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View Full Version : Efke PL100 7x17 film does not fit my holders !!!



Daniel Grenier
27-Jan-2006, 05:46
More of a rant than a question.

I just bought a couple hundred sheets of 7x17 Efke PL 100. I've not used this film in 7x17 before but am familiar with it in 8x10. So this morning I'm in the darkroom loading my S&S holders and wouldn't you know the film does not fit!!! It's not that the film is too long, its that my holders are not long enough. The film is - exactly - 17 inches long whereas my holders can only accommodate 16 15/16 in. I have used FP4 and HP5 without issues in these beautifully made holders but I will have to trim that "excess" 1/16th before I can use the PL100. A huge nuisance at best.

This brings me to the point that in these days a ULF shake downs, perhaps the remaining players can come up with some basic standards. Similar film and holders sizes just to name one.

I'm done ranting now and I feel better. Thanks for listening.

robert_4927
27-Jan-2006, 05:52
Daniel, What type of holders are they? Manufacturer?

robert_4927
27-Jan-2006, 05:59
Daniel, Sorry, I'm still half asleep. I see now they are S&S holders. I had the same problem with Wisner holders. I sent them to Richard Ritter and he reworked them to fit the film. I just assumed it was a manufacturer problem. He also went over the holder and fixed any possible light leaks. they work fine now. It might be a good option instead of having to cut all your film down.

Michael Kadillak
27-Jan-2006, 07:17
And sometimes the willingness of the holders to accept the film on the light trap end can get bound up a bit. Happened to me as well.

Sandy showed me this technique that should resolve this issue to your satisfaction.

Pull the slide on the holder and open the flap. Take a full sheet and rather than put it under the two grooves at the flap end and try to move it the full length, put an entire edge length under the groove at one end and bow the film upward to accomodate accepting the film at the other end. You will see how your film will fit your holders. Sacrifice a sheet of film and turn on the lights and you will see how this works and all will be very well. Been there - done that.

Good Shooting!

Jimmy Peguet
27-Jan-2006, 07:25
Daniel,

I use 7 x 17 Efke PL100 in Sandy's holders without any problem. These holders are the "classical" cherrywood S&S, not the holders made following the Canham's specs. The film size is 17.6 x 43.1 mm.

The inside of my S&S holders is different from my old Koronas : you have to push the film some mm under the wood at the end, on the opposite side of the introduction slot, but I think you know that if you have used other films. If that's not done, the film appears to be too long.

Jimmy

Jim Chinn
27-Jan-2006, 08:19
I know that Kodak and Ilford ULF has always been cut approx. 1/16th under the format specs. Measure any ULF (or any LF) negative from them.

Considering that most film holder designs were made with Kodak or Ilford dimensions I would say the film is cut to long unless that is the standard for Efke. I have heard of other instances of film being improperly cut, but don't remeber if it was Efke and what format.

I'll have to check my 8x10 efke negatives and see what they measure. I never had problems with that size, but the graphex holders I use may have more room.

sanking
27-Jan-2006, 08:47
The opening in 7X17" S&S holders is supposed to be a full 7X17" and it is anticipated that the film will be cut down by at least 1/16" on both dimensions for an easy fit in the holder.

Be sure that you are pushing the film under the lip at the end of the holders where the darks lides are inserted or the film will not fit. The lip serves the purpose of holding the film flat and preventing the edge of the dark slide from pushing under the film.

Daniel Grenier
27-Jan-2006, 09:09
"Be sure that you are pushing the film under the lip at the end of the holders .....".

Well, I did not know that there was such a thing under the lip. Thanks Sandy for enlightening me.

I'll be sure to take a good close look at my holders tonight when I'm back home. If that's all it takes then that's perfect as I really don't relish the idea of cutting down film - esecially the overly fragile Efke.

Thanks again, all.

robert_4927
27-Jan-2006, 11:22
I just measured a sheet of pl100 8x20. It is only 1/32 short of 20" the width however is 3/32 short of 8". I'm sure this could vary slightly with each production run.

robert_4927
27-Jan-2006, 12:00
I also noticed that when you slide it up against the far stop under the lip, to make sure you move it back and forth slowly so you are seated square against the stop. If you have it cocked slightly part of it will seem to long at the flap end on one side.

sanking
27-Jan-2006, 13:00
I just measured the length of several different types of 7X17" film I have on hand, including FP4+, HP5+, and TRI-X, and it is all seems to be approximately 16 29/32" X 6 29/32".

Sandy

robert_4927
27-Jan-2006, 13:38
Sandy, Ilford and Kodak just may have a little better quality control than Efke/Adox and the Jand C films from eastern europe. Maybe it is something John at JandC should be made aware of.

Daniel Grenier
27-Jan-2006, 15:14
Sandy.

Exactly as you said, the film fits perfectly well now after guiding it under the lip at the end of the holder. I never knew of this lip and never looked for such a thing either (too used to my 8x10 holders which don`t have that, I guess). My other film ("rebranded" FP4 and HP5) did fit because it is that much shorter than the PL100 and will fit without having to sit under the lip.

In any case, file this one in the "learn something new every day" category and I profusely apologize if I in any way unduely tainted your wonderful S&S holders.

Cheers and thanks again for guiding me in the right direction.

sanking
27-Jan-2006, 16:16
Hi Daniel,

I was fairly certain that the problem was that the film was not going under the lip. Apparently some of the European films tend to curl up at the ends and will not go under the lip unless you press down with your hand at that point when loading. I say apparently because someone else contacted me about the same problem in early December. I also have had the same problem myself with some of the 12X20 Photowarehouse FP4+ clone film and suspect that the curl may be accencuated by the direction of the cut.

In any event I am very happy to know that you are able to use the Efke film without cutting it down. That would have been a major hassle.