8x10" monorail: which one?

[Marco Frigerio]

Hello again!!

For our next project we need an 8x10" monorail, because we need much more precision and control than our Calumet C1 (this is a GREAT camera but is not the right tool for what we have in mind now) and other field cameras could offer...we'll be shooting in interior, very very close to the car but not in our studio, so we were looking for a a kind of "portable" 8x10" monorail with top class mechanics...the first two models that come to mind are Sinar F and Arca Swiss F...recently we've been offered a Sinar F2 in excellent conditions but I'm looking for advices, comments, real life users who could maybe make some comparisons, since I've read mixed comments on both models (Sinar or Arca), and those comments were referring mainly to the 4x5" versions, so I can't decide which way to go...

Thanks!!!

Ciao

Marco

[Armin Seeholzer]

I would take the Sinar F2 but if wight is not a large concern then the Sinar P or P2!

[Stan. Laurenson-Batten]

The Sinar P2 10X8 is the ultimate in all respects - my personal opinion of course, as a long time user.

[Frank Petronio]

I'd avoid the Sinar F as the front standard is flimsy in comparision to the others. The F2 is better than the F in this regard, but study the camera carefully since many people claim their F1 is an F2 (at least on eBay)!

Since the Sinar is already a heavy and bulky camera I would opt for the Sinar P series or an older Sinar Norma. They are not much more expensive. A good Sinar P is very nice with very precise geared movements. The older Norma is my favorite, it is very solid and better built than the later Sinars.

All of the Arca-Swiss 8x10s - old and new versions - are excellent and quite a bit lighter and more compact. The ultimate would be the F-Metric - smooth, light, elegant.

[Pete Roody]

Just make sure you are really getting an F2. Many people advertise the F or F1 as an F2. The F2 has a heavy duty front standard that has longer and thicker posts. The posts are also spring loaded like the rear standard. The F2 front standard easily supports heavy lenses (210 super angulon for instance). Because the F1/F posts are shorter, you essentially have no front rise capability with 8x10 with that version.

Prices for sinar equipment have fallen dramatically. A new 8x10 P2 sold for just over $3,000 last week on ebay. If weight is not an issue for you, sinar F2/P2 cameras are a good value.

[CXC]

If you can haul it there, then a Sinar P/2 is the first choice for precision. They, and their parts, are also readily available in the used marketplace, whereas Arcas are few and far between.

If possible, lift it before you buy it. It's easy to say that weight is not a consideration, but some things are just way too heavy...

[Martin Miller]

I have an 8x10 Arca-Swiss f-metric. It's true that the Swiss-Arca is less prevalent than the Sinar and that may have a bearing on availablity of parts. Fortunately I have not had any problems yet. I used to have a 4x5 Sinar f. Both are fine base-tilt cameras but I think the Arca has the edge on compactness, and weight. The depth-of-field calculator on the focus knob of the Sinar was a plus, very clever and easy to use. The Arca "metric" geared-rise feature is especially nice on the 8x10 model since it's a long reach to the front controls from under the dark cloth. I bought the standard-rail model (as opposed to the folding rail) and an accessory 15cm rail. The camera is stored on the 15cm rail and this makes the package extremely compact. It can fit in a backpack, like Lowepro, with that short rail perpendicular to your back. I rarely backpack with it but transport it in the Lowepro as a protective case and at least have the option of going a few miles with it on my back. Both Arca and Sinar are quite vulnerable without a sturdy case of some kind. I realize that I am comparing the Arca 8x10 to the older 4x5 Sinar, but if I had the choice to make all over again, I'd go for the Arca because of the greater compactness, lower weight, and the geared rise on the front standard.

[Martin Miller]

Marco,

One advantage of the Sinar that I forgot to mention is that it has a built-in system for setting swings and tilts very simply. With the Arca you are on your own to use either successive approximations or a calculator like the Rodenstock one. I'd have to say that the Sinar system is faster though this is not a major problem in any case.

[Marco Frigerio]

Thanks everybody, lots of useful advices here!!!!

Martin, yes, one of the things tha makes me think about the Sinar system is the tilt/swing calculator, that's definitely a plus expecially for our next project (we'll be working very close to the subjects so dof and the need of precise tilt/swingwe'll be a major issue)...

Frank, Peter, the Sinar I was offered is the one of a very good friend of mine, a professional photographer here in Milan, so I'm sure about the fact that is a Sinar F2...anyway I was thinking about Norma and P2 too, because it's not the forst time I heard about the "flimsy" issue of the Sinar F...well, I have no experience with monorails and seen a Sinar F only a couple of times, but I found it quite surprising, I mean, it's difficult for me to understand that the front standard of a metal monorail could be more flimsy than the front standard of a Canham or a Gandolfi or other field cameras...or maybe I totally missed the point ;))))))...please, can you elaborate better and help me understand, because on the monorail I'll decide to purchase I'll use mainly an heavy 300 Sironar S so it'll be an important issue...thank you!!

Ciao

Marco

[giancatarina]

I just hate the F, F2... too big while flimsy...
The P2 is the more rigid and precise camera, but it's a tank !
the new arca swiss misura 8x10 and the phillips compact II are the best alternatives when you want something transportable
and the good cheap alternative is the old sinar norma 8x10

[Lars Åke Vinberg]

Marco,
I got two Toyo 810G monorails off ebay for $500 each (one for spare parts, as I'm pretty rough on them when canyoning or in duststorms). They are very well built and cost-effective.