Kodak Chemicals coming back under Photo Systems inc.

[John Brady]

I just read this announcement on John Sexton’s news letter. I would welcome the return of t-max rs!

On September 1, 2023 Photo Systems Inc. became the worldwide licensee for Kodak Professional chemistry. Prior to this time, Photo Systems Inc. manufactured photographic chemistry for Kodak Alaris, the film licensee that continues to operate today. Subsequently, when Kodak Alaris sold its chemical business to Sino Promise, we continued manufacturing chemistry for them.

In early 2023, Sino Promise decided to exit the chemistry business. This prompted us to begin the process of securing a licensing agreement directly from Eastman Kodak, enabling us to operate as both the licensee and manufacturer of Kodak Professional chemistry. We are pleased to announce that we recently successfully secured that agreement.

Currently, we are in the process of rebranding the products under the Kodak brand with Photo Systems Inc. as the licensee and manufacturer. Our plan is to reintroduce the entire range of black and white products by December 15, 2023, followed by the release of C-41, E-6, and RA-4 color products.

We are in the process of establishing a network of distributors worldwide and expect to begin exporting these products in the first quarter of 2024. The Kodak Professional chemicals brand has a long and rich history, and a reputation for excellent quality. It has garnered a dedicated and passionate following among analog photographic enthusiasts, and we are anticipating that the brand will be widely available in 2024.

[Tin Can]

Hard to trust KODAK

[Fred L]

now if they could bring back the syrupy HC 110, all will be better in the world, but that's dreaming I guess ;)

[Michael R]

Thanks for posting this. Just saw it in the latest John Sexton newsletter. That was nice to read. I only hope the demand is there,

[notorius]

now if they could bring back the syrupy HC 110, all will be better in the world, but that's dreaming I guess ;)

Well, according to the announcement Photo Systems Inc. manufactured chemistry for Kodak Alaris and Sino Promise respectively. The new HC-110 as well it seems...

[John Brady]

Thanks for posting this. Just saw it in the latest John Sexton newsletter. That was nice to read. I only hope the demand is there,

That's the bottom line, unless there is adequate demand this supply line will go away also. I plan to go back to many of the Kodak Chemicals as they become available, hopefully many others will too.

[Willie]

Is this the photo business equivalent of reintroducing the Yugo car as he Guyo?

[Michael R]

I decided to send Photo Systems a note suggesting it *might* be a good idea (I ain’t no ad man) to re-introduce the 1l packets for the powdered chemicals which went away more recently. Otherwise just speaking for myself I won’t be able to go back to Dektol or D-76. In my opinion one of the things Ilford as well as companies cloning Kodak powder chemicals have over the Kodak branded chemicals is 1l packs. Of course I could be out in left field but surely if I find gallons unwieldy there must be others similarly turned off.


That's the bottom line, unless there is adequate demand this supply line will go away also. I plan to go back to many of the Kodak Chemicals as they become available, hopefully many others will too.

[tundra]

From the current John Sexton newsletter quoting the new licensee for Kodak chems:


On September 1, 2023 Photo Systems Inc. became the worldwide licensee for Kodak Professional chemistry. Prior to this time, Photo Systems Inc. manufactured photographic chemistry for Kodak Alaris, the film licensee that continues to operate today. Subsequently, when Kodak Alaris sold its chemical business to Sino Promise, we continued manufacturing chemistry for them.


In early 2023, Sino Promise decided to exit the chemistry business. This prompted us to begin the process of securing a licensing agreement directly from Eastman Kodak, enabling us to operate as both the licensee and manufacturer of Kodak Professional chemistry. We are pleased to announce that we recently successfully secured that agreement.


Currently, we are in the process of rebranding the products under the Kodak brand with Photo Systems Inc. as the licensee and manufacturer. Our plan is to reintroduce the entire range of black and white products by December 15, 2023, followed by the release of C-41, E-6, and RA-4 color products.


We are in the process of establishing a network of distributors worldwide and expect to begin exporting these products in the first quarter of 2024. The Kodak Professional chemicals brand has a long and rich history, and a reputation for excellent quality. It has garnered a dedicated and passionate following among analog photographic enthusiasts, and we are anticipating that the brand will be widely available in 2024.

[linhofbiker]

Wonderful. Now the load of E6 in the freezer, including 135, 120/220, 4x5 and 8x10 will be happy again.

Why is the other thread so down on this news??

[Alan Klein]

Would this include XTOL?

[paulbarden]

Photo Systems Inc. manufactured photographic chemistry for Kodak Alaris, the film licensee that continues to operate today. Subsequently, when Kodak Alaris sold its chemical business to Sino Promise, we continued manufacturing chemistry for them.


What I take from the above statement is that Photo Systems Inc. was the entity responsible for manufacturing all of the bad chemistry sold under the Kodak brand a few years ago. Bad Dektol, bad D-76, bad Xtol - I bought 'em all. (and returned many packages of each to the retailer I got 'em from)

So, I have zero interest in finding out how well (or how poorly) Photo Systems Inc. produces this next iteration of chemistry under the Kodak name. I wouldn't trust them to get it right this time. I've been making my own developers for three years now, and I see no reason to go back to packaged chemistry. Not from "Kodak" anyway.

[Michael R]

Would this include XTOL?

Yes.

[Michael R]

Indeed that's kind of the elephant in the room - the announcement lifts the veil somewhat on who was making the Kodak-branded chemicals following Champion and Tetenal, which unfortunately seems to indicate Photo Systems Inc. was doing the work during which time we had the various service bulletins about XTOL, brown Dektol, HC-110 precipitates etc. So I'm kind of in the same boat as you, at least for now - ie I moved on.

The other thing is they'll need to re-establish some retailer relationships if they want more sales. The one physical darkroom retailer left where I live outright stopped carrying any Kodak-branded chemistry around 2020-2021, so there are certain Kodak-branded chemicals (a difficult to screw up chemical such as stop bath, for example) I simply can't purchase anymore - can't buy online due to shipping restrictions so brick-and-mortar would be the only option.

I really hope they have their sh*t together. There's a lot of ground to make up.


What I take from the above statement is that Photo Systems Inc. was the entity responsible for manufacturing all of the bad chemistry sold under the Kodak brand a few years ago. Bad Dektol, bad D-76, bad Xtol - I bought 'em all. (and returned many packages of each to the retailer I got 'em from)

So, I have zero interest in finding out how well (or how poorly) Photo Systems Inc. produces this next iteration of chemistry under the Kodak name. I wouldn't trust them to get it right this time. I've been making my own developers for three years now, and I see no reason to go back to packaged chemistry. Not from "Kodak" anyway.

[Neal Chaves]

now if they could bring back the syrupy HC 110, all will be better in the world, but that's dreaming I guess ;)

Just buy Ilfotec HC and use the same times and dilutions as for the original HC110. Not only will your results be the same, but you will gain some insight into how the branding game is played.

[Sal Santamaura]

What I take from the above statement is that Photo Systems Inc. was the entity responsible for manufacturing all of the bad chemistry sold under the Kodak brand a few years ago. Bad Dektol, bad D-76, bad Xtol - I bought 'em all. (and returned many packages of each to the retailer I got 'em from)...

Multiple threads on forums included images of the bad packets; all said "Made in Germany." I conclude PSI was not involved with those, and that Sino Promise transferred production to PSI as part of recovering from the problem.


I just read this announcement on John Sexton’s news letter. I would welcome the return of t-max rs!...

TMAX-RS does not appear to be among the products that, at least initially, will be offered:


https://kodak.photosys.com/collections/kodak-professional#col-sorting

[Oren Grad]

Threads merged.

[Michael Kadillak]

The cold hard reality as to what happened internally and externally with Kodak photographic Chemicals over the last few years (ie. the good, bad and ugly) is unadulterated speculation because were were not integrally involved in the business. We have zero clue as to where the ball got dropped. Similarly the decision to acquire the brand name (better to reboot fresh than keep the Kodak Name?) is also a wet finger in the air. All we in fact do know is there is a new offering for photographic chemistry coming with the Kodak name affixed to it. I strongly suspect that there will be a number of upbeat individuals that will be willing to put their unbridled optimism to the test in assessing the product first hand and we should be able to use these results to see if it passes muster. Yes, I am one of those individuals that mixes everything myself, but I respect others that would rather have all of the necessary ingredients compiled for them for a one stop iteration. Fingers crossed that this business venue exceeds all expectations.

[MikeH]

Fingers crossed that this business venue exceeds all expectations.

+1

[Bormental]

I am actually way more excited about the return of Kodak Flexicolor line of chemistry. There was never any shortage of B&W developers. PSI has always sold Xtol and HC-110 in their own packaging branded as LegacyPro. This announcement changes absolutely nothing. You simply get "Kodak" printed on the products that are already on the retail shelves. But losing Flexicolor was quite scary, because we are left with just a single source (!) of C-41 chemistry, and that's Fuji Hunt 5L kit. At least in the USA.

[JMO]

The one item I like/prefer to use has been Kodak Rapid Selenium Toner (KRST), so I hope Photo Systems will make that one available.

[brucetaylor]

Such great news. PSI has been supplying Freestyle with their Legacy Pro, Unicolor and Silver Pixel (RA4) chemistry for many years- I’ve never had trouble with any of the products. When the bad Dektol was out there I and many others were happily using the PSI equivalents with no problems, and when the Xtol supply dried up the Legacy Pro product worked just like the Kodak product. They’ve been in business 45 years and I think it bodes well for US users that they are located in Michigan.

[jk0592]

Like many, I moved away from Kodak chemicals in my darkroom. But I stayed with Kodak films, TMY, and to a lesser extent TXP. I did regret xtol and hc110 and might be tempted to use these film developers again. But I will stick with Ilford products for paper chemistry.

[Willie]

Such great news. PSI has been supplying Freestyle with their Legacy Pro, Unicolor and Silver Pixel (RA4) chemistry for many years- I’ve never had trouble with any of the products. When the bad Dektol was out there I and many others were happily using the PSI equivalents with no problems, and when the Xtol supply dried up the Legacy Pro product worked just like the Kodak product. They’ve been in business 45 years and I think it bodes well for US users that they are located in Michigan.

Please tell is that Jim Harbaugh and the Michigan Wolverines are not involved! Kodak has been cheating us on chemistry and Michigan on football sign stealing - now we'll be getting Black Dektol?

[j.e.simmons]

Wouldn't that be Big Blue Dektol?

[neil poulsen]

What I take from the above statement is that Photo Systems Inc. was the entity responsible for manufacturing all of the bad chemistry sold under the Kodak brand a few years ago. Bad Dektol, bad D-76, bad Xtol - I bought 'em all. (and returned many packages of each to the retailer I got 'em from)

So, I have zero interest in finding out how well (or how poorly) Photo Systems Inc. produces this next iteration of chemistry under the Kodak name. I wouldn't trust them to get it right this time. I've been making my own developers for three years now, and I see no reason to go back to packaged chemistry. Not from "Kodak" anyway.

Also what I was thinking. However, it's possible that they were under restrictions with previous licensees that Photo Systems might themselves be able to discard. (Hopefully?) Pure speculation, though.

Clearly, John Sexton is upbeat about this news. So, that's encouraging.

[Roger Cole]

Indeed that's kind of the elephant in the room - the announcement lifts the veil somewhat on who was making the Kodak-branded chemicals following Champion and Tetenal, which unfortunately seems to indicate Photo Systems Inc. was doing the work during which time we had the various service bulletins about XTOL, brown Dektol, HC-110 precipitates etc. So I'm kind of in the same boat as you, at least for now - ie I moved on.

The other thing is they'll need to re-establish some retailer relationships if they want more sales. The one physical darkroom retailer left where I live outright stopped carrying any Kodak-branded chemistry around 2020-2021, so there are certain Kodak-branded chemicals (a difficult to screw up chemical such as stop bath, for example) I simply can't purchase anymore - can't buy online due to shipping restrictions so brick-and-mortar would be the only option.

I really hope they have their sh*t together. There's a lot of ground to make up.

Huh. I can buy stop bath online. Different shipping restrictions in Canada? Not that I DO. Working with acetic acid stop bath will give me a sore throat in short order. I switched to citric acid based "odorless" stops years ago.

[Michael R]

Huh. I can buy stop bath online. Different shipping restrictions in Canada? Not that I DO. Working with acetic acid stop bath will give me a sore throat in short order. I switched to citric acid based "odorless" stops years ago.

Yeah B+H won't ship Kodak Indicator Stop bath to Canada. Freestyle has other restrictions like ground only, continental US etc.

Anyhow I've moved on. White vinegar diluted approx. 1+1 is working strength Kodak stop bath. "State of the art" would be Sprint's stop bath but I don't bother.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Good news. As long as they also keep putting out 4x5/8x10 film in color/transparency and bw, I will be happy.

Wish Acros would make its way back. I have 120 sheets of 4x5 in the freezer, I am afraid to use because it is the last of it.

[bob carnie]

Yeah B+H won't ship Kodak Indicator Stop bath to Canada. Freestyle has other restrictions like ground only, continental US etc.

Anyhow I've moved on. White vinegar diluted approx. 1+1 is working strength Kodak stop bath. "State of the art" would be Sprint's stop bath but I don't bother.

Hi Michael - you probably know Jacques at Argentix , he is fantastic and I buy a lot of my chemicals from him to mix scratch

[Michael R]

Hi Michael - you probably know Jacques at Argentix , he is fantastic and I buy a lot of my chemicals from him to mix scratch

Hi Bob - yeah I've bought a few bulk chems and other things from Jacques over the years. I actually got a bottle of Adox Rodinal from him earlier this year. He's a good guy.

For scratch mixing - in particular when I've needed more exotic/hard to get compounds - I've dealt a lot with Alphachem in Mississauga. Remember Nymoc? Well, after passing through several hands Alphachem took that business over. Anyhow not only do they have a huge catalog but they can procure virtually anything. Downside is they are not cheap, but then again I've only ordered small quantities of weirdo compounds from them so maybe the regular stuff would be reasonably priced.

[Renato Tonelli]

Up until Kodak still made B&W printing paper, everything I used was made by Kodak; now I'm down to Tri-X and two Kodak chemicals: Rapid Selenium and XTOL.
Everything else is from someone else, either cloned (Selector-Soft) or proprietary (Ethol LPD) or made from 'raw' chemicals (ANSCO 130, etc.); I expect LPD to disappear as not that many darkroom workers are using it.
But I'm OK with it.