45mxt and contrast filters

[jtomasella]

I'm just about ready to print. The question I have is do you trim the filters to fit since the filter tray is rounded at one end and the filters are square?

[Louis Pacilla]

I'm just about ready to print. The question I have is do you trim the filters to fit since the filter tray is rounded at one end and the filters are square?

That's what I did when I used my condenser head. Sort of hurts but seems to be necessary for the filters to fit in correct position.

[tgtaylor]

Ilford sells (or sold) a mutigrade filter kit of round filters in rectangular holders with paddle handles that slide into the below the lens filter holder of the MXT and is an exact fit. The filters are grade 0 to 5 in 1/2 step arrangements and also includes a red filter. If no longer available new, look for them used. With the holders with paddle handles allows you to avoid touching the filters.

Thomas

[Doremus Scudder]

If you've got the below-the-lens swing-away filter holder, they take square 2 1/4-inch filters. The corners just stick out and leave some room for handling.

If you have the above-the-lens slide-in filter tray, they take the same-size square filters (I think it was a Beseler standard).

Or use the Ilford clip-on under-the-lens filter if you want and have one.

Best,

Doremus

[jtomasella]

I have both filter holders I bought the 6x6 filters for above the negative tray. It's just that one end of the tray is rounded. I guess i'll be cutting them.

[jtomasella]

That's what I did when I used my condenser head. Sort of hurts but seems to be necessary for the filters to fit in correct position.

I'm guessing scissors will do?

[Louis Pacilla]

I'm guessing scissors will do?

Yes as I recall I made a template so I could trace out the necessary cuts lines needed. Just make sure your using a good set of shears and test by cutting one of your least likely used filters so one at either end. I had little trouble trimming them and once finished they become so much easier to deal with.

[Corran]

I know what you are talking about and in my case I couldn't cut a filter in any way and make it work in the filter tray without blocking some of the negative (4x5). I don't think the upper-stage filter "tray" works for larger film. In fact I'm not even sure how it's supposed to work at all - what's the point of the curved end??

[Doremus Scudder]

You guys must have a different filter-holder than I do. I have a 45MCRX (with the tapered bellows) with an above-the-lens filter holder that takes 6x6cm filter (2 1/4-inch squares), no curved end. My 45MXT has the under-the-lens swing-away holder; again, 6x6 cm square filters... What do you have? Are you referring to the filter tray below the condensers? I have color and cold-light heads on my Beselers.

[Corran]

Yes it's on the actual Beseler 45 condenser head, I just checked. I switched to a condenser last year and have been using that almost exclusively.

My 45 MXT has no above-the-lens filter holder. I wish it did! Neither does the VXL as far as I can tell. I have a plain MX too but I don't think that has one either.

I've never seen an MCRX.

[Bob Salomon]

Yes it's on the actual Beseler 45 condenser head, I just checked. I switched to a condenser last year and have been using that almost exclusively.

My 45 MXT has no above-the-lens filter holder. I wish it did! Neither does the VXL as far as I can tell. I have a plain MX too but I don't think that has one either.

I've never seen an MCRX.

The MCRX had the variable resistor control on the crossbar.

[Corran]

Not sure what that has to do with filters?

Found this interesting website detailing what each letter stands for:

http://www.jollinger.com/photo/enlargers/beseler-45.html

[jtomasella]

You guys must have a different filter-holder than I do. I have a 45MCRX (with the tapered bellows) with an above-the-lens filter holder that takes 6x6cm filter (2 1/4-inch squares), no curved end. My 45MXT has the under-the-lens swing-away holder; again, 6x6 cm square filters... What do you have? Are you referring to the filter tray below the condensers? I have color and cold-light heads on my Beselers.

My swing away is round. I'll get a picture up of the upper today.

[Andrew Tymon]

Did you find a work around for your lens turret issue?

[Tin Can]

Sometimes I just hold a filter in the projected light and move it around to avoid scratches

[thornhill]

I probably don't need to say this, but take note that each Ilford filter also has an identifying number on one end (only).

[tgtaylor]

Ilford sells (or sold) a mutigrade filter kit of round filters in rectangular holders with paddle handles that slide into the below the lens filter holder of the MXT and is an exact fit. The filters are grade 0 to 5 in 1/2 step arrangements and also includes a red filter. If no longer available new, look for them used. With the holders with paddle handles allows you to avoid touching the filters.

Thomas

The Ilford kit is still available: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/24675-REG/Ilford_1762617_Multigrade_Filter_Set_with.html/qa

It comes with a holder but check the Q&A for fitting the under the lens holder Beseler supplied with the MXT. The kit I have is in a heavy duty plastic card-file style box with a see through top. Nice kit - although I don't use it as I use a Beseler 45S color head.

Thomas

[jtomasella]

Did you find a work around for your lens turret issue?
Do you really want to know? I siliconed the lens to it. Worked like a charm.

[Roger Thoms]

I had a 45MXT and trimmed 6x6 filters to fit the filter drawer. As mentioned above I made a template and trimmed the filters to fit. I had no problems printing 4x5 negatives. When I got rid of the enlarger the filters went with it.

Roger

[Louis Pacilla]

I had a 45MXT and trimmed 6x6 filters to fit the filter drawer. As mentioned above I made a template and trimmed the filters to fit. I had no problems printing 4x5 negatives. When I got rid of the enlarger the filters went with it.

Roger

Thumbs up Roger! I do/did the same.

[Andrew Tymon]

Do you really want to know? I siliconed the lens to it. Worked like a charm.

You were determined to print!:)

[Corran]

I had a 45MXT and trimmed 6x6 filters to fit the filter drawer. As mentioned above I made a template and trimmed the filters to fit. I had no problems printing 4x5 negatives. When I got rid of the enlarger the filters went with it.

Roger


Thumbs up Roger! I do/did the same.

Please explain further. Are you talking about the area that opens up on the condenser head? I tried every which way and could not get a filter to work without significant blockage of the light. And, is only useful if one has that specific head, and not a diffusion head (at least, my diffusion heads have no filter ability).

I am confused as to why some with Beseler enlargers talk about an "upper filter drawer." To me this implies something ON the enlarger, not head. I have no such thing on any of my 3 Beselers.

[Tin Can]

CB7 But I had a MX with similar, perhaps parts missing

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49445527218_ae2a80c160.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2ikkfzY)IMG-2626 (https://flic.kr/p/2ikkfzY) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49446227117_a4989d7a57.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2ikoQDc)IMG-2627 (https://flic.kr/p/2ikoQDc) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49445527068_8fdc9469b7.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2ikkfxo)IMG-2628 (https://flic.kr/p/2ikkfxo) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[jtomasella]

Please explain further. Are you talking about the area that opens up on the condenser head? I tried every which way and could not get a filter to work without significant blockage of the light. And, is only useful if one has that specific head, and not a diffusion head (at least, my diffusion heads have no filter ability).

I am confused as to why some with Beseler enlargers talk about an "upper filter drawer." To me this implies something ON the enlarger, not head. I have no such thing on any of my 3 Beselers.

Mine has a door right under the condenser and looks like the one in Tin Cans second picture (the left side one)

[jtomasella]

You were determined to print!:)


Yes. If the silicone didn't work I was going to make one using marine tex.

[Doremus Scudder]

... I am confused as to why some with Beseler enlargers talk about an "upper filter drawer." To me this implies something ON the enlarger, not head. I have no such thing on any of my 3 Beselers.

Here's pic of the classic 45MCRX. Note the little handle above and to the left of the lens stage. It is the drawer for 6x6cm filters and slides in just above the rear element of the lens.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/128127754@N02/15320867464

I haven't had my Beseler condenser head out for years (25+!!). I guess it has a place for 6x6-inch filters just below the condensers. I've got a Chromega E 5x7 color head adapted to my main enlarger.

Best,

Doremus

[Doremus Scudder]

My swing away is round. I'll get a picture up of the upper today.

My swing-away filter holder on the 45MX also appears round and there is a round hole in the bottom of the holder, but there is no round frame for the filter, just supports on each side. 6x6cm square filters fit just fine with the corners sticking out.

Best,

Doremus

[Roger Thoms]

Please explain further. Are you talking about the area that opens up on the condenser head? I tried every which way and could not get a filter to work without significant blockage of the light. And, is only useful if one has that specific head, and not a diffusion head (at least, my diffusion heads have no filter ability).

I am confused as to why some with Beseler enlargers talk about an "upper filter drawer." To me this implies something ON the enlarger, not head. I have no such thing on any of my 3 Beselers.

My MXT filter drawer was similar to tincan show on his CB7b Here’s a link to the owners manual http://www.jollinger.com/photo/cam-coll/manuals/enlargers/beseler/Beseler_45mxt.pdf

Page one item #14 shows the filter drawer and page 9 item 17 & 18 shows the filter tray.

This is specifically on the condenser head. Unfortunately I’m not familiar with the diffusion heads so I can’t be of much help.

Roger

[Corran]

Interesting. Neither my MXT or MX have that above-the-lens drawer. Wish it did! Was it an extra add-on accessory??

Randy, thanks for the pics. My condenser opens up but the inside is just empty, with very little room for anything. I do not have any of those pieces and like I said earlier, when I tried putting gel filters in there (Cut to round on the backside) I couldn't get them to totally cover the 4x5 area. Did they have an earlier model with no filter area ability perhaps? And if I put my diffusion head in, there would be no drawer anyway. So in my case, the only filters possible are under-the-lens type it seems.

I do not know if my case is common or the exception!

[Tin Can]

The MXT I gave away had the 6X6 slider for 6x6 filters

My Beseler 23cIII-XL has the swing in and out tray for 6X6 filters and came with a red filter in it, it is a Dichro head with no fan inside or outside, so no vibration

I see B&H sells them new with 230v but changing to 120V would be trivial https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/3981-REG/Beseler_8005_02_23CIII_XL_Condenser_Enlarger_230V.html/accessories

I also see the 12 filter set is kindly priced https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/114880-REG/Ilford_1762640_Multigrade_Filter_Set.html

[Bob Salomon]

Interesting. Neither my MXT or MX have that above-the-lens drawer. Wish it did! Was it an extra add-on accessory??

Randy, thanks for the pics. My condenser opens up but the inside is just empty, with very little room for anything. I do not have any of those pieces and like I said earlier, when I tried putting gel filters in there (Cut to round on the backside) I couldn't get them to totally cover the 4x5 area. Did they have an earlier model with no filter area ability perhaps? And if I put my diffusion head in, there would be no drawer anyway. So in my case, the only filters possible are under-the-lens type it seems.

I do not know if my case is common or the exception!
Why not ask Beseler Photo in Stroudesburg, PA?

[Tin Can]

Addendum

This is exactly what I bought brand new in box hand delivered from eBay early last decade. $125, really!

Beseler 23CIII-XL Dichroic (Color) Enlarger https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/105697-REG/Beseler_8011_03_23CIII_XL_Dichro_Enlarger.html

and i just ordered a new set of 6x6 filters for the other enlargers. I have paid $30 for a clean used set.

[Corran]

It's interesting to see the different models and design changes of the Beseler enlarger over the years. I doubt anyone there or here has the decades-long product history/knowledge to know all of the changes and tweaks to the design and when/how they were implemented (I've talked to one of their sales reps before at a trade show).

Browsing eBay listings, I see only early blue model enlargers with the filter drawer for 6x6 filters shown by Doremus.

I also see different models of the MX/MXT with the non-tapered bellows and more robust lens adjustment system that my VXL has. My MX and MXT have tapered bellows and no way to adjust lens-to-negative parallelism, which has always bugged me.

One must be careful it seems to talk about these enlargers generally.

If I won the lottery I would buy a brand-new (or several) enlargers from Beseler or whomever with their LED light source. Alas, for now I will use what I have.

PS: I have really been loving my newly-installed 45V-XL enlarger, other than the lack of a motor to move the head. With a big bolt to the ceiling studs making it sturdy, I might be using it as my primary enlarger now. Perhaps I will start looking for another one or two...

[Bob Salomon]

It's interesting to see the different models and design changes of the Beseler enlarger over the years. I doubt anyone there or here has the decades-long product history/knowledge to know all of the changes and tweaks to the design and when/how they were implemented (I've talked to one of their sales reps before at a trade show).

Browsing eBay listings, I see only early blue model enlargers with the filter drawer for 6x6 filters shown by Doremus.

I also see different models of the MX/MXT with the non-tapered bellows and more robust lens adjustment system that my VXL has. My MX and MXT have tapered bellows and no way to adjust lens-to-negative parallelism, which has always bugged me.

One must be careful it seems to talk about these enlargers generally.

If I won the lottery I would buy a brand-new (or several) enlargers from Beseler or whomever with their LED light source. Alas, for now I will use what I have.

PS: I have really been loving my newly-installed 45V-XL enlarger, other than the lack of a motor to move the head. With a big bolt to the ceiling studs making it sturdy, I might be using it as my primary enlarger now. Perhaps I will start looking for another one or two...

When I was Product Manager for Beseler in 70 all of the models had a filter drawer. But I went to EPOI the next year and really didn’t follow them afterward.
But Lorenzo Gasperini was with them later for a few years. You might try to contact him and see if he could help find your answer.

[Corran]

Worked there September 1987 to July 1991. Almost 30 years ago.

I have no question to ask. It's clear they removed the filter drawer in newer models. Look them up. Not an accessory, already looked. It's a different design of the whole lens stage.

Edit:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=beseler&N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ma&Top+Nav-Search=

See photos for the large changes in the design of the enlarger compared to most available used (tapered bellows, smaller lens stage). Looking at eBay listings and elsewhere, I only see filter drawers on very old blue enlargers, which as you know was only done 50+ years ago.

[Louis Pacilla]

I have a pair of newer manufactured Beselers M45 series enlargers with the flat black cross supports & each came with (late production as well) condenser heads & Dichroic S heads They have the filter draw & look like this. https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/4543-REG/Beseler_8121_45M_Condenser_Lightsource.html

BTW I have one of the auto focus Beselers here somewhere & it's a monster of a chaise & the matching silver condenser head also has the 6" filter draw & the filters needed trimmed as well.

[Tin Can]

I had a Beseler 5X7 Vignetting enlarger like this http://store.khbphotografix.com/Beseler-5x7-Diffusion-Enlarger-Instruction-Manual.html

It had a heavily and poorly modified stand that was impossible. Hauled it from Detroit, but gave up on it long ago. It's gone. I have the dome. Spun aluminum, not copper like an Elwood.

I also had a Beseler 5X7 cold lamp head on the standard 45 MX chassis. The chassis was very rusted, but the head assembly is still safe and sound. It can mount on any 4X5 MX chassis with 2 bolts.

There are many variations as Bob knows better than I.

[MrFujicaman]

I have a Beseler H 4X5 and what I did was hunt down the series 6 adapter rings that'd fit each of my lenses and epoxy a series 7 to 6 step down ring to the Ilford filter holder.200111200112200113

[Doremus Scudder]

FWIW, the above-the-lens filter on the older Beselers may have been convenient, but that is not the optimum placement for a filter. I never use mine. Nor is below the lens for that matter (although if you have good filters, this is likely the easiest solution). The best place is in the light path above the negative. Even with that, with condenser heads, a flaw in the filter placed in the filter drawer below the condensers can show up on the print; you still need pretty good quality filters for that application.

That's why I like color heads so much; nice even diffused light with whatever color you need. The problem with Beseler is that their color heads all ended up being too bulky, too complicated and too unreliable. I was lucky enough to pick up a 5x7 Chromega head and power supply, which I have mounted on my 45MCRX. I had some spare parts running around and cannibalized the upper bellows stage from one to make the adaptation. Lots of coverage makes me happy!

If I wanted to print with condensers, I'd just invest in the Ilford below-the-lens holder and good quality filters. Whenever I need to use different filtration than I can get with the color head (e.g., a #47 blue filter), I just mount a Wratten gel below the lens in a jury-rigged filter holder; works fine.

Best,

Doremus

[Corran]

My only issue with below-the-lens filters, is I can see a very, very slight change in the focus of the image when using different filters. So split-filter printing makes the image slightly soft. I use Ilford's filters and also notice that theirs a slight softening when using any filter to begin with. My preferred way of printing is straight with no filter, as long as I've made a good negative.