PyrocatHD no tan (?)

[zone]

Hello ...
i'm new user on PyrocatHD, i've developed two film 1 rollei rpx 400 and 1 fp4+ but i no see the tan, seems normal negative. I used 1:1:100; A and B in distille water and work solution with water from the tap. No stop bath (only water) and ATS fixer.
I expected a tan.

247100

[paulbarden]

I’ve found that the stain made by Pyrocat HD is far more subtle than the stain from PMK. sometimes, with some films, it’s so subtle that I’m not sure it’s there.

[Alan9940]

In addition to what Paul said, I've found that different film stocks reveal different levels of stain. For example, Fomapan 100 reveals a fairly strong stain color (for me) whereas Tri-X is barely noticeable. I would suggest comparing these negatives to the same film developed in a standard formula, like D-76. Do you see a difference?

[jp]

If you scan it as a B&W negative in color mode, you'll see a distinct blue shift that you have to correct out; blue being the negative of tan. It's subtle, but I think it's stronger in the invisible UV range.

[esearing]

4x5 FP4 shows a distinct brown/tan color. If your batch of Pyrocat HD is from a Formulary kit, ask them when it was assembled (code on the box) . Also depends how many near clear tones you have on your film. Phenidone failure is common if older than 2 years and it will first appear to have little to no stain , then turn pinkish tones just before it dies. The cachetol will continue to work but you will need longer process times. I now mix my own Pyrocat-Metol and get about 1 year of life out of part A.

[revdoc]

I usually get negs that look like that, too. There is a stain image, but it's very hard to see it if there's no general staining. If you have any rehal bleach, you can use it to remove the silver image, which will reveal the brown pyrocat component. (How do I know this? Because I've done it.)

I would add that for regular silver gelatin printing, I find the stain to be irrelevant, anyway. For me, the main benefits of pyro developers are sharpness and smaller grain. (Alt process printing is another matter.)

[interneg]

The 'stain' is really a coupler forming a dye via oxidation (and a not very good one at that). If there are higher levels of oxygen scavengers and the like in a coating structure, this will affect the amount of dye formed.

[zone]

I don't know, ived see more video on the net and alla have a good tan ...
The Pyrocat is home made
Maybe some substance in the tap water from society water supply because in the past i was problem with C41 processing (?) I can try to make a working solution with distilled water or other.

[esearing]

I don't know, ived see more video on the net and alla have a good tan ...
The Pyrocat is home made
Maybe some substance in the tap water from society water supply because in the past i was problem with C41 processing (?) I can try to make a working solution with distilled water or other.

Ah - something in your tap water acting as a mild bleach or oxygenator. things like chlorine and fluoride can vary from month to month in city water. Use distilled water for developers always and your stock will last longer on the shelf. The nice thing about Pyrocat-hd and variants is that it doesn't go bad quickly unless contaminated, it gives you warning signs with color changes.

[paulbarden]

I don't know, ived see more video on the net and alla have a good tan ...
The Pyrocat is home made
Maybe some substance in the tap water from society water supply because in the past i was problem with C41 processing (?) I can try to make a working solution with distilled water or other.

If you make Pyrocat from scratch, you MUST use distilled water. Tap water with mineral content will not work correctly. All developers should be made with very clean water.

[Andrew O'Neill]

Next time, try 1+1+50. That is how I prefer to develop HP5, to get more stain. Some films don't show much stain.

[Michael R]

If you want to evaluate stain visually it is best to use transmitted light through dense parts of the negative. Remember that stain is proportional to silver density so unless you’re getting a lot of fog it is normal not to see much colour in areas without a lot of developed silver.

I very much doubt anything was wrong with the process conditions based on what I can see in the picture, as the negatives appear to have developed properly. If either the Phenidone or catechol had failed the negatives wouldn’t look like they do. Given that, the only thing that would inhibit stain formation would be if you perhaps made a mistake mixing the formula and included too much bisulfite (sulfite), which would inhibit stain formation but not silver development.

[Drew Wiley]

Put your negs atop a reasonably bright light box and view them through a relatively strong blue filter. That will make the effect of any yellow-brown pyro stain more evident.
Different films do differ in the visual intensity of the effect, and in a fairly predictable manner. But even a seemingly modest amount of stain can have a distinct effect in how the highlights are rendered in print.

[zone]

Tap water is likely candidate. I tried with other water type and the tan is more consistent.



If you make Pyrocat from scratch, you MUST use distilled water. Tap water with mineral content will not work correctly. All developers should be made with very clean water.

I make stock solution always with distilled, the working solution is with tap water.

[paulbarden]

Tap water is likely candidate.
I make stock solution always with distilled, the working solution is with tap water.

Your working dilution of developer should also be made with clean, mineral-free water. If you know your tap water has a lot of mineral content that has interfered with C-41 processing then it’s potentially going to cause issues with B&W developers as well.

[roscoetuff-Skip Mersereau]

Next time, try 1+1+50. That is how I prefer to develop HP5, to get more stain. Some films don't show much stain.

Andrew: I'm curious what changes - if any - you're making to your HP5 working ISO or developing time when you run 1 + 1 + 50 this way?