Huge Lens Shutter & Adaptors

[Tin Can]

This morning my DIY glue up shutter box to adapt very big lenses to 8X10 Rembrandt

Getting there, this adapter and shutter fits inside the camera, the lens is supported on the heavy duty front standard which can support any lens I have...now

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51015244323_fc0ee03daa_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ3sMZ)Portrait 8X10 6 lbs (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ3sMZ) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51015244388_9ee7cf6523_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ3sP7)NOS Packard Kalamazoo Michigan USA (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ3sP7) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51015972506_4d7d1f95aa_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ7cfS)8X8 inch shutter box extension (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ7cfS) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51016062697_bd52404102_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ7E4T)4 inch ID NOS Packard with Sync (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ7E4T) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[Duolab123]

Pretty cool. Where do you find this stuff :o

[mhayashi]

Tin Can, thank you for sharing your solution to a large shutter.
Is your setup order like lens>lensboard>front frame of camera>shutter box>shutter?
When you finish your DIY, I’d like to see your complete kit configuration!

I’m also about to mount a brand new hand made 9.13” square packard shutter with 5” hole from Jon Gilchrist.
I may choose one of the following options:
1. mounting the shutter in front of the lens
2. mounting the shutter in between the lens and front frame
3. mounting the shutter in between the front frame and the rear frame

I probably choose 1 and plan to make a custom made waterhouse stop that can sandwich an ND acetate filter but I am concerned about light leaks from waterhouse slot (even with a slot inserted) and rack and pinion barrel space of petzval lenses like my Dallmeyer 3A if any. Any suggestions?

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The another bad point of choice 1 is the required shutter hole size tends to larger than choice 2 and 3....
If the shutter hole vignettes then the effective aperture f number becomes larger than the original fastest f number of the lens....

[Drew Bedo]

Pretty cool. Where do you find this stuff :o

One source for a large pneumatic shutter is The Packard Ideal Company:
https://packardshutter.com/

I have a less impressive project on progress with them. They have smaller shutters in stock and can build something larger on request.

I am having a shutter with a 2" opening installed on my lens board with the fittings for the rubber tube and so on. I myself just do not have the minimal tools and skills to DIY it.

[Drew Bedo]

Tangent: I have seen barrel mountd classic/vintage/antique lenses mounted to a "modern" leaf shutter via a plastic thread adapter. this should be more flexible in terms of shutter speed while remaining

Anybody doing this? the photographic "look" on a print, but looks a bit Steampunk or Franken-camera.

[Tin Can]

Yes, I will be posting more details soon

Congratulations for buying new https://packardshutter.com/

I won't front mount a Packard as it adds weight in the wrong place, will add vibration and may reduce value of a valuable lens

I also like to use as inside shutter as then I can fit many lenses on one camera

I have several Packard installations and will post soon what I have done

I eagerly await news and usage of the 5" NEW Packard product

I tried an old 5" ID Packard type not made by Packard Ideal with an extra shutter leaf

It never worked for me or Peter De Smidt

[Drew Bedo]

I was torn a bit on whether or not to mount the Packard to this great looking wooden lens board. I have an adapter board for the Kodak 2D which takes Linhoff/Toyo notched boards.


The latter approach would let other barrel lenses interchange. In the end, I went with the wooden board. Maybe I'll do it all over later on.

[Tin Can]

First step is Modern Linhof Boards, then various adapters

Best adapter is Sinar, but best receiver for Sinar is Horseman

and so on

pictures soon

[mdarnton]

When I set up my Ansco 8x10 I got the largest synched Packard I thought I'd need, then built a box behind the board an inch or so deep and mounted the shutter back there, to allow for lenses that hang out the back, and cut a hole in the front of the board to fit the standard board size from my 5x7 Ansco. That way I can mount any of the lenses I use on the 5x7, shuttered or not, on the 8x10, as well as any lenses without shutters that I want to use on the 8x10, all mounted on the same 5x7 board.

This works well because I only use the 8x10 in my studio and for that I like a Packard better than a normal shutter. So if the lens has its own shutter, I just open it and ignore it. And if I wanted to use any of the shutterless lenses on my 5x7, I could do that, too, but without a shutter. The shutterless lens I like the best, an 11.5" Verito, mounts there, or if I want to use it on the 5x7 I made a front mounted Packard for just that lens by using the mounting hardware for a 3" barndoor--three setscrews to hold it on, so I could use it for any lens in a similar size range.

I've got a 300mm Raptar, the 11.5 Verito, a 360mm Heliar, a 330mm Wollaston and a few others that all fit that same Packarded board. Then the 5x7 has shuttered 300mm SF Velostigmat, 300/6.8 Paragon and some others that fit the 8x10 and can be used on that format or with a sliding split back for 5x8, or a separate 5x7 back.

When I mapped it out, I tried to do something that I could get the most variety out of with the least bother. In reality, I don't switch around much, but I can if I want.

One of these days my shop may open up again and I'll get to use some of this stuff. :-( It's been a year minus 4 days since I was last regularly working downtown! The portrait beat has been kind of slow, since I'm not into pix of people with masks.

[Tin Can]

Just out shower, an eBay Packard was on my watch

Like new from a LF user at a very good fixed price!

I have no idea if seller is a member here

I buy good deals when I see them and use them

The smaller ones are great too, perhaps even better...

[Tin Can]

I recessed my 4" ID Packard 2 inches as I regret not doing that on 2 other cameras

Even then my 14" Verito will need a tiny top hat lens board, as it has no flange and I will mount directly to Studio shutter

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51022878513_fc530c7597_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJHAaX)8x8 to 6x6 to Sinar to Linhof (https://flic.kr/p/2kJHAaX) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51022878603_1e07b6b7ec_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJHAcv)4 inch ID 7,5 inch OD Sync (https://flic.kr/p/2kJHAcv) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51022875958_981a28a603_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJHzpU)Shutter Pin Location Pattern (https://flic.kr/p/2kJHzpU) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51023645921_aec3e15849_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJMwi8)Verito 14 inch (https://flic.kr/p/2kJMwi8) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[mhayashi]

Wow, nice! I want to see the 2” recessed box too!
Some people make the other way, a protruded box in front of the front frame like the example of Eddie Gunks.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_oUrMZL1Jtc

Your solution is better balanced for the lens and for the front frame.

I will post mine after Gidou-san at Toyo camera service makes an adapter for me.
I think the packard shutter is designed to be used behind the lens at least as I can see an obvious space of light leak in between the blades when I look at the shutter closed from above on parallel to the shutter plane....
This doesn’t happen to the modern sinar copal shutter.

[Tin Can]

Here is more about my latest box

Plywood already cur to size from eBay 3mm to exactly square 8 X 8 inches which exactly fit many of my camera lens boards

The 1951 8X10 B&J Rembrandt was sold with 8X8 inch Packard shutter fitted 1/2" behind the 8x8 lensboard. The shutter is held in with 4 rotatable screws with a chair shape. Just move with finger to install or remove shutter which is about about 6mm thick.

I used a 4-3/4" hole saw to cut 3 pieces of the plywood at once in center. A very clean cut was made with an old rusty hole saw. I have a lot of hole saws and a cheap 1/2" drill press specifically for this work. The trick is knowing how to use a drill press and how to clamp it the right way. Do not use fly cutters!

I also bought 16 basswood sticks from ebay, 1X1" X 6" then matched 4 by thickness, no sanding, no sawing

Glueing 2 sheets plywood made 6mm to mount in the OE front shutter position position, 1 for the back. TiteBond wood glue

That stacks up to 1-3/8" add 5/8" to front of lenboard makes 2+" from flange to shutter

The pictures below tell the story

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51025307888_795322080c_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJW3kJ)Wood cut to size from eBay (https://flic.kr/p/2kJW3kJ) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51025703762_74bd1afe28_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJY529)4 inch hole saw (https://flic.kr/p/2kJY529) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51025602581_fd123fe947_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJXxWD)IMG-0180 (https://flic.kr/p/2kJXxWD) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51015972506_4d7d1f95aa_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ7cfS)8X8 inch shutter box extension (https://flic.kr/p/2kJ7cfS) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[mhayashi]

The 1951 8X10 B&J Rembrandt was sold with 8X8 inch Packard shutter fitted 1/2" behind the 8x8 lensboard. The shutter is held in with 4 rotatable screws with a chair shape. Just move with finger to install or remove shutter which is about about 6mm thick.

Thanks for explaining the box. Can you adjust the shutter distance from the rear lens element by the screws, so the mechanism allows various lenses?

[Tin Can]

Not now, but a good worker could

However I don't find that necessary

The first Packard I found and used was mounted in the middle frame of an Ansco 5X7 studio camera

The 4.5" ID shutter was open, so the cone of light was not affected

Tomorrow I will show that Packard inside a 11X14 Deardorff studio camera with 75" of bellows and a very big lens

I need to move the shutter farther back, it will take days for me, as I need to remove front assembly and make new supports


Thanks for explaining the box. Can you adjust the shutter distance from the rear lens element by the screws, so the mechanism allows various lenses?

[Tin Can]

Just to complete this thread

I have 4 lenses that only work on Deardorff Studio 11X14 because of FL and/or weight

500mm R Krouse Paris f6.3 Tessar 7lbs 6oz
610mm APO Nikkor f9 3lb 6oz
890mm Wollaston Meniscus f5.6 2 lbs
900mm Jena Tessar f9 10 lbs 6 oz

The 11X14 also has 10X12, 8X10, 5X7 backs. Most likely I will convert 10x12 to 4X5

The 4.5" ID Packard Double Pumper sticks sometimes and I need to reset by hand inside. It is recessed 1-3/8" with DIY Microswitch sync. It is very old and was moldy when pulled from the moldy Ansco

My Linhof has 9" lens boards that i modified to Horseman front and internal Packard with DIY sync some years ago

Some of my 8X8 Deardorff lens boards have 4 holes to match Linhof threaded inserts allowing me to mix and match. Linhof parts are very rare. Some of my lensboards are DIY the rest Zimba! eBay

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51029349473_9604eec489_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kKhKLe)IMG-0244 (https://flic.kr/p/2kKhKLe) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51030184757_855b4c54f9_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kKn34F)IMG-0246 (https://flic.kr/p/2kKn34F) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51029353513_e2962a4fff_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kKhLXT)IMG-0255 (https://flic.kr/p/2kKhLXT) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51030177877_894a9f1603_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kKn124)IMG-0248 (https://flic.kr/p/2kKn124) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[mhayashi]

Thank you Tin Can for sharing the details.
Now I’m going to design with Gidou-san how I attach the big packard shutter....
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[mhayashi]

Tin Can, here is my solution for my arca. It wasn’t the best solution being mounting the shutter behind the lens.
The arca bellows are simply too small for 5’ hole packard shutter.

The machine work is done by Gidou-san of Toyo Camera Service in Tokyo.

Here are the samples of attaching a 5 inch hole packard shutter of Packard-Ideal Shutter Company to Dallmeyer 3A and Graf variable 14’-16’.

I wanted the packard shutter attachment system to be versatile to most of the large diameter lenses.

The system can use Lee filter SW150 system. I need a lens hood for this system now.

I bought 1, 2, and 3 prime numbered ND filters so I can use 1 ND filter or combine 2 of the 3 ND filters to reduce lights down from 1 to 5 stops depending on the ambient light intensity. The instantaneous mode speed of the 5’ hole packard shutter is 1/10 to 1/8. I use ISO 50 and ISO
100 color transparency films currently.
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[mhayashi]

More pics.
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[mhayashi]

more pics of Graf variable.
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[Drew Bedo]

Ran across this the other day . . .looks interesting.

Has anyone ever seen one of these? It seems to be an air pressure regulator for controlling the effective speed of s Pakard-Ideal type of pneumatic shutter.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/20338873155...Cclp%3A2334524

[mhayashi]

Drew, I can’t see the link.
Are you talking about the electrical shutter?

https://packardshutter.com/

[Tin Can]

Looks very good to me

Well done all parts!



Tin Can, here is my solution for my arca. It wasn’t the best solution being mounting the shutter behind the lens.
The arca bellows are simply too small for 5’ hole packard shutter.

The machine work is done by Gidou-san of Toyo Camera Service in Tokyo.

Here are the samples of attaching a 5 inch hole packard shutter of Packard-Ideal Shutter Company to Dallmeyer 3A and Graf variable 14’-16’.

I wanted the packard shutter attachment system to be versatile to most of the large diameter lenses.

The system can use Lee filter SW150 system. I need a lens hood for this system now.

I bought 1, 2, and 3 prime numbered ND filters so I can use 1 ND filter or combine 2 of the 3 ND filters to reduce lights down from 1 to 5 stops depending on the ambient light intensity. The instantaneous mode speed of the 5’ hole packard shutter is 1/10 to 1/8. I use ISO 50 and ISO
100 color transparency films currently.
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[Drew Bedo]

Drew, I can’t see the link.
Are you talking about the electrical shutter?

https://packardshutter.com/



Does this one work?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/203388731550?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item2f5ae9c09e:g:rv0AAOSwrwtghazg&amdata=enc%3AAQAFAAACcBaobrjLl8XobRIiIML1V4Imu%252Fn%252BzU5L90Z278x5ickkrmmq8hWevtuKE7%252F%252BLfVXth604cGz6DGAzStm0tfGonKXtAv6lcVKMOKwh13dwfCIVqAVp3KltwbZR4sbIfA1XkVOzRF%252F6MS8BdqrOWGcBWPjC6kVLvkkUptfO98IlCn83Fw1NYBT22p48JXUgH3YwET4S6%252F8V7cL%252B%252BcXiocsXkmRYxN%252FYYArlm1APai6ALhH13l4PDmUP84zHClXgmp00b8xwVWBD4x6wKGC%252BJHCykrsv2GjBuYGCauErZoqFiFK95jMcnLFIJSNQ7fPzg8D42rvmV6G5JPg6MwN3OE9XJeXh1YvIWSKwZGXHTwSC4W%252Bd7Lh9OK33sv385lh6CBdsrLB5Ex9Wsv4N5xGhPiKrO1zn8G04rf4VbF1aeYzkM8M9AzfieXldfSfjbC3dH38Tibfd81FPxX0Fp5uxD46A5y49T8aLrLmuM7swa6PbYhu0rz6aQwXEsB%252Fu%252Fdy1hQFsFgeui4csV6FY26%252BP44WFY0nBYPL6x5yIvsiexvFa642XhJJLM5V7gr7jDkkxA%252Bi3Adl0sxmKrrN99%252FOx7JFCZl%252Fls8RIrwrNcfz8RL5RxRIx4ew33oY7T%252FgTIR63yr5CHf%252BE6pqcNByyJ8VU8glxAiuzwf1s0Xw6gO1k%252F4iHriN0jkpCW1wbguolUS%252BPlvwCMr7iwUjAtOX7me24ZMnNLwbRD1vtiIQqZBy0rBVTGA7797evb%252B7bOffrpUJbXtJe3IHjKADH%252Fpa2hXnECLA3DPcUEe%252BGIvpvRE0w6E9uSW1k3%252FcpIYkdlDbk6ydchjrKw%253D%253D%7Ccksum%3A203388731550070cf193cc7a4470a84a9b9e4cd1476c%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2334524

[mhayashi]

Interesting gizmo!
I looked up what it is.

Here is a pamphlet Jon Wilson posted.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=175958&d=1521082075
in the thread here.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?13588-Degroff-Products-air-shutter-release

Apparently the camera coupling part is missing in the *bay.

[mhayashi]

Thank you Tin Can!
I will ask Jon Gilchrist whether the
air pressure cylinder can offset to the edge next time,
since the filter holder is a bit off from the center of the hole.

[Tin Can]

Reading the Advertising copy reveals several historical ways to use a Packard with a hand operated rubber air bulb

I infer some used to put the bulb on a hard surface and punch it for maximum air pressure, perhaps giving a shutter speed increase

But how much?

I have about 10 Packard shutters, observing the bigger the ID the slower they cycle

I have NOT studied the actual speeds for years, I used to check with an iPhone Optical trigger, at that time my good hand was very weak and I had a tough time obtaining reliable open close cycles, Jim Galli gave me useful advice

My hands are much better now

I primarily operate Packards with strobes or flashbulbs, either OE installed or DIY switch Mini Micro Switch (https://www.grainger.com/product/6X292?ef_id=Cj0KCQjwsqmEBhDiARIsANV8H3Yy_xAnYaEtxO9m4SYfysmb035gSbYdon74b-Z1AJvi13Iv4AeP3xIaAs6ZEALw_wcB:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!496359971011!!!g!470148536830!&gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gclid=Cj0KCQjwsqmEBhDiARIsANV8H3Yy_xAnYaEtxO9m4SYfysmb035gSbYdon74b-Z1AJvi13Iv4AeP3xIaAs6ZEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds)

Flash will make all Packard shutter speeds reliable

Whenever I use a Packard I test fire it several times, before the money shot

My goal both with and without added light is simply get a reliable single shutter speed

Yes, 'Bulb' is also great for long exposures



Interesting gizmo!
I looked up what it is.

Here is a pamphlet Jon Wilson posted.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=175958&d=1521082075
in the thread here.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?13588-Degroff-Products-air-shutter-release

Apparently the camera coupling part is missing in the *bay.

[John Earley]

On another note, getting the proper rubber tubing and rubber bulb is somewhat important to the correct operation of a Packard shutter. A bulb that is too stiff or too flimsy won't be very reliable. Stiff tubing is annoying to use and tubing that is too flimsy can expand instead of the air forcing the piston to move.

https://live.staticflickr.com/7927/33723222948_a2540b00ff_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/To1khq)
Calumet C1 8x10 View Camera with R. Knoll Doppel-Rigonar 360mm f5.5 and Packard Shutter mounted to lens board (https://flic.kr/p/To1khq) by JOHN EARLEY (https://www.flickr.com/photos/jacketch/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50072669613_bfdf8b0a48_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jhKwaT)
Ansco 8x10 with 14" Veritar f6 lens on shop made lens board and camera mounted Packard shutter (https://flic.kr/p/2jhKwaT) by JOHN EARLEY (https://www.flickr.com/photos/jacketch/), on Flickr

[Tin Can]

Yes, the correct bulb, wood plug and tubing bought directly from Packard Shutter Co works best!

https://packardshutter.com/

I bought two some years ago, absolutely works best!

This year I discovered I could splice in 30 feet of RO Hard Tubing (https://www.amazon.com/PureSec-Tubing-70%C2%B0F-120PSI-150%C2%B0F-60PSI-Systems/dp/B07D632X1R?th=1) and operate one very well




On another note, getting the proper rubber tubing and rubber bulb is somewhat important to the correct operation of a Packard shutter. A bulb that is too stiff or too flimsy won't be very reliable. Stiff tubing is annoying to use and tubing that is too flimsy can expand instead of the air forcing the piston to move.

https://live.staticflickr.com/7927/33723222948_a2540b00ff_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/To1khq)
Calumet C1 8x10 View Camera with R. Knoll Doppel-Rigonar 360mm f5.5 and Packard Shutter mounted to lens board (https://flic.kr/p/To1khq) by JOHN EARLEY (https://www.flickr.com/photos/jacketch/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50072669613_bfdf8b0a48_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jhKwaT)
Ansco 8x10 with 14" Veritar f6 lens on shop made lens board and camera mounted Packard shutter (https://flic.kr/p/2jhKwaT) by JOHN EARLEY (https://www.flickr.com/photos/jacketch/), on Flickr

[martiansea]

Here's mine; just finished! Mounted in a B&J 5x7 that I'm reviving.
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Not as big as the ones discussed here, but large enough to have plenty of opening space for that big chunky Raptar and my 19" Artar. Was a fun exercise in figuring out how to get it squeezed inside the camera. You can see there's no room to spare. Mounted the air fitting by enlarging one of the shutter's mounting holes, as John suggests is a possibility in one of the recent Packard videos (though he probably didn't think it could be done with the shortest fitting available. Hahaha!) Got the air fitting and #6 pin, along with some fresh air hose, brand new from him. Shutter is vintage and included the original bulb which still works very well.
I have another lens board cut to try to mount this same setup in my Seneca 8x10, but that board is even smaller than this, so it remains to be seen if that can be done. The footprint fits, but the extra bits make it a little worrisome.
First time playing with a Packard and I'm hooked. Love the simplicity, and I'm very much a bulb mode shooter most of the time.

I also have a much larger #6 Synchro with a 2.75" opening that I plan to mount to a Cambo board to use with my SC. But it's so big, I will probably have to mount it outside the camera.