lupex users - prefered paper developer?

[Chester McCheeserton]

Someone suggested neutol warmtone but that seems both hard to find and slightly toxic...I am printing in a bathroom that gets regular use....

Have people used lupex successfully with adox neutol eco? What is the best current version of selectol soft - that ideally is not powder or toxic?

I don't think I want to use amidol in my bathroom...currently for enlarging I use Moersch blue developer for ilford warmtone but my hunch is that since lupex is already blue/cool that I would find that combo too blue and that I should use a slightly warm developer.

Thanks for any advice in advance

[Duolab123]

I use Bromophen for everything. I used to use Dektol spiked with a little Selectol Soft. Back in the 80's when I was using Azo, I used Dektol. First I would try what you have. Toners are going to have a bigger impact on Lupex. MHOFWIW YMMV.

[Michael R]

Someone suggested neutol warmtone but that seems both hard to find and slightly toxic...I am printing in a bathroom that gets regular use....

Have people used lupex successfully with adox eco neutol eco? What is the best current version of selectol soft - that ideally is not powder or toxic?

I don't think I want to use amidol in my bathroom...currently for enlarging I use Moersch blue developer for ilford warmtone but my hunch is that since lupex is already blue/cool that I would find that combo too blue and that I should use a slightly warm developer.

Thanks for any advice in advance

I don’t think you will find Lupex to be an inherently blue/cool paper. I suggest trying basically any general purpose/neutral developer first. If on the other hand you prefer a cooler tone you might consider the Moersch SE-3 “cold” developer which is less cold/blue than the SE-6 you are currently using. I’d skip the amidol.

[Jason Greenberg Motamedi]

I have limited experience with Lupex (only about 50 sheets so far) but found that Ansco 130 worked well with it, and produced a relatively neutral tone.

[Chester McCheeserton]

Thank you, these are all useful suggestions.

[Sal Santamaura]

I don’t think you will find Lupex to be an inherently blue/cool paper...

The only developer I ever used with Lupex was ADOX's own MCC Developer. Results were remarkably neutral without toning. Unfortunately, It's currently out of stock at both Freestyle and FOTOIMPEX.


...you might consider the Moersch SE-3 “cold” developer which is less cold/blue than the SE-6 you are currently using...

While that one is still in stock at FOTOIMPEX, Freestyle doesn't carry it. More importantly, it no longer appears on the Moersch Web site. I'm not sure if it'll be available going forward.

[Michael R]

Sal,

Thanks for correcting regarding SE3. I should have checked that first (it’s been years since I tried that developer).

[revdoc]

Someone suggested neutol warmtone but that seems both hard to find and slightly toxic...I am printing in a bathroom that gets regular use....



Just on the toxicity of Neutol WA, it seems to be all down to hydroquinone, which is present in almost every print developer. (The only other component listed in the MSDS is tetrasodium EDTA, which is also fairly common.)

I believe the least toxic print developers are ascorbate/phenidone based. To some extent, they can be altered to get warmer tones. E.g., I use E-72, which warms up a lot with additional bromide. I haven't tried it with Lupex, but it might be worth looking into if toxicity is of concern.

[jnantz]

I've never used Lupex or it's father, Lodima but I've used a ton of Azo, their grandfather... Be aware if it is similar to that silver chloride paper, it might have a green tinge to it if developed in Dektol/D72 or even Ansco130. A slight dip in selenium toner will help eradicate it. I never used Amidol or the other developers mentioned, only Ansco 130 and it worked great. Don't forget the light has to be like 300 watts.
Good luck with your printing !
John

[Chester McCheeserton]

I've done 3 sessions now with Ansco (PF) 130 mixed 1 to 1 with fresh Lupex. Curious what other's doing this combo have done for a development time.
I've been going one minute mostly. but sometimes pulling it at 45 or even 30 sec when flashing alone won't give me the contrast reduction I need.

Selenium 1 to 30 for 3 minutes seemed to get rid of a bit more of the green cast than selenium 1:40 for 2 minutes.

Normally I do 3 minutes with moersch blue developer and ilford warmtone.

[Alan9940]

I usually use Amidol, but found Ansco 130 was pretty good, too. You may find the inherent contrast of Lupex to much for your taste; a couple of soft working developers are Ansco 120 and Defender 59-D. Both of these will require mixing on your own from raw chemicals. Sorry, I don't know of any commercially available products, but I'd take a look at Photo Formulary, if you want something packaged. They carry a lot of different developers.

[Mark Sampson]

PF sells a version of the old Kodak Selectol-Soft as well as their take on Ansco 120, both low-contrast developers.
I've used their Ansco 120, back in the days of graded papers, alongside a tray of Dektol, in order to fine-tune contrast. David Vestal, who taught this method, thought A-120 lasted longer in the tray than Selectol-Soft.
They also sell a developer for Lodima contact paper (same as Lupex), that is a recipe by the late Michael A. Smith and Paula Chamlee.

[Chester McCheeserton]

Thanks Alan and Mark. I have a pack of PF selectol soft but haven't mixed it yet. I didn't know they also had a lodima developer.
Hoping to avoid having to have two trays of developer going at one time, but maybe I'm just intimidated.

am also trying the gels that someone else posted at the bottom of this thread (https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/archive/index.php/t-145989.html) (they just arrived today)

But I was mainly curious if people think yanking a lupex/lodima print out of ansco 130 at 30-45 seconds is a super bad idea...

[Alan9940]

I haven't looked at PF, but I gotta believe their "Lodima developer" is MAS's Amidol mix he used for Azo, and then Lodima. If you're pulling a print in 30-45 secs to control contrast, I'd recommend using a water bath (see MAS website) or SLIMT (do a Google search and you can read up on this technique.)

[jnantz]

I've done 3 sessions now with Ansco (PF) 130 mixed 1 to 1 with fresh Lupex. Curious what other's doing this combo have done for a development time.
I've been going one minute mostly. but sometimes pulling it at 45 or even 30 sec when flashing alone won't give me the contrast reduction I need.

Selenium 1 to 30 for 3 minutes seemed to get rid of a bit more of the green cast than selenium 1:40 for 2 minutes.

Normally I do 3 minutes with moersch blue developer and ilford warmtone.

have you tried the developer 1:2 ? I've never used 1:1. Like what Mark suggested I'd do a double bath of developer, I've never done it with the a120, sounds perfect though. I done what he describes with caffenol c tablespoon measures, and a shake of the ansco 130 in there and go back and forth between the ansco 130 1:2 and caf130, works great with everything, even regular paper negatives. sometimes the caffenol takes care of the green tinge I mentioned too .. some people like pulling prints early ( even if it isnt lodima &c ) they like the results. if you like the results, I wouldn't worry about it.

[Chester McCheeserton]

have you tried the developer 1:2 ? I've never used 1:1. Like what Mark suggested I'd do a double bath of developer, I've never done it with the a120, sounds perfect though. I done what he describes with caffenol c tablespoon measures, and a shake of the ansco 130 in there and go back and forth between the ansco 130 1:2 and caf130, works great with everything, even regular paper negatives. sometimes the caffenol takes care of the green tinge I mentioned too .. some people like pulling prints early ( even if it isnt lodima &c ) they like the results. if you like the results, I wouldn't worry about it.

I haven't tried it 1:2. I thought I heard or read somewhere that varying the dilution of 130 didn't actually change the contrast at all, but it's expensive and work to mix so I'm certainly open to making the stock solution last longer. Guess I need to experiment a little with more than one tray of developer. But Thanks, yea looking at them dry the ones I pulled early seem perfectly fine. Had to look up Caffenol...I'm prob going for a more neutral tone, you used this technique w lupex/lodima?

[Mark Sampson]

The two-developer method that I learned from David Vestal was to get in-between contrast grades on graded paper. If a Grade 3 paper provided a bit too much contrast with two minutes in Dektol, you would develop a print for one minute in A-120, and follow it with a minute in Dektol. (You could tweak this method until you lost your mind trying to tell successive prints apart.)
But it was useful when printing on Kodak Elite, Galerie, or the other graded pairs available then. I don't use that method anymore, as the VC papers i use don't need it.
Back on topic, I haven't printed on Lupex or Lodima so I don't know how such a method might work. I suppose michaelandpaula.com is still up, as I recall they had very specific ideas about how to get the best out of Azo and other contact papers.

[esearing]

I haven't tried it 1:2. I thought I heard or read somewhere that varying the dilution of 130 didn't actually change the contrast at all, but it's expensive and work to mix so I'm certainly open to making the stock solution last longer.

You can get the Formulary kit for 130 and it is not difficult to mix at all, nor expensive. I get about 2-2.5 years out of their 4 liter stock kit and print infrequently. I use it 1:2 most of the time with ilford FB papers and it has no color or contrast impact. Good blacks with Glossy MGFB and softer blacks on Warmtone and matte papers as expected but the middle tones is where it really shines.
I only use it 1:1 with Bergger papers. Works with Foma papers too and allows for selenium toning to get rid of the green cast.

In a pinch you can use it 1:10 to 1:15 as a film developer. time at 70*F is the same as the dilution 10 minutes for 1:10 (HP5 and FP4) (doesn't work well with bergger film).

I also have a batch that is 6 years old that I plan to experiment with as a paper staining redeveloper after bleaching. Its chocolatey brown now.

[jnantz]

I haven't tried it 1:2. I thought I heard or read somewhere that varying the dilution of 130 didn't actually change the contrast at all, but it's expensive and work to mix so I'm certainly open to making the stock solution last longer. Guess I need to experiment a little with more than one tray of developer. But Thanks, yea looking at them dry the ones I pulled early seem perfectly fine. Had to look up Caffenol...I'm prob going for a more neutral tone, you used this technique w lupex/lodima?

the caffenol won't stain your photographs brown like using coffee as a toner, it's not in there for longer than a min or 2, but it does work well as a developer for paper as a 2nd bath if you change your mind. I think it's probably the weak phenols and tannins in the coffee bath that make the green tinge less noticeable. I can't remember but I think some of the prints I included in the caffenol cookbook were made this way.


good luck with your printing !

ps. ansco130 might seem pricy but it doesnt' go bad. I used to mix 6 gallons at a time and use it for about 1 1/2 years as my primary developer (film and paper). sealed glass jug 1+ years old worked like new..