Carrying a Sinar P

[pchong]

Hi all, couldn’t find this on the archives…maybe my search-fu is not good enough..but I am going to attempt the difficult.

I want to carry my Sinar X to the field. I have so far not ventured more than 20m from the car, with the X in the flight case. The X is hung, supported by its rails in the case upside down, fully assembled with lens. The clamp stays on the tripod carried separately. Yea, it’s heavy…no kidding. But I want to attempt further.. not quite hiking in terrain, but more in the city, sometimes with stairs. I have seen strategies like putting the case in a baby runner, camping trolley, but I want to see schemes to pack the camera in a more compact case. Like, how to fit it into say a Rimowa Pilot Cabin roller case, which I actually have lying around, but can’t quite figure out how to fit the camera in, with the need for minimal reassembly as possible when needed.

So do you guys carry the P/P2/X? Or it lives on the studio stand? Please show how you pack the camera. Thanks.

Pic for visual interest…my Sinar X in action:

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Oops, just realised this may be better in the Gear forum...apologies if it is, but I don't know how to move it.

[Peter De Smidt]

I made a box that held the camera hanging from the rail. I bungeed the box to a backpack frame.

[Duolab123]

I have a P2 4x5, bought it used for a really good price, couldn't resist. So far it's been in my modest studio space. Seems to fiddly to take into the field, at least for me and my fumble fingers :o

[Vaidotas]

I like Peter's idea, but ended up with Sinar F/F2 combo. Just understood I'm good with F2 back standard movements.
Sometimes I carry 5x7 P rear standard with bellows and assemble camera on site.

[John Layton]

...I like the baby carriage idea - only with (w.a. equipped) camera instead of baby...ready to photograph folks as they look into the carriage. (sorry, something I ate last night has me awake...and my brain is a bit silly!)

[pchong]

In addition. how do you guys pack your monorail, like the Sinar for air travel?

[Bernice Loui]

Ken Lee once LFF moderator carried a 5x7 Sinar P in a canvas sack with related stuff in a rolling cooler. Roll down this page to "Carry Your Gear on a Budget"
https://www.kennethleegallery.com/html/largeformat/index.php

In years past, carried a 5x7 Sinar C/C2 (Sinar P rear, F front) in modified Sinar 4x5 F/F2 gray luggage style case for decades.. It held camera, 4 lenses, sinar shutter, 3 film holders, light meter, dark cloth, GG loupe, cable release and ... used a rolling cart to move it all, including the tripod bungee corded to the rolling cart & case.

These days the 5x7 Sinar Norma lives in a modified Pelican 1610 FAA approved for carry on roller case. 5x7 Norma, Sinar shutter, bag & normal bellows, 4 lenses (115mm+center filter, 165mm, 240mm-300mm_choice, 480mm), cable releases, light meter+spare battery, 100mm square filters & Sinar holder, dark cloth, small tape measure, GG loupe, up to 6 film holders and small misc accessories.

5x7 Norma is complete with lens and shutter on stored camera. To set up, lift the 5x7 Norma out of the case, place Norma on the set up tripod's Sinar rail clamp, snug down the rail clamp, proceed with camera set up. Takes less than 30 seconds to do this. Tripod strapped to the case with bungee cord(s) as needed.
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Set up.. outta doors:
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Bernice




In addition. how do you guys pack your monorail, like the Sinar for air travel?

[steve_p]

But what about a tripod? i can get a TOYO 45G into a rucksack fairly easily but there is no way that I can add a tripod.

[Bernice Loui]

Toyo G in sack.. not just tripod, what about all that view camera related "stuff" how is all that currently being made mobile?

Refuse to pack or carry stuff when it can be on wheels,
Bernice



But what about a tripod? i can get a TOYO 45G into a rucksack fairly easily but there is no way that I can add a tripod.

[Doremus Scudder]

Be careful with cameras in rolling cases. I rattled a 4x5 camera apart rolling it over bumpy surfaces and cobblestones once. Fortunately, all the parts were there and reassembly wasn't too difficult. After that, I got a rolling case with backpack straps. When the surface is smooth, I'll roll it, but if not, onto my back it goes.

My tripod always gets carried in a free hand or strapped on to the rear rack on my bicycle. In rough terrain in the field, my gear goes into a lumbar pack. I can strap the tripod onto it if I need both hands for scrambling.

FWIW, I carried a Graphic View II in its big grey case along with tripod, etc. in the field for a few years before getting a field camera. It's doable, but I sure like my lightweight wooden folders for field/landscape work.

In the city, I use the rolling backpack and a bit heavier camera, but I'm not climbing or scrambling over rocks. I photographed my erstwhile home town of Vienna, Austria using that rolling backpack and my bicycle. I carried a Wista SW, five lenses, six holders and accessories that way just fine for years. The same kit works well in other cities and is small enough to not be a hindrance to others on public transportation, etc.

Best,

Doremus

[LabRat]

With a monorail, the (usual) best way is in a case that camera can hang upside-down... And there is room for a few holders, a lens or two, accessories etc... Seems a bit bulky, but camera is ready to shoot when placed on the tripod, and case moves easily around on a luggage cart with soft wheels... Taking a monorail apart creates more time needed when deciding to set-up, but maybe ok when traveling and camera needs to shrink...

Steve K

[Greg]

I have a Sinar case like the one in the attached image. It holds a P, auxiliary standard, couple of lenses and more. Really Good: Very compact for all that it holds. Little bit Bad: Replacing the P and stuff back into it is a pain. Over this winter I intend on practicing folding everything up to fit back inside the case.

[pchong]

Thanks all for your sharing…

Further questions for Bernice and Greg, how do you pack the P? Remove the standards from the rails? Also, Greg, could you show the inside of the bag, with camera and accessories inside?

Here is mine…the flight box is really heavy. Lots of space though. Perhaps a hand cart may be useful…but not quite as elegant as I like. ��

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[Bernice Loui]

That looks like a standard monorail case, larger than needed for this 4x5 Sinar X/P/P2.. Used these in the past, the are sorta ok. Difficult with this style of monorail case is access to lenses an stuff as needed due to the depth of the compartments and how stuff must be fitted into this style of case.. It does support the complete monorail camera with lens which is it's only notable feature.

Klepped via the web, this is what the Sinar P case looks like. The layout is far more efficient and ergonomic allowing easy access to stuff as needed. These Sinar P cases hold a LOT of stuff. Fitted foam and inserts does a nice job of vibration control and secure transport of the camera and all as it was specifically designed to transport an entire P/X camera system to the needed location. Know not all this stuff is always needed for location work.
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No longer transport the 5x7 Sinar P/C or F for location stuff, it is the Norma that travels these days. If the 5x7 P/P2 is needed, have another Pelican case specific for that.. It is about the same as the hard style Sinar P expert blue with metal reinforcement case on rollers... it's heavy..

FYI, the 5x7 Norma in 1610 Pelican roller case and all related weights about 25 pounds.. without the tripod.

Avoid taking the monorail camera apart for transport, it is an absolute hassle to slide it all back together again. Yes, it is easy and quick enough to do, I'm not tolerant or patient enough to deal with this as it is so completely avoidable in every way. This is another reason for the preference for a monorail, it can be transported complete with lens and moved complete from case to set up tripod in a single swift move in seconds.. then it is all ready to continue to set up.
Folding-unfolding a field folder is at a disadvantage in this example. It is difficult enough to use any view camera to make images, why make this any more difficult than it absolutely needs to be.

Similar applies to using a view camera indoors/in-studio, the camera/lens should cause the least amount of user grief to allow setting up all that other more important stuff such as lighting and setting up the subject to be photographed and metering for film exposure.


Bernice




Thanks all for your sharing…

Further questions for Bernice and Greg, how do you pack the P? Remove the standards from the rails? Also, Greg, could you show the inside of the bag, with camera and accessories inside?

Here is mine…the flight box is really heavy. Lots of space though. Perhaps a hand cart may be useful…but not quite as elegant as I like. ��

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[tgtaylor]

I don't have a Sinar 4x5 P but I do have a 4x5 Toyo Robos which is similar. The Robos has it's own factory-fitted case which holds the camera, extra bellows, a few lens and other shooting accessories. To transport around urban areas I bungee the case to a 2-wheel dollie and place the tripod on top. To day hike with it on my back I put the standards on a 6 inch Toyo rail and place it in a Lowepro bag which will accommodate it and a few lenses, dark cloth, etc. You can place the tripod on either side of the pack or centered. I prefer the side. Film holders are carried in an F64 bag which will attach to the back of the pack as will extension rails.

I recently purchased a Toyo 5x7 GII and was unable to find a metal storage case that will fit. I settled on a Tenba case whose depth and width is a tad short for the rear standard. However, placing a swing on the rear standard accommodates for the width but leaves the rear standard resting on the bottom of the case. I placed a scrap 4-ply board at the bottom of the case to prevent a tear developing there and take care when placing the case down. That solved the long-term and car transport storage problem. I'm sure that the camera can be backpacked as above but I haven't tried that yet – may have to completely remove both standards from the rail. https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/165048-REG/Tenba_634_405_Car_Case_CCV45.html?sts=pi

[Drew Wiley]

I prefer the Sinar Norma in the field, or the f2. But all kinds of hybrid options like the "C" are also possible while still retaining the P rear standard. But it might be smarter to consider the P in its system sense, with different lighter weight standards being optional accessories worth keeping around.

I have no firm idea of how many thousands of miles I've hiked in steep remote terrain with Sinar 4x5's. At least 15,000 miles over a 30 year span. Except for airline carryon travel, I strictly use true classic domestic (US made) external frame backpacks capable of carrying all my other outdoor essential as well, since all kinds of weather can arrive in the mountains any time of year. So dealing with city stairs etc should be comparatively easy. But you still have to think about ergonomic logistics, strain to your back, and actually protecting your expensive camera and lenses in transit.

A large top-loading pack is also nice because you can leave your camera essentially ready-to-go, even with a lens and shade left on it. You just pull it out, plop it on your rail clamp, extend the rail, and remove your lens cap - then you're ready to compose and focus, really quick and efficient compared to folding view cameras. No need to break down the Sinar camera at all.

Big official metal or ABS camera cases, as well as official camera packs with a lot of thick redundant heavy foam padding, just don't make sense to me in these kinds of cases. You can substitute ordinary ultralight bubble packing, along with light fome-core board dividers if needed.

When I did need to manage heavy cases per se in an urban environment, as back when I did architectural shoots using a Sinar plus lighting gear etc, I employed customized industrial handtrucks - not the flimsy kind camera stores and studio suppliers offer, or like you see in airports, but strongly welded ones with serious tires, and modified with a retaining lip holding the bottom case tight. You don't want to rely on bungee cords alone, or have a setup some thief can easily wrench any of your individual containers away from. The wheels should be large enough diameter up stairs efficiently. Some prefer air-filled tires because they are quieter in such application; but I personally preferred solid tires for their greater reliability, never having to worry about air leakage.

And nothing says, "Steal Me", quite like an officially branded fancy or flashy camera case. My older brother sure learned that the hard way.

[pansku]

I've packed my P2 4x5, 3 lenses, 7 holders, tripod and enough rails to max out the standard bellows into a used Peli 1650. It could be made neater with a fresh foam insert but this will do for now. I could fit more stuff there but realistically 5 more holders or 2 more lenses won't do more than add even more weight to carry up a staircase.

I've also packed it at times to a 70 liter Osprey backpack padded with foam blocks. There too it is packed in a way that I don't have to slide the standards of the rail

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