Antihalation layer not clearing with Bergger Pancro 400

[Michael Graves]

I picked up a new batch of Panchro 400 from Freestyle. Earlier tests had looked good, so I bought 20 rolls. The first two I developed came out milky brown and it was apparent that the antihalation dye layer had not cleared. I used Spur developer and Arista non-hardening fixer. After washing and seeing the results, I refixed in a new batch of fixer...to no avail. Has anyone else encountered this? Is there something that will take it off now that it's fixed and dried?

[Fred L]

fwiw, I'm trialling Bergger Pancro 400 in 5x7 and first batch looks fine. Rodinal or HC-110 B, fixed with TF-5. I know they're different bases, but emulsion etc shld be same no ? Wonder if a hypo clearing soak will help or not.

Hope you find out why the layer isn't clearing properly.

[Michael Graves]

Thanks, Fred. I will give that a try and see what happens.

[paulbarden]

I picked up a new batch of Panchro 400 from Freestyle. Earlier tests had looked good, so I bought 20 rolls. The first two I developed came out milky brown and it was apparent that the antihalation dye layer had not cleared. I used Spur developer and Arista non-hardening fixer. After washing and seeing the results, I refixed in a new batch of fixer...to no avail. Has anyone else encountered this? Is there something that will take it off now that it's fixed and dried?

Michael, can we see a photo of the negatives?
Bergger states that a 3-5 minute presoak in water before developer is required. You don't mention if you do this or not.
Also of note, the base density on this film is quite high. Perhaps you are seeing base density, not undissolved anti-halation coating? Admittedly, "milky brown" doesn't sound like base density, but...

[Doremus Scudder]

FWIW, I had a problem with some batches of TMY, in which the negatives came out veiled dark blue (presumably sensitizing dyes that didn't get removed during normal processing - I posted about it here or over at Photrio at the time and got little help).

Anyway, what ended up working for me was a soak in an alkaline solution. I tried weak solutions of sodium carbonate, sodium metaborate and sodium bicarbonate. All three did the job just fine, with the bicarb taking longer.

So, you might try soaking your negatives in an alkaline solution and see if it helps.

I had a couple hundred sheets of TMY that needed this treatment. Subsequent batches have been just fine. I have no idea what the difference is or the problem was; my processing has remained the same.

Best,

Doremus

[Michael Graves]

Last night I soaked one of the strips of negatives for about 5 minutes in a tray of double-strength hypo clearing agent. That didn't appear to have any effect at all. So I mixed up two tablespoons of sodium bicarbonate into 16oz of water and soaked them in that for five minutes. Nada. I guess I'm just going to have to write these off. I presoaked the films for two minutes before developing, as that is my standard procedure.

1. Would more presoaking help or harm the film?
2. Is it possible that the Spur developer is the culprit?

I'm hesitant to develop any more of this film until I have some idea what's going on.

[Michael Graves]

An update. I developed a roll of 120 Bergger in HC110, also with 2 minutes presoak, but doubled the fixing time. I got negatives that had a standard base fog of .07, which is a little higher than the Ilford Pan F, but still lovely densities. Contrast may be a bit high for my taste, so I will do some film speed/development tests AKA Fred Picker to see if I can tune it in. I think the Spur Developer is the culprit.