Nikkor 90mm; f/8 vs f/4.5

[Drew Bedo]

Was doing an insurance review of my stuff the other day. Looking on-line, it seems that my Nikkor 90mm f/8 is holding a similar value to the f/4.5 model.

It seems that the older lens is about as wanted as the later version.

From a desirability and availability perspective (no dollar value estimate) is this a real thing? Am I getting that right?

[Corran]

Sounds right to me - smaller/lighter vs. bigger/brighter.

[Mark Sampson]

I don't believe that there's an older/later issue; AFAIK those two lenses were offered concurrently. My Nikkor-W 90/8 is a superb lens. When I bought it used, over 30 years ago, the f/4.5 versions were more expensive- and there was a choice on display. I've never once felt the need for f/4.5 to focus, or needed the allegedly greater coverage. Corran's idea seems right to me.

[abruzzi]

When I was first looking for a 90, I read a lot of people going on about the 90/8 because it had as much image circle as the 5.6, and weighed less. I think what your seeing in prices reflects that sentiment. (Just like the earlier Fuji 250/6.7 sells for significantly more than the later Fuji 250/6.3)

[Drew Wiley]

Mark is right. They were offered parallel, and for a good reason. One is more portable and lighter, especially if you factor in the significant difference in size of an accessory center filter, or any other filters (67mm vs 82mm). But the argument for the 4.5 lens is that it offers much brighter focus and viewing in dimly-lit situations, like architectural interiors as a prime example - that's why I personally owned one and appreciated the f/4.5 aperture. I sometimes had to prop the tripod up high overlooking a railing or something like that where I needed to focus with filters on, because it would be too clumsy to attach that after focus. And I remember at least one instance in the mountains around 13,000 ft, with the rig atop a barely large enough slab protruding over 500 ft of thin air - me just leaning forward to close and cock the shutter was spooky enough! Anyway ... both varieties of 90 are optically excellent.

[Doremus Scudder]

The Nikkor 90mm f/8 has the largest image circle for a lens in that aperture range and focal length. That's why it's in demand. I get significantly more coverage and can use more movements with my 90mm Nikkor f/8 than my Super Angulon 90mm f/8, which is why I got it in the first place. They are both great lenses, but the Nikkor offers more possibilities to work with architecture and other subjects that require lots of coverage while still being light and portable.

Best,

Doremus

[Greg]

Owned and used the f/8 optic for years with excellent results. Then when I started a long term project of shooting at dusk, I acquired the f/4.5 optic. I found both to be equally sharp for making under 16x20 inch B&W enlargements. But using the f/4.5 optic on a Sinar X at dusk time markedly made focusing just a lot more easier. I was always using a Sinar Binocular reflex magnifier with a fresnel that was optimized to be used with WA lenses.

[Bernice Loui]

Current market value of the 90mm f8 sw Nikkor is driven by field folder folks that have figured out it is a smaller full aperture version of the 90mm f4.5 sw Nikkor, 235mm image circle @f22 is useful. Before the popularity of field folder view cameras happened, when commercial AD, Architectural and similar images were the primary market and where used was for sheet film view cameras, the larger aperture versions were more popular as they are easier to focus due to being brighter and their often 4/4 "Biogon" influenced designs were the preferred with lower weight and size being much less significant.

The other f4.5, 90mm being Rodenstock Grandgon.


Bernice

[Drew Wiley]

As Bernice noted, the fact that so many of us are aging outdoor photographers with carry weight concerns, is what is driving a price disparity between all kinds of lens options. Demand is up for petite versions, and down for big studio lenses as long as lighter equivalents are still available. I integrated architectural photography moonlighting along with architectural color consultation - a very nice spinoff. But I was dealing exclusively with very high end renovation contractors and architects with a considerable amount of education and often even formidable photographic skills themselves. They needed me for especially high quality prints that really leapt off their portfolios pages. But once MF digital options were realistic, and they could now go cost-effectively from those kinds of shots directly to actual coffee-table style books of their work, I knew my game was over. Time to concentrate strictly on my personal photography; was married by then, so didn't have spare time for much moonlighting anyway.

Doremus - the Nikkor 90/f8 and f/4.5 version have the SAME published image circle spec, which interestingly is given for both at f/16. So at even smaller apertures, the circle for both really is sizable.

[Bernice Loui]

From the B&H large format sheet years ago:
https://static.bhphotovideo.com/FrameWork/Product_Resources/SourceBookProPhoto/Section04LgFormatLenses.pdf

Nikkor SW 90mm f/4.5 (1345) Item # NI9045SW ..... $1,319.95

Nikkor SW 90mm f/8 (1344) Item # NI908SW .......... $839.95


Bernice

[tgtaylor]

For years my lens kit for multi-day backpack trips in the Sierra were the 90mm Grandagon f4.5, 150mm Apo Sirona-S f5.6, and Nikkor -M 300mm f9. The latter 2 are very compact and the 150 even folds-up with the camera. The Grandagon was bulky and took up a lot of space in the pack but it delivered beautiful images and gave a perfect FOV. The 75mm f4.5 Grandagon was also a good lens and far more compact than the 90 but I found the FOV too wide in most instances whereas the 90mm was perfect. But there was the heft and bulk of the 90 to contend with and one day I bought the much touted Nikkor 90mm F8 to replace it on backpacking trips. But despite the advantages in bulk and weight I wasn't enthused about the quality of images it produced and after a while started packing the Grandagon instead. My long distance backpacking days are probably over - from now on its out and back on the mule/horse. A little more expensive that way but I have already traveled by foot the length and breadth of the Sierra Peter's advise, given at Camping Paradise in Italy, on camping in one spot and exploring the area during the days makes good sense these days.

Thomas

[Drew Wiley]

I've have a 30X40 inch Cibachrome framed on a back wall from a draft-horse sized 120 Super Angulon, CF n' all, that I lugged along with a full Sinar system the entire length of the Kern River mostly off-trail and over some especially high steep passes, even atop a peak adjacent Mt Tyndale for sake of a panoramic view. Up to 19 miles per day with that 85 lb load. Them were the days. But I never personally gravitated much to wide-angle lenses, preferring long views most of the time. Other than having the same lens in my kit once again atop Goddard Divide overlooking the Enchanted Gorge, I can't recall ever backpacking with a large wide lens again. I did sometimes use a Nikkor 90/4.5 on local day hikes, like inside the old military tunnels just north of the Golden Gate. Gotta do it while you can. Any multi-day backpack kit going forward has a little folder Ebony and a selection of very petite lenses instead.

[Bernice Loui]

Curious, what were the print differences between the Nikkor SW -vs- Rodenstock Grandgon ?

Bernice


For years my lens kit for multi-day backpack trips in the Sierra were the 90mm Grandagon f4.5, 150mm Apo Sirona-S f5.6, and Nikkor -M 300mm f9. The latter 2 are very compact and the 150 even folds-up with the camera. The Grandagon was bulky and took up a lot of space in the pack but it delivered beautiful images and gave a perfect FOV. The 75mm f4.5 Grandagon was also a good lens and far more compact than the 90 but I found the FOV too wide in most instances whereas the 90mm was perfect. But there was the heft and bulk of the 90 to contend with and one day I bought the much touted Nikkor 90mm F8 to replace it on backpacking trips. But despite the advantages in bulk and weight I wasn't enthused about the quality of images it produced and after a while started packing the Grandagon instead. My long distance backpacking days are probably over - from now on its out and back on the mule/horse. A little more expensive that way but I have already traveled by foot the length and breadth of the Sierra Peter's advise, given at Camping Paradise in Italy, on camping in one spot and exploring the area during the days makes good sense these days.

Thomas

[Alan Klein]

Mark is right. They were offered parallel, and for a good reason. One is more portable and lighter, especially if you factor in the significant difference in size of an accessory center filter, or any other filters (67mm vs 82mm). But the argument for the 4.5 lens is that it offers much brighter focus and viewing in dimly-lit situations, like architectural interiors as a prime example - that's why I personally owned one and appreciated the f/4.5 aperture. I sometimes had to prop the tripod up high overlooking a railing or something like that where I needed to focus with filters on, because it would be too clumsy to attach that after focus. And I remember at least one instance in the mountains around 13,000 ft, with the rig atop a barely large enough slab protruding over 500 ft of thin air - me just leaning forward to close and cock the shutter was spooky enough! Anyway ... both varieties of 90 are optically excellent.

Just a reminder, Drew, that you sold me your f4.5 90mm with Schneider IV center filter. I also have a 75mm without a center filter so I probably ought to sell the 90mm.


90mm ( I think without the CF) (Tmax 400): https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50009438141_c76adf1ac0_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jcarE6)
Craig House 2 (https://flic.kr/p/2jcarE6) by Alan Klein (https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanklein2000/), on Flickr

Nikkor 90mm f4.5 with Schneider IV Center Filter:

[neil poulsen]

Sounds right to me - smaller/lighter vs. bigger/brighter.

And, the 90mm f8 Nikon lens is an 8 element lens that has the same image circle (235mm) as most f5.6 90mm super wide lenses. That's the clincher for me, and why I prefer it to any f5.6 version.