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goamules
10-Sep-2020, 08:29
Hi all,
As I reported here, the best wetplate forum ever, was closed last winter. I had moderated it for years, Quinn was tired of paying for it, and let it close. Many people learned wetplating from Quinn and the site, it was vibrant and active. Then Facebook became the place for "driveby" questions from beginners, answered by "unknowns", and everyone migrated to that.

I got all the source files from Quinn, but have been too busy with work to try to find a new hosting site. The good news is he contacted me last week. There is another guy he's going to give the files to, who wants to really get Collodion.com back up somewhere.

Same root cause determines it's success as before: everyone wants everything free on the Internet. But sites cost money and time. There are lessons there for this forum too.

Tin Can
10-Sep-2020, 08:43
The first website launched 25 years ago here's what the web looked like then (https://www.businessinsider.com/25-year-old-websites-2015-12)

Now 30 years

I have sat on my 2 URL for 20 years and been online for 23 years

I wish we could buy 20 years now but don't know of a reliable Host that offers that

goamules
10-Sep-2020, 10:39
You're still wet behind the ears! I was using the internet in college (worked as a technician) in 1990! No browsers, pre Mozilla days, you had to FTP or Ping or go to listserves with arcane languages. Was more fun then really. Only hackers knew what to do, not housewives.

A few years later I was working for the Air Force as a contractor. Everyone used Alta Vista or Lycos? for searching. I heard about a new search engine, and started using it, but no one else did yet. It was called Google.

Kiwi7475
10-Sep-2020, 11:54
Thank you for your efforts. Not sure if you are saying that you or this new person needs some help or financial support to see it through?
There are mechanisms available such as patreon and others to gather funding from a small crowd, if needed. Id certainly be willing to contribute to a larger pool to bring this invaluable resource back up again.

Ari
10-Sep-2020, 12:18
Thank you for your efforts. Not sure if you are saying that you or this new person needs some help or financial support to see it through?
There are mechanisms available such as patreon and others to gather funding from a small crowd, if needed. I’d certainly be willing to contribute to a larger pool to bring this invaluable resource back up again.

I'll second that emotion.

Tin Can
10-Sep-2020, 12:30
It's your ball, Garrett

Over and out

goamules
10-Sep-2020, 12:49
No, it was Quinns, but he's moving on. I captured it because I hated all those years of good wetplate discussions to be lost. But didn't know if I would start a site, make a book out of it, what. Quinn is getting someone else that has more time. Just wanted people to think about joining it if/when it returns. And if it takes a small fee, pay up.

paulbarden
16-Sep-2020, 08:08
It’s up and available again, same url:

http://collodion.com/default.asp

Tin Can
16-Sep-2020, 09:02
Wonderful!

My Login name and password still works, but back then I was not serious

seven
16-Sep-2020, 10:41
nice! You last visited 30 July 2017 at 12:35
thanks to the unknown (yet) guy!

goamules
16-Sep-2020, 14:44
Amazing! Now all that information is searchable, and the same questions don't have to be started all over with.

Ari
16-Sep-2020, 18:31
I didn't realize or remember that I signed up for this forum back in who-knows-when. Must have been 2014-15.
Now to pick and glean what information I don't yet know.

Tin Can
17-Sep-2020, 06:11
I signed up twice in 2013

Back then I was still very sick

Very Well now!

goamules
16-Oct-2020, 06:23
Wow, something sure has changed in the wetplate world, or maybe the forum world in general. I just checked in to the resurrected Collodion.com website. There has not been any post since Sept 22nd, basically a month. The days of it being vibrant, with 4-5 posts an hour daily are gone. I guess Facebook with it's myriad of wetplate and vintage lens groups is where people go now, because I know wetplate is even more popular than 10 years ago. I suppose it's like land line telephones, they're going away too.

Tin Can
16-Oct-2020, 06:58
I have been visiting

I thought it was made active again as a database, not a chat space

Many answers are there, no questions yet

I don't use FB Twit

This forum HAS slowed also

The Kids Are Alright (song) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Kids_Are_Alright_(song))



Wow, something sure has changed in the wetplate world, or maybe the forum world in general. I just checked in to the resurrected Collodion.com website. There has not been any post since Sept 22nd, basically a month. The days of it being vibrant, with 4-5 posts an hour daily are gone. I guess Facebook with it's myriad of wetplate and vintage lens groups is where people go now, because I know wetplate is even more popular than 10 years ago. I suppose it's like land line telephones, they're going away too.

paulbarden
16-Oct-2020, 07:42
Wow, something sure has changed in the wetplate world, or maybe the forum world in general. I just checked in to the resurrected Collodion.com website. There has not been any post since Sept 22nd, basically a month. The days of it being vibrant, with 4-5 posts an hour daily are gone. I guess Facebook with it's myriad of wetplate and vintage lens groups is where people go now, because I know wetplate is even more popular than 10 years ago. I suppose it's like land line telephones, they're going away too.

You can definitely blame Facebook for the depletion of almost all online discussion forums. The "get everything in one place" format of Facebook appeals to a majority of consumers, but the Walled Garden concept is contrary to the very idea of the Internet and is toxic to the outcome. It saddens me to realize that by flatly refusing to join the Facebook environment that I am also depriving myself of as much as 75% of the traffic relating to many of my interests. But I am completely unwilling to pay the price to gain access to Facebook's content. Not gonna happen.

Ari
16-Oct-2020, 12:44
Facebook's format is really annoying, glad I shut everything down a few years ago.
It isn't really conducive to in-depth replies and information, more of a "Just put it in H!" kinda forum.

I've been quietly working on wet plate when I can, and haven't felt much like posting. When I feel like it, I'll probably post images here, if anything.
Maybe others are similarly toiling away in quiet anonymity.

Mark Sampson
16-Oct-2020, 17:27
Perhaps few people are posting on that forum because 1) former members may not know that it's back, and 2) newbies have not been made aware of it?
Just a thought... it might draw more visitors if promoted on the various FB wet-plate pages. Or anywhere photographers congregate (like Photrio?)
I don't visit there, or plan to shoot wet-plate much; I have plenty to do in film photography. But certainly the word of the forum's renaissance needs to get out.

paulbarden
17-Oct-2020, 08:02
Perhaps few people are posting on that forum because 1) former members may not know that it's back, and 2) newbies have not been made aware of it?
Just a thought... it might draw more visitors if promoted on the various FB wet-plate pages. Or anywhere photographers congregate (like Photrio?)
I don't visit there, or plan to shoot wet-plate much; I have plenty to do in film photography. But certainly the word of the forum's renaissance needs to get out.

Quinn's forum was a low traffic space at the best of times. It wasn't unusual for weeks to go by without a single post. Clearly much of the traffic went to Facebook, and I expect that is one of the reason's Quinn decided to pull the plug on it.
Now that most viewers believe the forum is gone, I imagine few (if any) of them even have a bookmark to the site now. Restoring traffic is going to be difficult, because I expect Facebook has now captured most of the refugees. Such a shame.

Tin Can
17-Oct-2020, 08:10
Good ponts Mark and Paul

Some of us cannot take any classes, for the usual reasons, time, distance, $$$

I worry about this forum too

goamules
18-Oct-2020, 17:50
Quinn's forum was a low traffic space at the best of times. It wasn't unusual for weeks to go by without a single post. Clearly much of the traffic went to Facebook, and I expect that is one of the reason's Quinn decided to pull the plug on it.
Now that most viewers believe the forum is gone, I imagine few (if any) of them even have a bookmark to the site now. Restoring traffic is going to be difficult, because I expect Facebook has now captured most of the refugees. Such a shame.

That's not true Paul, when I started wetplate in about 2006, there were just two online places to learn how. the Civil War Collodion group run by Bob Szabo, and Quinn's collodion dot com. There were no facebook wetplate groups. On Collodion there were posts and questions and long threads daily. We had such a vibrant active group we even planned a group gathering in Paris to do a wetplate demo at a show. We started the World Wetplate Day, and published a book of the first year's plates done by everyone. I made a lot of friends, many from around the world. Some have visited me. Just like here, on the LF forum back then. Remember when 45-50 members here were the experts, checking in daily, commenting on their expertise, advising, selling dozens of lenses a month, commenting on recent lens sales, gallery openings, and the like? I do. Camera shows used to be common too. Today.....it's crickets. Everyone today on FB does their quick flyby question, and then they filter the 14 FB answers to try to find the truth. There is no community or friendships formed, it's a bunch of meaningless "names" of people you see once or twice and never again. OR, you get one "super user" that runs the group and answers every post - allowing no real discourse - it's his personal soap box.

What I don't like about the FB format (among many things), is it's not a "juried show." Anyone and everyone can comment, answer wrongly, be rude. there are no rules, no moderation, and if someone gets kicked off for being mean, he just switches over to one of the 14 other wetplate groups and starts up again. They're all the same and have all the same members. There's no peer review or expertise. It is....chaos. And the misinformation highway.

Many have started supposed "Brass Lens show and sell" FB groups, basically so they can scoop up the ones that newbies show up asking questions about. The whole FB place reeks of fraud and aggression and politics.

paulbarden
18-Oct-2020, 20:04
That's not true Paul, when I started wetplate in about 2006, there were just two online places to learn how. the Civil War Collodion group run by Bob Szabo, and Quinn's collodion dot com. There were no facebook wetplate groups. On Collodion there were posts and questions and long threads daily. We had such a vibrant active group we even planned a group gathering in Paris to do a wetplate demo at a show.

Garrett,
I can only speak to my own experience, having joined the forum in the Fall of 2018. In my short time with Quinn's forum, I never saw activity on that level, and weeks often passed between new posts.

goamules
19-Oct-2020, 05:33
Quinn's forum was a low traffic space at the best of times. It wasn't unusual for weeks to go by without a single post.

Garrett,
I can only speak to my own experience, having joined the forum in the Fall of 2018. In my short time with Quinn's forum, I never saw activity on that level, and weeks often passed between new posts.

That's why I commented when you wrote "...low traffic at the best of times..." which is untrue. Yes, in the past 3-4 years it died off. But the best of times from 2005-2013 it was extremely active. Like I said, many posts every day from many people. In 2008 I would say facebook was low traffic, especially for vintage camera groups. Those have reversed now. Forums are dead, Facebook is popular.

Here is one example. Quinn himself decided to go with the flow and created a FB group called "Wetplate Collodion Photography" about the time his forum was dropping off, maybe 2013. Within a few months someone opened a "Wetplate Collodion Photographer" (note noun). Someone wanted to be a group with competing ideas to Quinn's. It got confusing which was which, the "....photographer" version was more rigorously controlled by one guy that wanted everyone to agree with him. Then a newbie to wetplate got tired of everyone revering John Coffer, Quinn, and Szabo, and was always trying to do things a different way, some good ideas, some zany just to see if he could. Like creating silver nitrate from old silver scrap - very dangerous. Or trying to tell people you can use regular film developer for wetplate. He didn't know anything, but liked to guess and cause arguments a lot. Eventually, he formed yet another group called Collodion Bastards. As you can imagine, it was full of pompous chest pounding and bragging by people "proving" they could do wetplate in unusual ways. Today, I'm sure there are 5 more "wetplate" groups on facebook. Like everything today, it became factional and chaotic, and "us against them".

From time to time someone asks "should I start publishing a wetplate magazine?" Um...no, it wouldn't sell. When Quinn told me he shut down Collodion.com due to lack of interest, I was saddened as I posted here. He told me he'd give me all the source files and did. I told him I would "try" to put it back up, "sometime", or maybe publish a huge pdf or something. But as I looked at it, I realized it would be a big waste of my time, like it was for Quinn. And since everyone on the internet want's everything for free - it would be on my dime to host and maintain it. Quinn tried to get funding with optional donations from time to time. Never worked. And everyone had run to "no order or rules" facebook groups anyway. I decided to stall.... The other guy took it up.

By the way, Quinn has remained one of the most active wetplate trainers and advocates in the world. He's got Youtube channels, etc. He just gave up on forums. http://quinnjacobsonphoto.squarespace.com/blog/

Tin Can
19-Oct-2020, 05:40
Never going back to FB OR Instagram

They are both owned by the same idiot and interconnected

We do need need to pump this forum

I am sad so many have deserted

RyanSem
23-Oct-2020, 12:57
Figured I'd make an account here simply to ask if collodion.com is actively managed. I made an account last week and can't do anything until an admin approves me... and there's a ton of questions I need assistance with.

paulbarden
23-Oct-2020, 16:48
Figured I'd make an account here simply to ask if collodion.com is actively managed. I made an account last week and can't do anything until an admin approves me... and there's a ton of questions I need assistance with.

Many of the same wet plate people are here as well. You have access to plenty of knowledge in the wet plate section of this forum, so feel free to ask your questions.

goamules
28-Oct-2020, 17:06
I just pinged Quinn to tell the new Admin to get on the ball. I hope you can at least search the copious answers to almost every question on that site. No need to ask them again....read the site.