble focusing my train of thought to stay on a single topic with a single conclusion. I think a lot of people are like that and it's my biggest gripe with the blog. Most blogs that you find turn into rants that cover everything and anything. I find that I easily slide into this trap.

The best blogs that I have read are generally on the same topic. By which I mean that they don't go about ranting about their terrible cell-phone one day, to praising their new toaster the next. At least without having some connecting thread. They might hate their cell-phone, and love their toaster, but both topics were connected by saying: the new fangled X QA best-practice helped the toaster succeed where the cell-phone has failed. That is, they had a purpose other then to vent. Venting is all fine and good, but now-a-days, if it isn't in a lighthearted 10 second segment of video, I don't generally want to pay any attention to it. I have enough random things that I could rant about.

I don't think I really explained that well-enough in my "First Post! (http://practicalmotivation.blogspot.com/2006/05/first-post.html)".



I've also tried to start a blog about some of my thoughts and motivations, too - but, I'm not sure that I'm putting the link in correctly. And, most of my subjects are closer to Phoenix. (Cost of gas, of course!) Let me know how crazy you think MY musings and ramblings are. Your's are helpful - hope mine are.


Excellent. I really enjoyed some of the articles you have there. If it is alright, I'll try to link to it ASAP.




Josh and Mike, do you know of any published 'LF-photographer's blog links' on the web? (with or without llamas) Or what kind of search should one do to find yours and similar LF-blogs?


Unfortunately, no. However, as I come across those that are well done, I will try to link to them.

[Keith S. Walklet]

Per some outfitters that my wife and I used for a llama trek a few years back, it costs less to feed one than it does a dog. They do need regular exercise to keep them primed for backcountry trips and horses tend to wig out when they encounter them on the trails. The are very light on the landscape, too. They pee about as much as a three-year-old child and their scat is like rabbit droppings. They browse on foliage much like a deer. I found them to have a wonderful disposition (mine hummed while it made its way up the trail). They walk behind you, looking over your shoulder and if they are going too fast, you just wave your hand in their face and they slow down. If they get tired, they just stop, providing a perfect excuse for the foot weary hiker to do the same. And they are amazingly compact. The outfitters used to travel with two in the back of their Volvo station wagon. They just kneel down in the back. Neat critters!

[Ralph Barker]

. . . The outfitters used to travel with two in the back of their Volvo station wagon. They just kneel down in the back. Neat critters!

I can imagine the looks he got, driving down the freeway. :eek:

[Mike H.]

Excellent. I really enjoyed some of the articles you have there. If it is alright, I'll try to link to it ASAP.

Josh, No problem. Don't think my blog has ever been "linked to" before. You may be the first. ;)

Patrik, I don't know of a photographers' blog database anywhere. Sorry. If you find one, let me know. Could be fun.

[Keith S. Walklet]

Apparently, the funniest looks that couple with the llamas in the Volvo got was when they pulled up to a park entrance booth and the llamas would stick their heads out the drivers window to see what was going on.

On the trip up the mountain, I saw a write up about a book, "Stumbling Upon Happiness" earlier this week, written by a Harvard researcher who has concluded that one's state of happiness is related to simple decision making. Haven't read it, but the notion that it is the decisions that you make or don't make that most affect your outlook on the world makes sense to me.

Those occasions where I hate myself for still hauling a 70 lb. pack up a mountain are usually the days where I made a poor decision to sleep in, or dawdle or somehow put off the "joy" of hiking up a mountain with a 70 lb. pack.

I don't usually regret having brought my 70 lbs. when I get there, but often question the wisdom in the midst of the physical exertion. I'm with Pat Ohara on this. Either you do it or you don't. But, you can usually make it a more enjoyable experience by making a series of good decisions rather than compounding the unpleasantness by suffering through a series of bad ones.

In the mean time lacking those loveable llamas, I still try to make it as easy on myself as I can, and hiking poles (which I initially scoffed at as something a salesperson would tell me I needed) have made my excursions not only doable, but much more enjoyable on the way up and down. Can't imagine life without my "four-wheel-drive."

[Mike H.]

... hiking poles (which I initially scoffed at as something a salesperson would tell me I needed) have made my excursions not only doable, but much more enjoyable on the way up and down. Can't imagine life without my "four-wheel-drive."

Keith, Right on with the hiking poles! I just went to them over the past two months. Started with one after seeing others using them and then went to two for twice the security. As I get older I find that I'm losing the fine sense of balance that I had when I was younger, and the poles steady me to no end as I'm going up or down steep slopes of rock scree or whatever else. I lost my balance and fell two or three times in the months prior to getting the poles. Once while balanced standing on top of a rock with my ARCA-SWISS and tripod. Managed to gently sit/lie down/fall backwards between some cactus and rocks without much more than a couple of scrapes and a few cactus spines in my arm. Unfortunately, I was feet up in the air, head down, on my back, lodged between several rocks and cactus with the camera on top of me. (Don't laugh. Please!) Took me almost 15 minutes to squiggle and squirm my way out of that position. 15 miles from the nearest civilization. And a full mile away from my jeep. Yep, I vote for poles.