Shutter Speed... Flash... What Difference Does It Make?

[Tin Can]

This is a great demo from KEH by Matt Day

I never tested this as I am using slow sync with old shutters

Short and quick, very interesting

https://youtu.be/sRLTMF7dMM4

[Bernice Loui]

Also why Hasselblad 500 "V" series with leaf shutter lenses became SO popular with wedding and similar photographers and why the Hasselblad "F" focal plane bodies were far less popular. In lens leaf shutters allows electronic sync at all shutter speeds. This offered a means to control lighting ratio of ambient light (sunlight, indoor lighting and etc) to electronic strobe. This plus a 200w/s Norman 200B plus a good incident flash meter were the basic tools for this kind of image making circa early 70's to late 80's and sort of into the 90's.

Back in them days, multi kilowatt/second studio electronic flash units with a large variety of light modifiers and all related offered the best means to control lighting for sheet film view camera images.

This is much about lighting and lighting ratios and how they can be controlled using the various tools available.


Bernice
Hoping there will come a time that will allow me to used multi 1200w/s portable electronic flash units with a variety of light modifiers and 5x7 Sinar and a variety of lenses for a community portrait project in the future.

[Tin Can]

I too hope for safe air soon

I prefer to photograph people

I am setting up a push cart for my porch and yard

Big camera, big film etc

Like wheelbarrow as tripod

If I get strong maybe the 1/2 mile to tiny village!

[jnantz]

late 1980s annual report photographers loved to use mixed ( hot and strobe and ambient ) and drag the shutters to give that warm and fuzzy look

[Tin Can]

I know of that, but never did it


late 1980s annual report photographers loved to use mixed ( hot and strobe and ambient ) and drag the shutters to give that warm and fuzzy look

[jnantz]

I know of that, but never did it

sounds like you'll have fun :) ( no CEO needed :) )

I hope you post some of your results!

[Tin Can]

I always find Fun AND Trouble

I have a positive Altitude (sp) intended

I also know when to retreat


sounds like you'll have fun :) ( no CEO needed :) )

I hope you post some of your results!

[MCarter]

I know of that, but never did it

I love that look, but sometimes I'll crank the focus after the flash fires, it's a cool look.
226692

[LabRat]

Old flash commandment;

Aperture controls the flash exposure, shutter controls the ambient light exposure...

Steve K

[JLNims]

Per the video the OP linked to, the video was concentrating on TTL flash. I never use it personally; not because I'm against it or those who do use it. My technique is to set the flash power to the camera settings. I choose the aperture for OOF; and then choose the shutter speed for the intended exposure and ISO. Using a flash meter, I adjust the flash power to match the camera settings. I always get just what I was creating for the photo. Also, this technique allows for bracketing if I think the project needs it (which never occurs).

Yeah, I know....I'm old :cool:

[Willie]

late 1980s annual report photographers loved to use mixed ( hot and strobe and ambient ) and drag the shutters to give that warm and fuzzy look

Nothing was "dragged". Slower shutter speeds are used.

[Ironage]

Another effect is extremely slow shutter speeds at night with the moving light of cars and such. The close subject lit by the flash will be clear and everything else blurs.

[BrianShaw]

Nothing was "dragged". Slower shutter speeds are used.

LOL… I know what John means but “drag”, if I’m not mistaken, is a digital camera term; As a predominantly film photographer I still don’t exactly understand it. Using slower shutter speed I understand!

[Bernice Loui]

Another means to control lighting ratio.

Power of flash can be "key" light.
Shutter time can be "fill" light.

This Foto practice goes back a very, very long time ago, since electronic flash-strobe became commonly available.
Works with flash bulbs too.



Bernice



Old flash commandment;

Aperture controls the flash exposure, shutter controls the ambient light exposure...

Steve K

[Jody_S]

Power of flash can be "key" light.
Shutter time can be "fill" light.

I've always done the opposite. But then I rarely shoot in studio, when you're outside you can't overpower the sun with your flash even on a cloudy day. Then I see wedding photogs working outside with their flash on bounce mode, pointing straight up.

[Dugan]

"Drag the shutter" is not a new/digi expression...we did it and called it that in the '80's. Then 35mm cameras with dedicated flashes improved, and second curtain sync with TTL metering came along and made it effortless.

[MCarter]

I've always done the opposite. But then I rarely shoot in studio, when you're outside you can't overpower the sun with your flash even on a cloudy day. Then I see wedding photogs working outside with their flash on bounce mode, pointing straight up.

That's where high-speed TTL comes in; it's a popular technology but the flash needs electronics specific to your camera brand. High speed TTL uses a series of smaller bursts which are much faster duration than full power. I don't know if it's even usable on film cameras, of if for example you get a HS capable flash for your Nikon DSLR/Mirrorless, will it work with AF-era film cameras or not? I think Nikon Speedlights may, but don't know about the aftermarket monolights. I've only messed with it using a speedlight on a digital camera.

It's pretty amazing as far as options go, and it's responsible for some pretty dramatic looks, like full daylight surroundings that seem like heavy ND was applied. And it "just works" in my experience, it's the same as adjusting shutter speed outdoors to control ambient light, but instead of a 1/60th or 1/200th limit, you're now up to 1/8000th. I have an SB-16 (Nikon) flash and it's worked great on my digital stuff, I'd want to test the heck out of it with film (thought the SB is a film-era flash I believe?) And if so, it's probably only available shooting 35mm film vs. larger formats.

But I'm not a wedding or portrait guy in my day-gigs, so not something I'd really dive deep into. In reality, it's a rare modern-era-upgrade that's simple and easy to implement while offering some massive options for exposure and balancing light.

[Bernice Loui]

Overpowering the sun ala "sunny f16" is not that difficult, just requires flash-strobe power or rapid shutter speeds.

Tradition of Synchro-Sunlight Fotos goes back a long ways as it was one of the ways flash/strobe was applied to fill in image subject shadows. The tradition was to essentially balance the ambient light (sunlight, overcast or indoor) with the light available via strobe/flash (flash bulb or electronic strobe) filling in what would have been shadow areas in the subject. Most commonly used in wedding Fotos to this day, Press Fotos and more back in the day.

Back in the later 1970's the classic 200watt/second Norman 200B
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?162285-Used-Norman-200b

plus leaf shutter lens Hasselblad were the wedding "industry" standard issue. The Zeiss leaf shutter lenses for Hasselblad and other leaf shutter cameras allowed X sync at any shutter speed, 200w/s with a standard defector on the flash head produced about f16 at 10 feet, apply the "sunny f16"rule nets about 1/125 second shutter speed (ISO 100) with 200w/s standard reflector on the flash head nets good enough shadow fill. Upping the shutter speed allows using larger lens apertures.

Fixed at 10ft camera/flash (200w/s) to subject nets:

~f16 @ 1/125 sec.

~f11 @ 1/250 sec.

~f8 @ 1/500 sec, leaf shutter limit.

~f5.6 @ 1/1000 sec.

~f4 @ 1/2000 sec.

~f2.8 @ 1/4000 sec.

~f2.0 @ 1/8000 sec.

Key light via strobe or fill light via strobe , alter the shutter speed to achieve the required lighting ratio.

First of the portable uber power portable electronic flash units was the Comet PMT-1200, 1200watt/seconds, portable and works GOOD. Has adapter cables allowing use of Comet studio strobe heads on this portable unit.
https://www.adorama.com/ctpmt1200.htm

Then Elinchrom introduced their Ranger and later Ranger RX which is 1100watt/seconds of pack power. This is the first of the portable studio strobe units with a pile of possible light modifiers that can be used outdoors. 1100 or 1200watt/seconds is not a lot of power once light modifiers are applied.

It was Elinchrom that began the High Speed Sync feature allowing electronic flash sync to 1/8000 second with their Ranger series.
https://www.elinchrom.com/discover/educational/what-is-hi-sync-or-hss/

Canon and Nikon also offered a similar feature. Not long after, Pocketwizard cooked up a Good wireless strobe system with HSS sync for digital cameras via software on their radio strobe triggers. These work Good.
https://wiki.pocketwizard.com/?title=Understanding_HyperSync_and_High_Speed_Sync

Like the Elinchrom Ranger series lots as they are powerful enough for applying light modifiers outdoors or indoors, large power range adjustment (1100w/s to ~7w/s), works with all Elinchrom or compatible light modifiers and accessories (extremely important thing), reliable and lighter weigh once modernized with a Lithium battery in place of the OEM sealed lead acid battery.

Powerful studio strobe packs are not much in demand these days due to the much lower strobe power needs (typically 100w/s is enough) of digital cameras. Strobe needs today for digital cameras are compact "monolights" with a built in lithium batter, wireless com with the digital camera including E-TTL or similar allowing High Speed Sync to 1/8000 second shutter speed, digital camera control of the strobe and all that. Even lighting ratios are applied with in-digital camera software.


Bernice




I've always done the opposite. But then I rarely shoot in studio, when you're outside you can't overpower the sun with your flash even on a cloudy day. Then I see wedding photogs working outside with their flash on bounce mode, pointing straight up.

[Tin Can]

Movie folk overpower the Sun so they can get reliable lighting

Big lamps aiming through windows

Day for Night, long common

I liked 'how they lit it for the latest Citizen Kane movie, 'Mank' (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/03/movies/mank-review.html)

The lighting was impressive

[Bernice Loui]

Absolutely _!_

Lighting in cinema is an extremely important aspect of filmmaking, IMO Fotography IS much about light, lighting and related.

As exampled by Stanley Kubrick:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOLZMr52Wcc

Cinema lighting can demand remarkable amounts of lighting power, Still images has the luxury of being able to apply flash/strobe.


Bernice



Movie folk overpower the Sun so they can get reliable lighting

Big lamps aiming through windows

Day for Night, long common

I liked 'how they lit it for the latest Citizen Kane movie, 'Mank' (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/03/movies/mank-review.html)

The lighting was impressive

[Rone1321]

The longer the shutter is open, the most exposure you get from the ambient (continuous) light. The shutter speed changes the ratio of flash to ambient. Faster speeds have less ambient and the (http://despreserialero.com/dragostea-pluteste-in-aer-episodul-69-70-subtitrat-in-romana/) same flash exposure, while longer speeds have more ambient and the same flash exposure.

[Tin Can]

I have settled on 1/30th shutter for all my flash

As I use Packard Shutters often

Mostly studio Paul C Buff Einsteins, sometimes flash bulbs and NIKON SB800

[wclark5179]

I find this place is helpful for photography lighting:

https://strobist.blogspot.com/


And if you’re interested in lighting just for people, this is a start:

https://www.skipcohenuniversity.com/monte-zucker.html

Lighting is one of the important of the three pillars I came to understand and use with my photography. Two others are posing the subject and composition. I might add that the rapport you have with your subject(s) has an impact on the outcome of the photos.

Of course, there are some technical items with your equipment.

These are important items: shutter speed and also the type of shutter, aperture, as well as the lights and reflectors used. Ambient light is also part of the lighting equation. Ambient light can be a real challenge depending the type(s) being used. Sometimes there might be several different types of lighting in the same room! Operating a DSLR camera in manual mode, capturing with RAW files, gives you best control over how the photograph will look. Most of the time I used Quantum flashes, usually each mounted on a light stand fired with Pocket Wizards. Sometime I’ve needed to mount the flashes using Jorgensen spring clamps. If you’re using a film camera you could start out using a DSLR to review what you’ve got going on.

Within each group there are sub-groups that you need to know. For example a facial analysis made during each client interview and consult on clothing are important.

Props, costumes and the venue used, time of day/evening are important. Lighting at the venue should be considered.

I hate it when I see photographs made outdoors, OK exposure with the foreground but a blown out background, sometimes including the sky. Blue sky is much better than overexposed til it’s white!