Jobo ATL 2 Plus vs ATL1500 for B&W Sheet Film Development

[C Hatter Photo]

Moving back into developing my own B&W sheet film and will not have the expansive darkroom I once enjoyed so I'm looking at options, such as the Jobo systems, where I can process outside of a darkroom setting. For years I did process sheet film by hand in the darkroom, both via trays and hanger/tank system and I recognize the cost differential and value of those methods, but not what I'm looking for at this time.

Would love to receive any insight anyone has on some of the Jobo systems available, specifically looking at a ATL 2 Plus option and ATL1500.

Thank you in advance and look forward to your thoughts.

[wooserco]

The JOBO ATL systems are getting really long in the tooth, age wise. Most have or will develop issues, specifically at the circuit board component level. New parts are no longer available (including some of the components). Had one given to me, gave it away to someone (Fred in Wisconsin on the Photrio site).

Unless you get it inexpensively and are capable of electronics repair, I'd shy away from any ATL processor. Repairs could easily equal the cost of a new CPP3.

For what it's worth, I process 4x5 on a JOBO CPE2+ and would consider no other way of processing my film.

However, it's not automated like the ATL systems.

[ic-racer]

Over 20 years ago I decided I would just use my arms to pour the chemicals, rather than rely on pumps. I'm not going to let the thing run on its own anyway; since I'm standing there, I'll just pour the chemicals into the Lift. So I went with the CPP2 and it still runs like new. I'm using it now inbetween chemistry presently.

I don't think the ATL1500 accepts the drums for large format film.

[koh303]

New parts are no longer available
This is a wholly erroneous statement.

[wooserco]

This is a wholly erroneous statement.

Well, when I had my ATL2+ and inquired there were none. Something may have changed in the intervening two years.

I was so intrigued with the JOBO concept, I first purchased used a CPE2 that worked perfectly. Later I purchased a CPE2+.

[koraks]

Well, when I had my ATL2+ and inquired there were none.
Jobo-made PCB's may not be available anymore. I assume they aren't. Individual components, however, will be available for the most part. The challenging bits are any program EPROMs (ATL1000) or programmed microcontrollers (ATL1500 etc.) that contain Jobo/device-specific code.

However, I do agree that at this point, there are some caveats to running machines from this era due to their age and complexity. They're prone to failures by this point and their complexity makes it a non-trivial task for most people to troubleshoot problems.

If you search Photrio there are a couple of threads about various troubleshooting and remanufacturing projects on ATL1000's, 1500's etc.

If this is for low volume and amateur use, I'd just look at one of the far simpler and less failure prone CPP's or CPE's. Availability is much better as well, even new (CPE-3). A further benefit to these smaller machines is that you can drain them and tuck them away in a storage cabinet. It's a lot less practical stuffing one of those ATL's into a cupboard somewhere out of the way.

[Lars Holte]

I don't think the ATL1500 accepts the drums for large format film.

It does: Tank 4218 and spool 2509n for 6 sheets of 9x12 cm or 4x5" film, or tank 4219 and 2x 2509n spools for a total of 12 sheets of 9x12 cm or 4x5" film. Works flawlessly. I have an ATL-1500 in my darkroom.

That said, I develop BW negs by hand in the above-mentioned drums on a self-made roller arrangement. Just as easy and less water-consuming than using the ATL-1500.
The Jobo ATL-1500 is a fine machine, but I rarely use mine. It is well suited for development of color negs and slides, though.

[Duolab123]

I bought a new CPP3 from Catlabs JP a few years ago, Catlabs has helped me with parts for my CPP2, it still runs great. Catlabs has new and refurbished machines and is the US service provider for Jobo. It's a matter of who supplies the equipment on these machines. MHOFWIW

[wooserco]

Jobo-made PCB's may not be available anymore. I assume they aren't. Individual components, however, will be available for the most part. The challenging bits are any program EPROMs (ATL1000) or programmed microcontrollers (ATL1500 etc.) that contain Jobo/device-specific code. .

When I stated that individual components were no longer available, I was referring to the PCB level Components (some) are no longer available to build/repair the PCB's. I understand that.

I've been a field service technician on German manufactured Kardex/Remstar Automated Storage Retrieval Systems for over 30 years. All of their pre 2000 PCB's are obsolete and no longer repairable due component obsolescence. They have worked around that by designing PCB's that have been updated with digital components populating their boards. I totally understand obsolescence. I'm offended when I'm told by the person that told me that I'm making a "totally erroneous statement" when it was in fact HIS company that told me that.

I accepted what he stated, because I understand that happens. But, the statement really struck me as arrogant and condescending; totally contradicting what he told me two years prior.

My goodness, I could have had an operational ATL2+ had he sold me the PCB that I needed.

Sorry, enough of a rant. I am happily using the CPE2+ and if it ever fails, I'll be getting a new CPE3! I like the JOBO system that much!

[koraks]

I understand your frustration, and see where you're coming from given your additional explanation. I agree with you that denying the problematic nature of repairing machines from this generation is an odd position to take. We all know that 30-40 years of industrial evolution has brought us many new possibilities, but that has come at the cost of a great deal of 'creative destruction' as well.

[mtndesertman]

:rolleyes: Well...30 years ago I managed to stuff a used ATL II Plus above my washing machine and dryer closet. All it required was locating the wall studs, properly bedding some trim support and a firm shelf. I do need a small step ladder for some things; adjusting the drum supports and temp water levels, but it also was an easy hook up to the washing machine drain, and water to a water temp control panel/filter. I must be living in one of those "mystery spots" that defy the normal laws of physics, or Gremlins, or Murphy; my Jobo has never had a problem. I can't say the same for the Epson Stylus Pro 9900 I once owned :mad:

[Christopher Nisperos]

No apology from CatLABS? It would seem in order.

[Christopher Nisperos]

When I stated that individual components were no longer available, I was referring to the PCB level Components (some) are no longer available to build/repair the PCB's. I understand that.

I've been a field service technician on German manufactured Kardex/Remstar Automated Storage Retrieval Systems for over 30 years. All of their pre 2000 PCB's are obsolete and no longer repairable due component obsolescence. They have worked around that by designing PCB's that have been updated with digital components populating their boards. I totally understand obsolescence. I'm offended when I'm told by the person that told me that I'm making a "totally erroneous statement" when it was in fact HIS company that told me that.

I accepted what he stated, because I understand that happens. But, the statement really struck me as arrogant and condescending; totally contradicting what he told me two years prior.

My goodness, I could have had an operational ATL2+ had he sold me the PCB that I needed.

Sorry, enough of a rant. I am happily using the CPE2+ and if it ever fails, I'll be getting a new CPE3! I like the JOBO system that much!

• •. • • • • • •

It seems that an apology from CatLabs would have been "totally" appropriate.