Contact Printing 11x14 film - paper and chemicals

[Joseph Kashi]

I am planning to branch out and make contact prints with my 11x14 whenever the university photo department returns the camera and lenses ( 250 WF, 300 Dagor, 12-19-23 Protar VII, and Nikkor 450 Q). Most of my more recent LF experience is with 5x7 Ilford Delta 100 developing in XTOL 1:2 and then scanned for digital printing.

Suggestions about personally used currently available contact print paper ( no POP or Platinum ) and chemicals would be very welcome. My current thought tends toward a classical approach: Adox Luper contact paper ( now that AZO's gone) developed in Photographer's Formulary Amidol or Ansco 130 developer, with the film probably Ilford FP4 11x14 developed in one of the more modern Pyro formulations.

Any experience-based thoughts and suggestions about materials, processes, and procedures would be appreciated.

Thank you.

[xkaes]

I can't tell for sure if you have done contact printing before or not. Can you clarify?

[Joseph Kashi]

I can't tell for sure if you have done contact printing before or not. Can you clarify?

I have done mostly enlargements in the past from 4x5 and 5x7 BW and color. Any prior contact prints were more in the nature of contact sheets/proof prints, not exhibit-grade contact prints from 11x14 negatives. I do not have any experience with contact papers like AZO/equivalents. I've mixed from scratch and have used Amidol and other less-common chemicals many years ago, but gave the large jars of all of those chemicals to the university photo department and so will be buying small-quantity commercial formulations.

[Michael R]

Adox Lupex would be the traditional option in the sense it is the only silver chloride paper around. What specifically makes it a contact paper is only that silver chloride emulsions are too slow to be practical for exposure under an enlarger. It is worth considering variable contrast enlarging papers, which are as good for contact printing as they are for enlarging. The benefit of Lupex is that it will be more responsive to different developers - including how image colour is affected, while VC enlarging papers give you more contrast control (especially since Lupex is only available in one grade).

FP4 is as good as anything else I guess (or you could continue with Delta 100) but given the small apertures you’ll be using on a camera that big I suggest something faster like HP5. I wouldn’t bother with pyro or catechol but if you’re set on that route the “modern” staining developers to consider would basically be Wimberley’s or PMK (pyro), and Pyrocat (catechol).

[Alan9940]

Adox Lupex is a beautiful paper, but you'll probably spend hours of time dialing in your preferred contrast level; it's about a grade 4 paper. Personally, I don't particularly like it in Ansco 130, but Amidol is really nice with it. But, again, Amidol is such a powerful developer that controlling contrast (at least, for me) requires water baths and/or SLIMT treatment.

As Michael R suggests, I would also recommend trying a selection of VC papers and move on to Lupex, if you feel the need. Good luck! I've lusted after 11x14 for many years, but just never pulled the plug and made a move.

[John Layton]

Might I also suggest...as a means to realize meaningful image color controls for VC enlarging papers - that you might try something like Ilford Multigrade Warmtone paper with a lineup of Moersch paper developers...specifically SE-6 (very cool), 4812 (neutral/warm), and Warm Tone (warm-warm). You might just be pleasantly surprised at the color variations combos such as these can give you while also affording the contrast controls offered by a VC paper, especially if and when augmented with a bit of toning (like selenium) when so desired.

Also...very important - make sure that your contact printing frame provides adequate (and even!) pressure throughout the print area - and keep that contact print frame glass clean! Be especially careful while compressing/sliding the pressure springs into their associated slots...that you don't dig into the slot surfaces - which can dig out little "crumbs" of material which can then magically end up underneath your photo paper (which then becomes dented) or even between your paper and negative (ask me how I know!)

[xkaes]

I agree with what has been said -- no need to use anything special. Treat it as any enlargement, except the negative is on the baseboard, not in the enlarger.

[jp]

Get a contact printing frame, not just a sheet of glass to set over the negative.

Some contact frames are like John L mentioned; spring fingers that can cause wood debris if misused. They are fine if you are intentional about opening/closing.
There are also frames with spring loaded snaps that don't work like that. (photographers forumulary has some like this)

I like VC enlarging papers. I've been using Ilford art300 for some small contact prints of soft focus negatives.
234191

You can get some of Lodima azo paper if you're real patient with ebay and the forum here.. But don't wait. get to work making prints using a variety of VC papers.

[Vaughn]

I make 11x14 contact prints...usually alt processes, but occasionally silver gelatin papers.

An issue I have run up against in printing with store-bought silver gelatin papers is paper size. Printing an 11x14 neg on 11x14 paper leaves a lot of linear edge very close to the image area that can get physically damaged during processing, handling and storage. An issue specially since I like displaying the image with its rebate. There is also an issue of possible chemical contamination on the edges. Both issues can be handled with good darkroom practices, of course.

But I prefer to use my 12x15 contact printing frame and cut down 16x20 paper to fit. Just makes everything that much easier throughout my life with the print. I'd prefer a 13x16 contact frame (full inch around the image area), and if I had one custom made, I'd aim for that size.

[Erik Larsen]

I would suggest starting with any of the numerous variable contrast papers available unless your negatives are taylored to Lupex. In my opinion it is much easier to get a fine print with the ability to adjust contrast that the vc papers afford. On the other hand, if you have a good control of your negative exposure and development to fit Lupex paper you will be rewarded with a beautiful print. I never seem to have the perfect negative and vc paper can help overcome my in exact negatives. If you are using an enlarger as your light source changing contrast is simple, if not you’ll have to adapt a bit. If you’ll be using big film, I might suggest a fast film just due to the small aperture you will likely be forced to use. Have fun with it, it is a rewarding experience!

[jp]

If you're to be using a pyro developer for the negative, it may then be suitable for alt process as well as normal silver printing.
I highly encourage trying traditional cyanotypes including bleaching and toning them for split color or other color tones.
The chemistry is cheap and safe (for traditional) but the paper can be a little pricier. somelike like cot320 or arches platine.
A thin piece of mylar transparency material can protect your negative from the alt process chemistry. An oversize paper and printing frame is recommended for this as well.

[Corran]

IMO, after trying some of the classic "contact printing papers" that everyone raves about as well as a modern equivalent - just use off-the-shelf VC or graded papers from your favorite brand. I've made contact prints of 8x10, 8x20, and 12x20 on Ilford VC paper with no issues. The very subtle differences to AZO/Lodima prints were not enough to get overly excited about, and no one I asked could tell a difference themselves, with most preferring the Ilford prints if really pressed.

[Joseph Kashi]

Just a quick note to thank everyone who has responded so far - all of the replies contain useful information. I do have an 11x14 contact print frame in excellent condition as well as an Omega D 4x5 enlarger with a dichroic head, so VC paper seems an excellent starting point.

Might I inquire as to preferences in high quality VC paper that could approximate the traditional selenium-toned Baryta tonal palette and cool print color?

[Michael R]

Depending on how blue-black and/or cool purple-ish-black (after Se toning) you mean by "cool", cool tones are generally not as easy to get these days as warm or neutral tones. We just don't have the variety of papers, and the ones we do have - while superior in most ways - are less responsive to changes in developer formulation than they once were. Most of the old standby methods for cooling image colour by direct development are essentially useless today. It can be done though. I can make a few suggestions with respect to Ilford papers and maybe others can offer suggestions for Foma papers which I have little personal experience with but can generally be expected to do directionally similar things.

Option 1: Start with a cool tone paper: Ilford's Multigrade Cooltone, which will give a cool image tone in most general purpose developers. Selenium tone to taste.

Option 2: Use a neutral paper such as Ilford Multigrade Classic. It will tend to the warmer side of neutral straight out of regular processing but with relatively weak Se toning (I like KRST diluted 1:40 for 5 minutes, for example) can be made pretty much dead neutral. For cooler tones there are a few developers and modifications that work. Moersch SE3 developer will be slightly cooler than anything from any other brand, and Moersch SE6 cooler still. Since these are expensive developers though, an alternative is to simply buy Moersch's Finisher Blue additive. The magic active ingredient in it is a powerful restrainer (PMT), so you only need to add relatively tiny amounts of it to any off-the-shelf or home-mixed general purpose developer to transform it into anything from a neutral-cool to blue-black developer. PMT can be sourced directly but is not always easy to find.

Option 3: Everything I said about Moersch SE3, SE6 and Finisher Blue/PMT above, but with Ilford Multigrade Warmtone paper. Perhaps counterintuitively, generally speaking warmer contemporary paper emulsions tend to be most responsive to these types of cold tone developer modifications and will often max out at colder tones than achievable on more neutral papers. If you do end up eventually printing on Lupex, it will tend to behave in a similar manner.

Hope this is of some help.


Just a quick note to thank everyone who has responded so far - all of the replies contain useful information. I do have an 11x14 contact print frame in excellent condition as well as an Omega D 4x5 enlarger with a dichroic head, so VC paper seems an excellent starting point.

Might I inquire as to preferences in high quality VC paper that could approximate the traditional selenium-toned Baryta tonal palette and cool print color?

[Drew Wiley]

I can't add much to the above, except that having Anti-Newton-Ring class is the contact frame is a distinct advantage, if you can find it. In old days, people would overdevelop their negatives to get them better matched to the lower contrast of dedicated contact-printing papers like Azo. Now I recommend exposing and developing the film just like you would for good darkroom enlargements. Pick any paper with a look which suits you. Most are VC papers these day. I personally gravitate toward Ilford MGWT for my occasional 8X10 contact prints, due to its out outstanding versatility, especially in toning. For my images, I find the results distinctly superior to anything I got with traditional Azo. But any number of other papers would do fine too.

Since you seem to lean toward a cooler print image outcome, Michael already suggested Ilford Cooltone FB in 130 Developer. But to get it completely cool and achieve DMax, I recommend a gold toner like dilute GP1 afterwards, rather than selenium. Likewise with Bergger Prestige Neutral Tone, which also goes cold with gold chloride post-toning, and a somewhat richer paper, but hard to find at the moment. But Iford MG Classic never goes completely cool.

There isn't much of a film selection commonly available in big sheets except from Ilford. And logistically you'll probably need something faster than FP4 or Delta. Contact printing, you don't need to worry about finding something with especially fine grain. HP5 would be a logical candidate, but has its own distinct personality. I preferred to develop it in PMK pyro.

[Joseph Kashi]

Hi, All:

I really appreciate everyone's experiences regarding papers and contact printing and am trying several approaches suggested here.

Moving beyond the questions of ANR contact frame glass and printing papers and chemistry, I would appreciate any thoughts about appropriate 11x14 films and developing chemistries in terms of producing inherently good tonality, especially in the darker tonal range. I've reviewed the characteristic curves for the BW films available in 11x14 as well as Anchell/Troop on film developers, but that information is relatively theoretical and really doesn't give a sense of the aesthetic qualities and perceived tonality of the various film/developer options. Although I have owned an 11x14 camera and lenses for quite a while, it's been on loan to the university photo department until the end of this academic year/ In the meantime, I am eager to start using the kit and do not yet have any personal experience in the ULF contact process. I would prefer to avoid a lot of trial and error at $350+ per 25 sheet box.

What 11x14 films work for you in terms of good fine art tonality and aesthetics and in what developers?

My most recent experience has been 5x7 Delta 100 developed in XTOL 1:2 used as a semi-stand compensating developer. While that works for scanned negatives, Delta 100 may not be the best choice for contact prints as I am worried about blown highlights and the need to rate at ISO 64 to ensure adequate shadow exposure. HP5+ seems sort of harsh as well in online comparative examples, but does seem to at least have a long straight line compared to FP4.

While I realize that pre-cut 11x14 film is currently a very limited selection, I may participate in Keith Canham's Kodak ULF advance order process if Tri-X or T-Max 400 are available. 11x14 Bergger 400 seems to be only very sporadically available.

Any experience-based thoughts about the aesthetic ramifications of ULF films for contact printing would be very much appreciated.

[Tin Can]

11X14 HP5 as it WAS cheap 100 sheets left

I use Rodinol and soon D23

BIG X-Ray both single sided and 2X

I prefer X-Ray for 1895 'look'

Paper varies with my mood

RC is fine with me

I use Ilford PQ on the big stuff, meaning up to 14X36"

'KISS'

[Michael R]

I would not use anything slower than high speed film in such a large size. The high speed Kodak films would normally be my first choice except that I don't know what your budget is (they will not be cheap). Second would be Ilford HP5. Here are some characteristics although all three would be good and all three have long exposure scales and as much tonality as the printer has skill/vision:

TXP: Longer toe, upswept curve, least prone to Newton ring issues, easiest to use if you need higher highlight densities
TMY-2: Short toe, straight line curve, better reciprocity failure characteristics than TXP
HP5+: Short toe, more gradual shoulder than TMY-2

Perhaps just start with some HP5 and see how it goes. Don't overcomplicate it.

All will be excellent in virtually any general purpose developer from D-76/ID-11 to D-23, Rodinal, XTOL, DDX. Regarding your issues with Delta 100, XTOL at any dilution is not a "compensating" developer. Some friendly advice: Ditch the cookbook. Ditch the semi-stand. Most of that stuff is nonsense and will lead to more problems than solutions. Focus on processing uniformity (which is not a given), and your printing skill (which is where the real control is).


Hi, All:

I really appreciate everyone's experiences regarding papers and contact printing and am trying several approaches suggested here.

Moving beyond the questions of ANR contact frame glass and printing papers and chemistry, I would appreciate any thoughts about appropriate 11x14 films and developing chemistries in terms of producing inherently good tonality, especially in the darker tonal range. I've reviewed the characteristic curves for the BW films available in 11x14 as well as Anchell/Troop on film developers, but that information is relatively theoretical and really doesn't give a sense of the aesthetic qualities and perceived tonality of the various film/developer options. Although I have owned an 11x14 camera and lenses for quite a while, it's been on loan to the university photo department until the end of this academic year/ In the meantime, I am eager to start using the kit and do not yet have any personal experience in the ULF contact process. I would prefer to avoid a lot of trial and error at $350+ per 25 sheet box.

What 11x14 films work for you in terms of good fine art tonality and aesthetics and in what developers?

My most recent experience has been 5x7 Delta 100 developed in XTOL 1:2 used as a semi-stand compensating developer. While that works for scanned negatives, Delta 100 may not be the best choice for contact prints as I am worried about blown highlights and the need to rate at ISO 64 to ensure adequate shadow exposure. HP5+ seems sort of harsh as well in online comparative examples, but does seem to at least have a long straight line compared to FP4.

While I realize that pre-cut 11x14 film is currently a very limited selection, I may participate in Keith Canham's Kodak ULF advance order process if Tri-X or T-Max 400 are available. 11x14 Bergger 400 seems to be only very sporadically available.

Any experience-based thoughts about the aesthetic ramifications of ULF films for contact printing would be very much appreciated.

[Tin Can]

So many variables

I test with 5X7 film

always always

Even if making a huge enlarger print, I lay 5X7 in center and corners for test

I also shoot 11X14 Pinhole for contacts

as example look left at my light bulb avatar aka Nuke emulation

Shot on 4X5, then reversed on 5x7, then enlarged to 11x14 and then reversed to final

Now reduced to tiny

I fear NUKES ever since 'Duck and Cover' drills

[esearing]

Ilfords relatively new RC Portfolio is a nice VC paper for contact printing - I feel it lacks a bit of shadow detail compared to Fiber but for certain images you can not distinguish it from fiber. I also prefer a stronger solution of Ansco 130 for contact prints vs enlargements - don't know why but there is a tad bit of extra depth or tonal separation and color shift toward gray rather than gray-green. If you have deep pockets you can venture into coating your own papers for Salt/Kallitype etc. for a bit more fun.

[Joseph Kashi]

Thank you, everyone.

I've ordered Ilford HP5 11x14 film as there's no other standard continuous tone film in stock, hence the film choice is fairly obvious <G>. I'll try tray-developing single sheets of HP5 in XTOL and PMK and then make a choice of developers. Alkaline fixers seem to be the obvious choice there.

I've also ordered several samples of the various papers recommended in this reply along with PF (Ansco) 130 and Dektol paper developers. I'll make some contact print tests and see what seems to work best for my own goals.

Any suggestions about developing procedures? I develop my 5x7 Delta 100 sheets in a BW King inversion tank.

[Hugo Zhang]

I use a Jobo 2840 tank with Jobo roller base for my 11x14 films. FA-1027 developer these days.