Help with developing results good and bad

[Borris63]

Hello

I would be very grateful if anybody could help me with the following issue I am having.

I am not sure what I am doing wrong, I am developing 5x4 sheets, most come out really good but I am also getting a number of really bad ones. Only started developing myself these last three months and I use the Stearman-SP-445. I maybe wrong but I don't think the fault is at exposure, I am very careful and methodical, it seems a chemical issue but why would I be able to achieve good results in one process.

Attached are 4no images all taken on one day and processed at the same time. I have also tried different film holders and it makes no difference.

I only started doing my own film photography for the last 18 months, maybe I am doing something wrong in my whole process?

Many Thanks:

[Doremus Scudder]

Maybe you could describe the problem you think you have? And post an unmanipulated image of the negatives in question which include the rebate? That would help us a lot in trying to diagnose your problem.

Doremus

[ic-racer]

The images with the house and gate and the people at the table both look like they were printed on expired or fogged paper or snatched from the developer too soon. I usually keep the prints face down and process for a fixed time to avoid that.

As already posted, more information on your process would help.

[Borris63]

Thank you for your replies,

The Image are not printed, I develop and scan as follows:

1. I load 4no negatives in a Stearman SP-445 tank in a developing bag
2. I use Ilford 3 at a ratio of (1+14) Ilford stop bath (1+19) and ilford fixer (1+4)
3. Pre -wash at 20 degrees (all chemicals at 20 degrees)
4. Develop at 7:30m SB 1:00, Fixer 5:00 and final wash for around 7:00
5. I Scan the negatives in an Epson V600. The scanner I know is not for 5x4 but I bought a 5x4 negative holder and scan the neg in two positions and stitch together in affinity photo.

I have attached 4no images, showing the uncropped edge, the scanner though will only let me show the image if the frame without the edge. I made a screen shot instead. I also took one positive screenshot to show. I can see that this is very overexposed due to being completely dark but this would not account for the quality of the final foggy and unclear scan.

I am only wondering if the 2no negative holders in the stearman Press, the 2no negatives loaded that would face each other is the issue. Negs facing towards the outer edge of the tank there is more room and onew facing inwards is very tight. Could the chemicals not be circulating over those properly. Although cant see anybody anyway posting problems they have had with the stearman

Thank you for you help

[Borris63]

Sorry I have not really explained well at the beginning. Because I am developing 4no images at the same time, I am trying to find out why I am only getting 2no image developed good and 2no not. Is it me making an error at exposure or in developing. Or is it a fault with the camera, or the Stearman Tank.

The previous image with the house and gate was F11 at 1/125 and the one with the small house was f6 at 1/60. Both taken on a sunny day within 5 minutes of each other, so I am confused if it would be my exposures. My thinking it is with developing but again why are two coming out ok.

This is by the way a regular occurrence

Thank you

[McSnood]

I believe members are looking to help answer your questions however there are variables at play and you may want to look at eliminating them systematically. I would suggest tray developing test shots to see if that improves the situation. Looking at your processing regime I would remove the pre-wash and go right to the developer and see what happens. It does appear to be in the processing and for the members to see a jpg (not a scan) of the negative might give better replies, and include the rebate (edges of the negative). The top 4 images it appears No.1 and No. 4 did not receive enough agitation and No.2 and 3 received more. Are the bad ones always from the same position in the tank, that may be a big indicator. You just started developing your own film in last 3 months and without meaning to insult you and hopefully many here would agree I will add processing must be done exactly the same all the time to get consistent results, good or bad, then you make changes to correct. Suggest you take 4 shots of the same thing, same exposure, see what happens.

[grat]

You don't mention which film you're using, or what speed you exposed it for, but you mention that you're using Ilfosol in the 1+14 ratio. There aren't many film combinations that match up to 7.5 minutes. Delta 100, FP4+, and TMax 400 shot at 200 are the only ones I saw.

You should be loading the negatives into the SP445 holders so they face out (notches in top right as you face the holder), but I would think you'd see the bar pattern on the negative if it was the film holder(s) causing the issue.

Having said all of that, I'm using Ilfosol 3 and the SP-445 tank, and the only time I've seen a result like yours was a severely overexposed photo as a result of a technical problem-- I was using a Copal Press shutter for the first time in the field, and connected the shutter release cable to the preview port, instead of the shutter release port. So instead of tripping the shutter at 1/125, I was opening the shutter wide-open for the time it took to press and release the button, resulting in something like 1/2 second at f/5.6.

Surprisingly, the negative came out usable, but very grainy, and portions were blurry, and the negative itself is extremely dark, like yours.

I'd check your shutter and procedure for accuracy first. A quick and dirty way to test the shutter speed is by recording the audio from the shutter in a program like Audacity (free) and measuring the time between opening and closing clicks.

[Jim Noel]

I think your problem has to do with the use of the developing tank.
I suggest you try developing 2 negatives of the same image together. Both facing the same direction, one in outside slot, the other in an inner slot.
Be sure there is ample developer.
My second choice would be as has been suggested - try tray development.
I have always had students tray develop first and have never suggested any type of tank.

[koraks]

Please post a photograph of the negatives. Not scans. Actual photos (smartphone snapshot is OK).

[Borris63]

Thank you all for your replies which all very helpful. The film I use is only Ilford Delta Pro 100 and I believe the mix ratio is either 1+9 or 1+14 with the time adjustment accordingly.

Unfortunately I cannot make a proper darkroom so can only use the dark bag and the SP445 tank. I do make sure that the negatives are top right but as suggested I need to be more methodical, I will take two shots of the same image and place one negative inwards and one outwards (I have not identified its always inwards or outwards that I have the same problem) if they come out ok, then I will do 4no shots of the same image, place in the 2no holders and see what happens from there.

The Shutter point may be valid also, I have a Schneider 14 142 880 on my Toyo Camera. When I check, although its very crude but pressing the lens manual shutter is instant, did not cross my mind but the shutter release I attach, I could be slowly pressing sometimes which has definite lag to the lens closing. I think I will an take image in bright sunshine (if we can find in the UK) so I can get to 1/125 or 1/250 and use the manual shutter not the release one.

I will take some pics from my phone of the negatives. Don't get me wrong guys I am absolutely love 5x4 (have two and two twins lens) and happy with how things are going, have taken over 200 shots in the last couple of months, all developed by myself. I am getting about 70% to 80% success rate that I am happy with. Just want to improve and improve, I live in Japan and the UK, in my late 50's so hopefully next 10 years will bring much joy. Wish I started years ago, actually only picked up using manual in the last few year.

I think the errors are down to me and appreciate your time to help me it is much appreciated..thank you

[grat]

According to the docs, 1+14 at 7 minutes 30 seconds is correct for Delta Pro 100, so that shouldn't be the issue, since you're using the right temperature as well. Lucky you-- I live in Florida, and getting the chemicals *down* to 20C is a challenge. :)

[Borris63]

204622

attached now two of the negatives showing the good and failure. Thank you

[Daniel Casper Lohenstein]

Hello
I am very careful and methodical, it seems a chemical issue but why would I be able to achieve good results in one process.


Chemical reactions take place uniformly everywhere if the reactor contents remain in motion. So why should it be the process?

The images in question seem overexposed. Is the bellows tight? Is the shutter okay? Is the film holder ok?

The images in question seem rough. Is there reticulation? Were the other pictures developed in the same tank? Then this seems unlikely. - Were the negatives correctly positioned in the film holder? With the layer facing the opening, i.e. the lens?

Where did the film come from? Did you open the package yourself or was someone else on it? Maybe someone is pulling your leg...

[Dugan]

The bad neg looks like it had massive over-exposure...is it possible the lens was left open from focusing?

[koraks]

Yes, massive overexposure indeed. By the extent of +8 stops or more I'd wager. An open lens is indeed a possibility. It's too severe even for the "whoops forgot to stop down" thing I'm sure we all have had happen once or twice...

[cowanw]

But also edge fogging on the over exposure negative

[Pat Kearns]

Yes, massive overexposure indeed. By the extent of +8 stops or more I'd wager. An open lens is indeed a possibility. It's too severe even for the "whoops forgot to stop down" thing I'm sure we all have had happen once or twice...

I agree with the massive overexposure. Looking at the photo of the 2 men sitting at the table I would say the exposure is probably 5 seconds or more. The subject on the right has moved so much that he doesn't have a head. You can see right thru him and see the barbeque pit behind him. The subject on the left has moved some but not as much because you can see some of the rail starting to appear in his head. This happens when the subject moves so much it doesn't leave a latent image on the film.

The two not so good images are exposure problems. I suggest with an empty holder set up a routine of exposing film and practice, practice, practice. Then, with film in a holder, go thru the routine and make the exposure.

[koraks]

But also edge fogging on the over exposure negative
That's probably just halation or light piping.

[ic-racer]

204622

attached now two of the negatives showing the good and failure. Thank you

Thank you for showing the negatives.

The one in front looks to be exposed OK but maybe a little under exposed and over developed compared to a textbook negative for a 'fine print.' May need 1 paper to print well and a some burn in the sky. Otherwise very good for someone just starting out.

The one in back, as mentioned, could be severe over exposure. Like leaving the shutter open by mistake.

[Borris63]

Hello204687

Thank you to you all for taking the time to reply and help me, I thing I may have come to where the errors maybe. I took 4no test shots today using my usual Ilford Delta 100 and developed at 7mins 30 for the Ilford 3, made fresh batch of fixer (Ilford 1 to 4), agitated for 10 secs every minute.

The images were all of the same shot at the same time at 1/125 and f/11. All 4no have come out ok and developed ok. See attached.

That seems to suggest the error is not with my developing but out in the field. I thought I was very precise and methodical but I must be a making errors with the loading of the film holder and/or the removal of the cover slide. It won't be to do with my metering, I am not that far out maybe 1stop either side. But I think the issue also might be to do with the shutter cable, I don't think I was pressing the cable trigger with conviction enough and maybe there has been a lag.

It has though with all your help focused my mind and procedure and maybe corrected my errors. Good to know its not the developing side or my Tank

Once again Thank you to you all.

[grat]

But I think the issue also might be to do with the shutter cable, I don't think I was pressing the cable trigger with conviction enough and maybe there has been a lag.

How firmly, or how long, shouldn't matter with a shutter in good condition. It should either trigger, or not, and should complete the open/close cycle regardless of how you press the shutter release. As long as you're not in "B" or "T" mode, how long you press the release for shouldn't be an issue.

I'd try a few test fires and see if it's working reliably, or sticking.

It won't be a super accurate way of checking, but you can use a program like Audacity to record the audio of the shutter cycle, and measure the length inside audacity and see if you're getting consistent results.

[TimHGuitar]

It almost looks like reticulation. That's when the film emulsion is softened due to too warm of wash water or chemicals and then it is placed into water or the next chemistry that is quite cooler than the previous water or chemical. This causes a shrinkage of the emulsion which gives the image a textured look. Not sure if that helps... but you can check on the wash water. If the temperature fluctuates then this could be a problem. I prefer tray processing and I process one sheet at a time. I don't think this is caused within the camera although your blank sheet of film was.

[grat]

It almost looks like reticulation. That's when the film emulsion is softened due to too warm of wash water or chemicals and then it is placed into water or the next chemistry that is quite cooler than the previous water or chemical. This causes a shrinkage of the emulsion which gives the image a textured look. Not sure if that helps... but you can check on the wash water. If the temperature fluctuates then this could be a problem. I prefer tray processing and I process one sheet at a time. I don't think this is caused within the camera although your blank sheet of film was.

How would only half the sheets in the tank be affected by reticulation?

I don't know why people are so opposed to tank processing. Tray processing has always struck me as the most difficult, and error-prone process, especially for panchromatic film.

I had a negative turn out exactly the same as his two weeks ago-- because of a mistake with the shutter, I basically over-exposed it by 10 or 11 stops. The negative was incredibly dark, but the scanner was able to recover by cranking up the gain. I got a usable image with heavy motion blur and considerable grain.

[Pat Kearns]

Some shutter cables have a small disk at the top to lock and unlock it by simply pressing and un-pressing it. Look at it to see if it is one of those. You may have triggered it by mistake leading to lock open and overexpose your negative. I have made that mistake before.

Glad to see you have tracked down the problem.

[Borris63]

Once again thank you to all, after more tests, it's not the developing, which I am happy about. It's either the shutter or or possible mistakes elsewhere but I am sure it's an error I am making, need to be more methodical, slow down, check and check again.

Cheers to a great community

[TimHGuitar]

Sometimes the wash water temperature will increase and decrease without our knowing it and some films may be affected while others aren't.

[earlnash]

The "bad" negatives are grossly out of focus, so it must involve a problem when you shot them. Maybe the tripod moved, or you hadn't tightened all the knobs (I've done all of this and more).