processing 20x24 film in a 3063 Jobo drum

[Alec]

Hello,

I am processing some 20x24 films (hp5, fp4, and Portra 400) in a 3063 Jobo Drum and i have some awful smudges on the films. I is made by the slots in the drum (there some of to put some other sizes.
I don't know what to do to avoid them. Have someone a solution.

[Drew Wiley]

Surge unevenness. Much greater solution volume might or might not help. But the Jobo motor probably wouldn't handle the extra weight. Lower RPM with less turbulence might also help a little. But the real problem is that kind of drum itself. You need either a different drum without those impediments or, preferably, need to tray develop instead. Just the comparatively slow fill and drain times of Jobo drums would drive me nuts. But someone else might have figured them out with that size film. You didn't even mention the developer you're using, and that might be important.

[Oren Grad]

What developer are you using with the B&W film? There have been reports of trouble with pyro developers in the 3062/3063 drums when used without the special inserts that Jobo used to offer. With 7x17 and 11x14 in those drums, without the inserts, I've had good luck with D-76. Haven't tried anything so large as 20x24, though, nor ever color film.

[Monty McCutchen]

I was able to eliminate it with my 20 x 24’s by barely turning the drum rotation on. The absolute slowest it would rotate solved it for me. Ymmv

Monty

[sanking]

I was able to eliminate it with my 20 x 24’s by barely turning the drum rotation on. The absolute slowest it would rotate solved it for me. Ymmv

Monty

I did all development of 20X24 B&W film in an old 20X24 Beseler or Unicolor drum, on a motor base that reversed every ten seconds or so. Every minute or so I would lift the drum off the base and give slight agitation up from side to side. Both of the drums had ribs that allowed limited circulation of the developer around the back of the film. I developed a number of different films in these drums with this method, using a dilute solution of Pyrocat-HD, and never saw any uneven development.

Sandy

[LabRat]

The film could be making contact with a rib or something, or flopping or popping around inside causing uneven agitation...

Check to see how well film fits and holds inside, maybe taking a waste neg, loading tank, and fill with water to see if film is held well and not flopping around like a fish while agitation happens...

Steve K

[agregov]

I assume you're loading the film emulsion side up? If the emulsion is facing down, the ribs will mark the negs for sure. I process 16x20 and 20x24 C prints (RA4) in the 3063 without issue. However, one problem I encountered early on was getting some streaking on the prints occasionally. I solved it by washing in-between the developer and BLIX stages. You might try a 30 second wash cycle in-between your developer, stop and fix stages.

[Lachlan 717]

Pre-wash.

It helps to lower the initial “impact” of the developer when it’s at its strongest.

[Alec]

What developer are you using with the B&W film? There have been reports of trouble with pyro developers in the 3062/3063 drums when used without the special inserts that Jobo used to offer. With 7x17 and 11x14 in those drums, without the inserts, I've had good luck with D-76. Haven't tried anything so large as 20x24, though, nor ever color film.

In BW, i am using XTol Kodak developper, and in C41 i am using Bellini kit C41. The trouble is the same.

[tgtaylor]

You need to use the Jobo film clips to keep the film flat against the wall. The clips also make it easier to load the sheet and for that size you will probably need 2 sets: one near the top and the 2d near the bottom. Once you have the clips attached to the tank at the correct locations, just slide the sheet down. You'll hear the distinctive "snaps" which means that the sheet is under the clip and firmly secured to the tank. The tanks ridges allow for chemistry to reach the backside. I never processed film in the 3063 just paper but I have routinely processed 1 to 2 sheets of 8x10 in the 2830 always using the clips. Once, though, I tried processing 1 print without the clips and got bad results. This is a 16x20 RA4 print made using the 3063:


222493

I was thinking about this shot this morning as we have snow in the Diablo Range.

Thomas

[Drew Wiley]

I was wondering if Mt Diablo looks like that today after the hard storm last nite. My wife works near there, so would have seen it. You must have taken that shot from Briones Ridge?

Anyway, back to the topic. I have always thought Jobo drums ran too high an RPM for ideal film dev work. And internal ribs can be a real liability if they aren't smartly designed. I have my own system with a much stronger gear-motor reliable at lower RPM, dual-rotation, Plus, importantly, one offset driver roller to gently rock the drum up and down a little with each rotation, preventing rotation streaks. You can also increase the fluid volume in the drum to minimize surge marks, but that even further increases the cost of the chemistry. Another trick would be to just gently roll the drum back and forth on the sink bed and omit the Jobo machine entirely.

[Alec]

Ok, thank you, i will try it...

[tgtaylor]

I was wondering if Mt Diablo looks like that today after the hard storm last nite. My wife works near there, so would have seen it. You must have taken that shot from Briones Ridge?

Anyway, back to the topic. I have always thought Jobo drums ran too high an RPM for ideal film dev work. And internal ribs can be a real liability if they aren't smartly designed. I have my own system with a much stronger gear-motor reliable at lower RPM, dual-rotation, Plus, importantly, one offset driver roller to gently rock the drum up and down a little with each rotation, preventing rotation streaks. You can also increase the fluid volume in the drum to minimize surge marks, but that even further increases the cost of the chemistry. Another trick would be to just gently roll the drum back and forth on the sink bed and omit the Jobo machine entirely.

Yes Drew, I took that shot from Briones Ridge on Pearl Harbor Day, 7 December 2009, immediately following the lowest and deepest snowfall I have experienced in the Bay Area to date. https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Rare-dusting-of-snow-at-low-elevations-3207047.php#taboola-7 According to my notebook I shot 7 negatives, B&W and Color from the same spot with the 150mm apo-Sironar-S but only printed from a color negative. I'm going to locate the other negatives and see if I can get a good B&W print.

The "secret" to successfully using the 3063 is to use the clips, level the drum on the processor (Jobo supplies wedges just for that purpose) and use at least the minimum amount of chemistry required for the drum.

Thomas

[Drew Wiley]

I'm still waiting for another big roll of RA4 medium, specifically 30-inch wide Fujiflex Supergloss. I have drums up to 30X40 inch print capacity. Meanwhile, on rainy days, I've been making color internegs from masked old sheet chromes, both 4X5 and 8X10, as well as some black and white internegs for silver printing, mostly by contact. The result in print has generally been excellent, really encouraging, with just a few inevitable belly-flops to the learning curve.