FP4 or HP5 in PMK Pyro For Making Platinum/Palladium Prints?

[LFLarry]

I am hopeful that someone here in the forum can share their experience with using either FP4 or HP5 developed in PMK for making Platinum & Palladium Prints?

If you would be willing to share your film of choice (FP4 or HP5) along with your development dilution (e.g., 2:2:100), method (e.g., tray, rotary, etc), and time, it would give me a starting place to start exploring what works best for my style.

If you have any Pt/Pd prints that you made with your film and development method, that would be inspirational to see.

Thank you in advance.

Warm regards,

Larry

[Vaughn]

Lots of Pt/pd prints on all sorts of film. FP4+ is one of my mainstays. In PyrocatHD 2:2:100 at 72F for around 8 minutes depending on the SBR -- but also in Ilford Universal PQ Developer if you want to try a non-staining developer.

Expands easier than HP5+. I tend towards high contrast negatives that print without any contrast control.

Generally, I can't tell from the prints which film/dev I used.

[LFLarry]

Thanks, Vaughan. I assume PMK is going to possibly be a different dilution vs Pyrocat HD and different development times?

I have read the articles by Sandy King on Pyrocat HD and there is some reference to the possible differences in development time between Pyrocat HD and PMK, but since I have never used either developer, I am not really sure.

I really had not thought about Ilford Universal PQ because it is not a staining developer and I just assumed that Pyro developers would be a good choice for UV-based printing processes.

Thank you.


Lots of Pt/Pd prints on all sorts of film. FP4+ is one of my mainstays. In PyrocatHD 2:2:100 at 72F for around 8 minutes depending on the SBR -- but also in Ilford Universal PQ Developer if you want to try a non-staining developer.

Expands easier than HP5+. I tend towards high contrast negatives that print without any contrast control.

Generally, I can't tell from the prints which film/dev I used.

[Vaughn]

A British photographer who back-engineered many of the old processes (Terry King -- no relation to Sandy) recommended FP4+ and Ilford Universal PQ developer especially for Pt/pd printing. He liked the way it expanded/seperated the mid-tones. Depending on the scene's brightness range, I used it from normal film strength (1:19) to paper strength (1:9) for negatives for both Pt/pd and carbon printing. I have also has success using Dektol in the same manner (straight to 1:2).

Years ago I used some different staining developers. I am using PyrocatHD now. I develop in Expert Drums on a Unicolor motor base. Oxidation seems to be minimal and I get even development. I use older, out-of-date films, also. Staining developers can add to the base fog of these films, so a non-staining developer can come in handy. I am using some Kodak Professional Copy Film. The 8x10 expired in 1989 and the 4x5 in 1999. Just developed some of the 4x5 in PyrocatHD yesterday -- minimal base fog. However, the 8x10 has a heavy base fog (still 100% usable) that calls for a non-staining developer if I want to keep printing times down.

This negative (4x10) was developed in straight Dektol and printed in Carbon. Might be a little too much contrast for Pt/pd, but I have not tried. Might be fun.

[Greg]

I shoot FP4+ ASA 100 Rodinal 1:25 68 degrees 15-17 minutes. minimal base plus fog and Dmax 2.30+
With HP5+ shot at 320 the base+fog density was too much for liking and the Dmax not high enough for my liking

[LFLarry]

Wow!!! Impressive image Vaughn.

I will definitely give PQ a try and compare it to PMK. I need to start with PMK and FP4 since that is what I have on hand and I can order some PQ to be able to compare. I might as well go all in and order some Pyrocat HD too. I also have some drums and a roller base that I could try in addition to my normal tray development.

Any idea for some starting development times for Pt/Pd prints using your suggested Ilford Universal PQ and Dektol? This type of info isn't something that would be readily available I assume. I like to try and start with some type of baseline to get me started, and then do my own tests to figure out what works for me. But using a starting point is much better than throwing darts in the dark.

This should be fun to work though.

Thanks again.




A British photographer who back-engineered many of the old processes (Terry King -- no relation to Sandy) recommended FP4+ and Ilford Universal PQ developer especially for Pt/pd printing. He liked the way it expanded/seperated the mid-tones. Depending on the scene's brightness range, I used it from normal film strength (1:19) to paper strength (1:9) for negatives for both Pt/pd and carbon printing. I have also has success using Dektol in the same manner (straight to 1:2).

Years ago I used some different staining developers. I am using PyrocatHD now. I develop in Expert Drums on a Unicolor motor base. Oxidation seems to be minimal and I get even development. I use older, out-of-date films, also. Staining developers can add to the base fog of these films, so a non-staining developer can come in handy. I am using some Kodak Professional Copy Film. The 8x10 expired in 1989 and the 4x5 in 1999. Just developed some of the 4x5 in PyrocatHD yesterday -- minimal base fog. However, the 8x10 has a heavy base fog (still 100% usable) that calls for a non-staining developer if I want to keep printing times down.

This negative (4x10) was developed in straight Dektol and printed in Carbon. Might be a little too much contrast for Pt/pd, but I have not tried. Might be fun.

[LFLarry]

Thank you Greg. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and experience. Very helpful.



I shoot FP4+ ASA 100 Rodinal 1:25 68 degrees 15-17 minutes. minimal base plus fog and Dmax 2.30+
With HP5+ shot at 320 the base+fog density was too much for liking and the Dmax not high enough for my liking

[Vaughn]

I was looking thru some negs on FP4 and developed in Universal PQ. They are all over the place, as the SBR could run from 4 stops to 10 stops.

This scene read from 4 to 9 on my Pentax Spot Meter. Probably should have given it another stop of exposure to cover resiprocity failure, but I do use it to increase contrast. Developed in PQ Universal, 60 ml concentrate to 940 ml water (~1:16) at 69F for 5.5 minutes.

I use a 2:1 ratio for my palladium/platinum mix. Developed in warm Potassium oxalate. Cot 320 Again, I am going for negatives that print with no contrast agent...so you might be able to go lighter on the development.

[Ironage]

Not really the subject of this thread, but how about Tri-X in PQ Universal? Anyone tried that and is the film base plus fog low?

[Vaughn]

Not really the subject of this thread, but how about Tri-X in PQ Universal? Anyone tried that and is the film base plus fog low?

Yes... very clean-looking snappy negatives.

[Michael R]

Not really the subject of this thread, but how about Tri-X in PQ Universal? Anyone tried that and is the film base plus fog low?

In general, “universal” developers should produce low fog. The tradeoff might be slightly lower emulsion speed than some dedicated film developers, but this need not necessarily be the case.

[interneg]

In general, “universal” developers should produce low fog. The tradeoff might be slightly lower emulsion speed than some dedicated film developers, but this need not necessarily be the case.

The speed loss is only really a potential issue at more 'standard' CI's used for silver gelatin today - not really an issue at the high CI's needed for most of the processes collated under the 'alternative' heading. Universal developers should really be the first choice for negs for most of those processes, as they deliver the results needed without pain or questionable photochemistry.

[bob carnie]

I am hopeful that someone here in the forum can share their experience with using either FP4 or HP5 developed in PMK for making Platinum & Palladium Prints?

If you would be willing to share your film of choice (FP4 or HP5) along with your development dilution (e.g., 2:2:100), method (e.g., tray, rotary, etc), and time, it would give me a starting place to start exploring what works best for my style.

If you have any Pt/Pd prints that you made with your film and development method, that would be inspirational to see.

Thank you in advance.

Warm regards,

Larry


When I first started making Pt Pd prints we used FP4 in large format size developed in PMK with outstanding results, Vaughn Hutchings here continues working from original camera negs and makes Pt Pd and would be an excellent resource. I found that
even with great exposure and development I was dodging and burning the Pt PD prints which was a PIA.
Today I use digital methods to create the negs for printing.

But I would imagine if you are looking for a really stunning print shooting large format and direct contact prints are hard to beat.