Sinar Norma 8x10 Telephoto Field 1

[Daniel Unkefer]

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50994314511_8a6cdc794d_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kGcc6a)8x10 Sinar Norma Long Apo Ronar 1 (https://flic.kr/p/2kGcc6a) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

I've been configuring this 8x10 Sinar Norma to use out in the field for up to 4x telephoto photography. I have long Rodenstock Apo Ronar barrel dialyte type telephotos right now up to 790mm F14. They made a 1070mm f14 same era and style looking for one but not as expensive as a car. This is all original Sinar Norma 100% except for the clamping plate which was made for me by a machinist friend. I have never seen the original Norma one available. Basically I used this camera for B&w studio portraiture and I am taking the old concept which worked very well for me and scaling it up to use in the field.

Any similar telephoto experiences?

[Torontoamateur]

You do realize you are crazy.. The good kind of Crazy of course.

[Bernice Loui]

Na... illustration of what can be done with a Sinar Norma and what could NOT be done with a light weight flat bed folder view camera.... and this outfit can go a LOT longer if the lens to be used needed it.


Bernice


You do realize you are crazy.. The good kind of Crazy of course.

[Mark Sampson]

The late Reinhart Wolf would be proud. He used a very similar setup (but with two tripods) to make the photographs in his books "Castles in Spain" and "New York". I believe that he used lenses up to 1200mm focal length; he was able to surmount the considerable challenges involved, and produced remarkable work. Best of luck!

[Dan Fromm]

Na... illustration of what can be done with a Sinar Norma and what could NOT be done with a light weight flat bed folder view camera....

Really? Look at this: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AggQfcczvHGNgR3sXW_tFz6TDw4f?e=wOWRcq

A 2x3 Pacemaker Speed Graphic in the rear, a Century Graphic in front, a coupler based on a 2x3 film pack adapter between the two cameras, and a 480/9 Apo-Nikkor in front. I've used it in the field.

[Daniel Unkefer]

Dan,

That's clever. More portable than mine :)

Next I want Keith at Custom Bellows to make a 5x7 to 4x5 extra double length Norma bellows, this will be used for close up shooting. By the way Keith was/is the original bellows manufacturer for Sinar Norma during the era. He still has all the original patterns. How cool is that? Brand new bellows being made by the original manufacturer. Last year he made the "Special Bellows" which is a short 8x10 to 5x7, impossible to find in working condition.

[Tin Can]

I have a B&J catalog showing a Big Bertha

Also this data

"Big Bertha/Baby Bertha
by Daniel W. Fromm" (https://galerie-photo.com/baby_bertha-v3-2013-04-15_en.pdf)

[Daniel Unkefer]

Geoff Berliner at Penumbra shoots with a Big Bertha at NY baseball games.

Dan I like that crutch you made for your Cambo. That 900mm F10 Boyer is magnificent :)

[Greg]

Brings back memories.... Used pretty much the same setup except with a 4x5 intermediary/center standard. Lens was a 1070mm f/12.5 Apo Nikkor (I may be off on the exact focal length since its been a few years). I did use 2 tripods and setting up everything wasn't all that quick to do. Many a time took 15+ minutes to set everything up only to decide not to take the shot. After this happened a few times, decided from then on to just take the shot.

[ic-racer]

My long extension setup on 4x5. I don't have anything similar for 8x10.
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[Jim Noel]

Great ideas. Now I just hope I can come up with a way to couple 2 or 3 of my cameras together to achieve similar.
Congratulations to all!

[Bernice Loui]

Sinar mix-match as needed.
213395

Decide on what the image goals are, then film format and post process methods, then lens, then camera, then camera support, then how to achieve that image goal.


Bernice

[Bernice Loui]

Think this was that Sinar set up.
213396

Or maybe this one..
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Bernice



The late Reinhart Wolf would be proud. He used a very similar setup (but with two tripods) to make the photographs in his books "Castles in Spain" and "New York". I believe that he used lenses up to 1200mm focal length; he was able to surmount the considerable challenges involved, and produced remarkable work. Best of luck!

[Tin Can]

This shot from Ken Lee is why I bought the same lens

Test of 610mm APO Nikkor lens Ken Lee

https://www.kennethleegallery.com/html/aponikkor610/Nikkor610Test.php

[Bernice Loui]

Not just APO Nikkor, APO artar, APO ronar and... They are all this excellent as telephoto lenses when properly applied. Discovered this fact decades ago.

There was a time not too long ago when these long focal length APO process lenses had few homes or market value. Then ULF happened and they became Highly sought after.


Bernice

[CreationBear]

the clamping plate which was made for me by a machinist friend.


Definitely like that plate and the dual clamp approach--overkill for my applications, but I'm always a bit nervous setting up when everything comes down to one collar being screwed-in securely.:)

[Bernice Loui]

Done the double clamp set up, IMO better to balance the long Sinar then add a monopod or similar to the front tripod leg for added stability. Ability to balance the camera at the tripod support point is a big deal when making long camera set ups like this.

Problem with the Sinar double clamp or similar double clamp set up, it remains a single support point that will pivot. The typical routine would be to figure out camera position first, then set up the camera with no lens or bellows to the aprox bellows and camera draw as needed. Then balance the set up, then add bellows-lens, check camera position for image composition.. it will be adjusted as needed. Then add at least one Sinar rail support at front or a third at the rear if needed once the image composition is set up and done.

Single tripod does not work for any camera set up this long due to poor stability. If the wind comes up, serious problems can easily happen. Camera support is one of the primary needs for using really long focal length lenses on LF. One other suggestion, use no center column on the tripod and mount the Sinar pan-tilt head direct to the tripod if possible.


Bernice


Definitely like that plate and the dual clamp approach--overkill for my applications, but I'm always a bit nervous setting up when everything comes down to one collar being screwed-in securely.:)

[Tin Can]

Just for fun, one day I set up 4X5 Horseman with their OE connector plate connecting two 700mm Horseman rails

with 2 base tripod clamps which allowed 6' of bellows draw

Now I use my Deardorff Studio camera with 5X7 to 11X14 as it has 3 more inches....

Seldom, and only for macro

[Daniel Unkefer]

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51000252657_229c1c2f85_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kGHChZ)8x10 Sinar Norma Long Apo Ronar 2 (https://flic.kr/p/2kGHChZ) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51000137426_14b8c4c70a_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2kGH33f)8x10 Sinar Norma Long Apo Ronar 3 (https://flic.kr/p/2kGH33f) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

Further work this morning on my 8x10 Sinar Norma. In my studio man cave, my Plaubel Peco Profia Camera Stand is definately the way to go. It goes easily and quickly from lowest to my ten foot studio ceiling. It is in a bit of rough condition, needs some rust cleaned form the column, and needs a replacement floor wheel, which I have found difficult to find. It is a European double caster of unique design. McMaster Carr and the internet so far no luck.

In my storage boxes I found a modern Sinar Bar for the Rail Clamps. These are expensive new, IIRC I paid $40 or $50 and was happy with that. This morning I went out into my workshop and removed some steel pins using vise and center punch/hammer. I think I will keep the modern Sinar black Knobs on the Rail Clamps, now I can slide the Norma Clamps back and forth super easily to precisely balance the cameras. They look OK on the Norma. Finally I will paint the black bar with Sinar Norma Green oil paint. The Red Stabilizing Rods up top are incredibly difficult to find, and even more more rare, are the Screw In Clamps for the stabilizing rods.

[Peter De Smidt]

Yeah, I've done a bit of that, but it was so unwieldy that I didn't do it very often. I used Sinar P/P2 parts, which would be heavier. The Norma system would be better.

[Tin Can]

Now we need a telephoto TLR

Glenn has it

http://www.glennview.com/sinarTLR.htm

[Daniel Unkefer]

I have all the parts to make the TLR. Sinar says that is very speedy.

I've been a long term customer of Glenn's. He has had some unique things.

He is great for forward mounting Norma lenses to use with the shutter

I like their Rapid Adapters for roll film. Almost as fast to operate as a reflex camera

[Tin Can]

I have been to his fortress

and he to mine

[Daniel Unkefer]

Yeah, I've done a bit of that, but it was so unwieldy that I didn't do it very often. I used Sinar P/P2 parts, which would be heavier. The Norma system would be better.

Thanks for commenting Peter!
What I used to do, was use the 4x5" whilst scouting around. Occasionally I would bring out the 8x10 Norma for the more momentous. Now I am older so it better be closer to the car :) Now I have option of taking out the 5x7

Outside the 8x10 Norma will need two tripods. If it worked in the aerial canyons in NYC for Reinhart Wolf it should work for me. Sometimes he would pile rocks on the tripod legs for stability