Newbie: Glass Plate Finishing/Display options

[Drew Bedo]

I am working myself up to doing some vintage process imaging.

Starting this summer with a Petzval lens and a Rapid Rectilinear on my 8x10 Kodak 2D with sheet film. Then will get some Lane dry plates. Eventually I intend to go intodoing wet plate collodion.

I do not think I will be doing contact prints with salted paper or albumin. I am thinking to display the plates themselves.

My questions today: with a developed glass plate image in hand, what ways are there to finish it off? What will it look like with a mirror behind it? what will it look like with a black backingnd . . .or white? Should a dry plate be varnished as is done with wet plates?

I am also a littler at sea on matting and framing too.

[jnantz]

Drew,
You might consider contacting the Harry Ransom Center at the University of Texas
https://www.hrc.utexas.edu/
Ask to speak with someone in collections, they might be able to offer you some advice about how THEY present glass images,
and what they wouldn't recommend. ( they are well versed in glass images )
they may also be able to tell you about top coating the emulsion. sometimes the wet plate solutions don't work with dry plate.
they have the niepce heliograph so their curators and collections experts might be able to help you out.

good luck!
John

[Drew Bedo]

Thanks for that tip.

I was hoping for input from active wet plate photographers.

[jnantz]

Drew, dry plates sometime have "issues". ... ( disattachment and frill). the HRC has an extensive photography and photography conservation center, they might be able to give you a better idea than modern day wet plate photographer, seeing wet and dry plate really have nothing in common other than ... both being on glass plates..

Best of luck figuring out what to do...
John

[Tin Can]

also

the oval vignette was done to hide flaws on plates and became a fad

to maintain a plate close it

[Tin Can]

I posted some years ago showing small plates

TinType

Dry glass plate

Wet Plate

as examples of keepsake vest pocket loved ones

Our Civil War perhaps

[Drew Bedo]

Drew, the problem is that silver gelatin emulsion dry plates sometime have "issues". ... so conservation (treatment of plates with a top coat, making sure the gelatin stays attached to the plate and does not frill &c) might be a bit different. the HRC has an extensive photography and photography conservation center, they might be able to give you a better idea than modern day wet plate photographer, seeing wet and dry plate really have nothing in common other than ... both being on glass plates..

Best of luck figuring out what to do...
John

Thankyou, I understand your remarks regarding any topcoat.

What about the other parts of my question?

[jnantz]

Thankyou, I understand your remarks regarding any topcoat.

What about the other parts of my question?

they display glass and will be able to give you an answer on that as well.

good luck!

[Drew Bedo]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts on displaying glass plates.

Anyone else?

I have seen historic documentary glass plate images by Curtis that are backed with gold dust (not practical today!) that still look good. Others seemed to have a dark or black backing. What about a reflective background?

What techniques are effective for securely matting a glass plate?

[Tin Can]

Learn more by DIY

Practice makes perfect

I have a whole box of strangers

Now I own their souls

Foolish

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313&_nkw=old+glass+plate+photod&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_odkw=ULF+Camera&_osacat=0&_sop=10&LH_PrefLoc=2

[Daniel Unkefer]

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53008403359_00de298c5f_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2oLaVwX)Makiflex JLane 9x12 Glass Plate EI 1 Key Day (https://flic.kr/p/2oLaVwX) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

Jason Lane Dry Plate 9x12cm Makiflex Plate Adapter Makiflex Automatic Key Day Full Sun. Legacy Mic-X tray developed under safelight. I'm in the process of setting up a film digitizing setup Minolta SRT Copy Stand Minolta Bellows Minolta 100mm F4 MC Bellows Rokkor at F13.5. Sony Nex 7 with SRT Adapter.

[Drew Bedo]

Thankyou Daniel.

Now the question is . . .How will you mat, frame and display this image? Will it be box mounted and back-lit? Will it have a dark background? How will it be secured in matting materials and so on.

[BrianShaw]

Have you considered treating the neg like an ambrotype?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/explora/photography/features/historical-processes-ambrotypes-and-tintypes


Ambrotypes are extensions of the wet collodion process invented by Frederick Scott Archer, in 1848. While Archer was the first to experiment with the technique, the American James Ambrose Cutting patented refinements of the process, in 1854, attaching his name to the process. Sometimes called a collodion positive, an ambrotype is created by intentionally underexposing a glass negative and placing it against a darkened background. The light gray image recorded on the glass plate has the visual effect of a positive when viewed against a darkened back. This can take the form of fabric, paper, or even lacquer painted onto the uncoated side of the plate.

(there are many more online (and offline) resources on this topic... I just picked one somewhat randomly)

[Drew Bedo]

Ambrotype?

Ok, that means a blak=ck backing . . right?

Now, what is the way to mat it. That has to be different from a paper print as the plate is thick and heavy . . .wwhat works.?

[fatherdougal]

Ambrotype?

Ok, that means a blak=ck backing . . right?

Now, what is the way to mat it. That has to be different from a paper print as the plate is thick and heavy . . .wwhat works.?

You could either shoot it on clear glass with black backing or use a black substrate such as the black glass sold by J Lane. I know some people also paint clear glass plates if they are happy with their results.
To make a good positive gelatin dry plate (which I never managed to I should add) you would use another developer than what you would use for a regular negative. Some use HC110 with added ammonium thiocyanate while some use custom developers (such as Liranal #6).

The end results and the positive effect would differ based on a lot of things. The light it is being viewed in being one.

Looking at wet plate frames could serve as an inspiration. There are a lot of beautiful old ambrotype frames but they do seem pretty complex to diy. Some people use old broken film/plate holders and if you want a simple solution, mounting them on a simple board with silver wire could be an option as well, although you might want to test how well your hardened emulsion holds up. (this is one of my favourite examples of the framing of a wet plate picture https://youtu.be/64EDK3tIXuA )
The emulsion is, as far as I know, also pretty sensitive to environmental conditions which might steer you in one or another direction. Generally the storage guidelines for dry plates mention storage in boxes and sleeves which might not be very helpful but there are also some tips regarding the optimal temperature and humidity out there (there is also info on suitable pH levels for archival materials which might help in deciding on suitable backing materials).
I hope that this could be of some help!

[ethics_gradient]

I do wet plate collodion, and prefer to work in glass when feasible. Have done a fair bit of reading and some experimentation the last two years.

Clear glass ambrotypes were frequently backed with liquid asphaltum mixed with mineral spirits to make the image visible as a positive. If you do this on the collodion side, you are reversing the inverted image back around to the "right way", which definitely has an appeal, especially if there is any text in the image. It also creates a sense of depth to the image that I really like.

However, over time (depending on conditions, changes in temp/humidity exacerbate it) the differing rates of expansion and contraction between the asphaltum and the collodion will lead to cracking and deterioration of the image.

If you back the back/non-collodion side of the ambrotype with this same mixture, your image is stuck the "wrong way" around forever, but you don't have to worry about this kind of deterioration.

Some ambrotypes are simply backed with black velvet in their cases. I've also heard of photographers flipping the ambrotype the "right way around", backing it with a piece of blackened glass, and using balsam cement to join them together.

[Drew Bedo]

Ethics Gradient" Thanks for that real-world, experience based response. Some useful observations and suggestions there.

Fatheredougal: That video looks interesting. Looks like he is using mirror mounting clips to hold the glass in place.

[ethics_gradient]

Ethics Gradient" Thanks for that real-world, experience based response. Some useful observations and suggestions there.


No problem :) The suggestion of black glass is also a solid one, although it is quite dear compared to regular clear stuff from the framer's. I wound up ordering a bulk quantity from Alibaba during the pandemic as I couldn't find it for love or money here or Australia at the time; it's not *quite* as opaque as the expensive stuff... but was also not AUD$40/plate! It only makes sense for bigger quantities though (I did 40 plates each of 4x5 and 8x10), the shipping is killer.

[jnantz]

modern orotones are still being made ...
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?165072-Orotone-work-in-Dallas-on-32%94-x-38%94-dry-plates

Pierre Van de Vliert did/does things similar to what you are interested in
https://www.instagram.com/pierrevliert/

[Drew Bedo]

A lot of these respone are process oriented . . .and thank you for all of them.

What I am trying to ask for is how to actually mount and present whatever image has been made on glass. One example linked to in this thread was to make a sort of shadow box with the glass plate held to the backing board with the clips used to support a mirror. A good idea worth remembering.

So the question for all who are doing work with glass plates, wet or dry, is . . .how do you put it on the wall?

[CreationBear]

Drew—

Here’s a YT video that might give you ideas, especially if you like the “industrial” aesthetic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64EDK3tIXuA

For myself, the gent’s use of caming sparks a lot of ideas.