First 8x10 Exposures with Toyo Field

[Vaughan]

Hello

My first three exposures on 8x10 with a Toyo Field 810MII. Three images, because that's the capacity of my developing tank.

All images made with Ilford HP5 Plus, developed in Ilford Ilfotec HC 1+47.

These images were tests with the camera, film and lenses: a multicoated Fujinon NSW 125mm f8, and single coated Fujinon W 180mm f5.6 and 210mm f5.6 lenses. Exposure was 1/4 sec at f22 for all.

I like wide angles of view so I was keen to try the 125mm. The rated circle is 280mm so I was expecting the coverage to be close, and the results show vignette in the corners but usable with a small amount of cropping. However its use requires the bed and back to be dropped forward and back 15˚respectively, which makes setup and operation difficult, but regardless of that I have found it TOO wide and it will probably not be a frequent companion (its size and weight don't help either).

On the other hand, the original single coated Fujinon W 180mm f5.6 filled the frame (albeit with no movements, but at least the camera bed was square and not dropped) and appears to be wide enough for my taste.

The third image is with the Fujinon W 210mm f5.6 lens, which I picked up for cheap because the shutter was not working but the glass was very nice. I managed to have the shutter fixed in a few minutes: it appears that the previous owner opened the shutter and closed it up incorrectly, because I didn't really do anything to it. In this image at the front standard was given about 25mm of rise.

The scene is Ryde Park on the Parramatta River in Sydney, my go-to place for practice photographs. The scans of the negatives are made with a phone app and light panel with little in the way of tone adjustments.

Regards, Vaughan (from Sydney Australia)

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[Mark Sampson]

A good start. Keep it up!

[ic-racer]

Nice set of lenses. You are starting out with a kit it took me years to assemble!
I have the same three, and the 250/6.7 and 300/5.6 too. I think you will find a little crop and that 125mm makes great images.
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[Vaughan]

I also have a new multicoated Fujinon NW 300mm f5.6 (according to the specs both the old and new lenses have the same image circle, so I got the new version) but didn't test it because I can only process 3 sheets at a time and wanted to see how the image circles of the 125, 180 and 210 looked.

The 125mm requires the bed to be dropped which complicates setup and operation significantly. However the lure of ultra-wide is strong... the "getting close to the subject" is more of a challenge with an 8x10 camera.

I also have a Fujinon SF 250mm f5.6 to play around with. It will be interesting to see how that lens looks stopped well down. They are relatively cheap and most are missing one or both of the diffusion disks anyway.

'm tending to be liking longer lens now and am tempted to get something longer than 300mm, like a 420-450mm or going crazy and getting a Nikkor T ED 600 or 800mm.

[Drew Wiley]

If you go 450, you can opt for either a 450 Fuji C or 450 Nikkor M for ample coverage on 8x10. Neither will be cheap. The prior single-coated 450 Nikkor Q is a little more affordable. Going to a tele the size and weight of a hippopotamus sounds pretty ambitious if you're just starting out, and might not find much use anyway. The lens to get if portability is in mind is a 600 Fuji C; but those are very expensive at the moment. If you look into barrel process lenses in the 600 to 780 focal length, and resort to lens cap exposure method, or have on fitted in shutter, you'll save a lot of money. But it makes a lot more sense to try a more conservative focal length first, like 450. There is the single-coat Fujinon 420 L often found reasonably priced; but it won't have as generous an image circle as the 450C. Anything 180 conventional is at the opposite extreme, and hardly usable with 8x10 format. A nice intermediate focal length with numerous choices would be in the 360 range, including the 355 G-Claron. My most common personal 8x10 field set consists of 250, 360, and 450.

[Andrew O'Neill]

I have a Nikkor SW 120 f/8 for my extreme wide urges on 8x10. I'm still kicking myself for not picking up a Fujinon W 180 when I lived in Japan... It would be nice to have something between my 120 and 210.

[Vaughan]

The single-coated Fujinon W 180mm f5.6 *just* covers 8x10: the rated circle is 305mm and that's the diagonal of the exposed area of a sheet of film.

The second image I posted earlier is with the 180mm: just a hint of vignette in the extreme corners, so no movement possible but good coverage otherwise.

[ericantonio]

Hello

My first three exposures on 8x10 with a Toyo Field 810MII. Three images, because that's the capacity of my developing tank.

All images made with Ilford HP5 Plus, developed in Ilford Ilfotec HC 1+47.

These images were tests with the camera, film and lenses: a multicoated Fujinon NSW 125mm f8, and single coated Fujinon W 180mm f5.6 and 210mm f5.6 lenses. Exposure was 1/4 sec at f22 for all.

I like wide angles of view so I was keen to try the 125mm. The rated circle is 280mm so I was expecting the coverage to be close, and the results show vignette in the corners but usable with a small amount of cropping. However its use requires the bed and back to be dropped forward and back 15˚respectively, which makes setup and operation difficult, but regardless of that I have found it TOO wide and it will probably not be a frequent companion (its size and weight don't help either).

On the other hand, the original single coated Fujinon W 180mm f5.6 filled the frame (albeit with no movements, but at least the camera bed was square and not dropped) and appears to be wide enough for my taste.

The third image is with the Fujinon W 210mm f5.6 lens, which I picked up for cheap because the shutter was not working but the glass was very nice. I managed to have the shutter fixed in a few minutes: it appears that the previous owner opened the shutter and closed it up incorrectly, because I didn't really do anything to it. In this image at the front standard was given about 25mm of rise.

The scene is Ryde Park on the Parramatta River in Sydney, my go-to place for practice photographs. The scans of the negatives are made with a phone app and light panel with little in the way of tone adjustments.

Regards, Vaughan (from Sydney Australia)

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These are great, I'm finding my 120mm is also TOO wide. The last image looks good wide, almost like a normal eye view wide. Great start with your 8x10 adventures. What developing tank are you using?

[rawitz]

I also like (ultra-)wide-angle photography and found that for 8x10 format:
my Super-Angulon 8/120mm MC covers 8x10 with some (1,5cm) shift upside and very good quality from f22 in the corners. No tilt-tricks are necessary to get the coverage on the Toyo 810m. The Nikon 8/120mm should be equal but I dont have it. So I wonder about your vignetting of the Fujinon NSW 125mm f8.
In the 210mm range there are many good choices: I have a 5,6/Symmar-S and a Apo-Sinaron-N, both covering 8x10 with some range for shift with very good corner resolution.
If you want something between 120 and 210, the single coated Fujinon W 180mm f5.6 does have the coverage for 8x10 but with no shift reserve and for best quality in the corners stop down to f32 and more. The Super-Angulon MC 8/165mm, Grandagon 8/155mm and Nikon 8/150mm does it easy with big coverage, but much more size and weight.
For your tests I would advice you to choose objects with details in the corners, because coverage of light does not mean automatically good resultution at the border.
regards
Rainer

[r.e.]

The Super-Angulon MC 8/165mm, Grandagon 8/155mm and Nikon 8/150mm does it easy with big coverage, but much more size and weight.
For your tests I would advice you to choose objects with details in the corners, because coverage of light does not mean automatically good resultution at the border.

Just to note that those lenses tend to be expensive on the used market. The Schneider 150mm Super-Symmar XL is also an option. It's quite a bit lighter and offers f/5.6, but it's very expensive. All of these lenses call for a decision about whether to purchase a centre filter, which adds significantly to the cost. The Super-Angulon and Grandagon also take filters larger than 100mm, which has ramifications for the availability and cost of polariser, neutral density, black and white and colour correction filters. The Nikon and Schneider Super-Symmar XL both take 95mm filters, which are much more readily available and less expensive.

[Bernice Loui]

The Fujinon 125mm f8 SWD does NOT cover 8x10 at infinity focus, have one tried. Schneider 120mm f8 Super Angulon barely covers 8x10 at f22, at infinity focus, same with the 120mm f8 SW nikkor. 115mm f6.8 Rodenstock Grandagon does not cover 8x10 at infinity focus..

~Respect the published image circle numbers...

IMO, too many toot about how their lenses "cover" 8x10 when the lens only illuminated the 8x10 sheet of film.. or significant optics performance drop off at or just beyond it's designed in optical performance image circle. Skip the idea of using camera movement if the lens barely covers the required sheet film format (8x10) in this case. To get the most out of what any wide angle lens, a bag bellow is almost always mandatory, small camera movements are often used (some exceptions like rise/fall/shift) demanding precision from the camera.

Moving closer to the foreground subject relative to a large object aids in increasing the lens image circle. Stopping the lens down also aids in increasing lens image circle of these modern wide angle lenses to a degree, once much past f32 the image circle does not increase that much more..

Add to this reality, light fall off which can be corrected lots by applying the proper center filter. How much light fall off is acceptable depends on the image maker's needs and expectations.

Above applies to modern 210mm f5.6 Plasmat lenses..



Bernice

[ic-racer]

Maybe you got a bad example, it is not unnusual for lenses on the used market to have been disassembled by someone that doesn't know what they are doing. Mine is great. The sharp image circle matches the illumination circle which matches the diffusion box on my enlarger. Fantastic 16x20 prints from my lens [Fujinon 125 SW].
No gymnastics to use the lens on Shen-Hao. Any perspective correction needed is performed during enlargement.

[Bernice Loui]

Previously discussed on LFF. Stopping here.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?144008-FUJINON-NSW-(-SW-)-f-8-125mm-experiences


Bernice

[Vaughan]

What developing tank are you using?

I’m using a Poilot (Chinese copy of a JOBO) 2550 tank and a Poilot reel. The reel is modular and can process 4x5, 5x7 and 8x10. I modified a centre column to fit whole plate as well. I have been using inversion agitation but just got a hand roller base. These 8x10s were done with the roller.

[Tin Can]

Mostly I shoot in studio with field camera, sometimes 8X10 wide angle

I have to use a flashlight to find corners, no tilts

My APO Symmar 5.6/120 MC is very good at filling 8X10 in my studio, sharp tiny

but I sold the camera that did it easily, Kodak Master View 8x10: a review (https://www.largeformatphotography.info/kodak/masterview.html)

[John Kasaian]

What a great start Vaughn. Congratulations!

[Vaughan]

What a great start Vaughn. Congratulations!

Thanks!

My Shanghai GP3 whole plate film just arrived so IÂ’ll be doing more of that with the Rittreck View with extension back. IÂ’m waiting for an order of GP3 8x10 as well: I’d rather keep the Ilford stuff until I have more practice with the format.

[Vaughan]

A photo from the weekend. This wasn't my intended subject: there happened to be some kind of sporting event at the place I wanted to go, and all roads were banked up bumper-to-bumper for several kms. So I abandoned the plan, and spotted this while driving home. Crappy phone scan: my new macro lens arrived today, will be using that in the future.

Toyo 810MII, original Fujinon W 210mm f5.6 lens.

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