Would a 360 Sironar N cover 7x17" ?

[Jimmy Peguet]

I am wondering if an old huge 360 Sironar N nould cover 7x17" ? Its official image circle is 435 mm, not enough, but maybe as for some other lenses it could work fine. I owned one for a while, it was a very nice BW lens.

Sandy wrote some days ago about the convertible Symmar. Was it 355 or 360, f5.6 or F6.8 ?

Thank you,
Jimmy.

[Michael Jones]

Jimmy:

It was the Symmar 355mm f6.8. It will cover 14x17 and more. It has about a 500mm lens circle.

mike

[Michael Gudzinowicz]

It probably was the 360 f/6.8 Symmar.

Here's a list of lenses around 360mm in length for 7x17 which might help you.

Len f/# Model E/G Shutter ICmm ICdeg Movement in.
355 7.7 Goerz Dagor 6/2 n.a. 674 87 4.5; 6.9
355 9 Schneider Graphic Claron 6/2 n.a. 479 68 0.4; 1.0
360 6.8 Schneider Symmar 6/2 n.a. 604 80 3.0; 5.1
360 9 Kyvyx APO-Kyvytar n.a. 3 523 72 1.4; 2.6
360 6.8 Calumet Caltar SII n.a. n.a. 504 70 1.0; 1.9
360 10 Fujinon AS 6/4 1 504 70 1.0; 1.9
360 5.6 Schneider Symmar 6/4 n.a. 504 70 1.0; 1.9
360 5.6 Nikkor W 6/4 3 495 69 0.8; 1.6
360 6.8 Schneider APO Symmar 6/4 3 495 69 0.8; 1.6
360 6.8 Schneider Symmar S 6/4 3 495 69 0.8; 1.6
360 6.5 Fujinon CM-W 6/6 3 486 68 0.6; 1.2
360 6.3 Fujinon NWS 6/6 n.a. 486 68 0.6; 1.2
360 6.3 Fujinon W 6/4 3 486 68 0.6; 1.2
360 6.8 Rodenstock APO Sironar S 6/4 3 468 66 0.2; 0.5
375 6.3 Calumet Caltar n.a. n.a. 469 64 0.2; 0.5

[Struan Gray]

The 360 mm f5.6 Symmar became a 355 f5.6 Symmar when Schneider switched from a Compound 5 to a Copal 3 shutter. As far as I know, the glass is actually the same, and they just adjusted the spec. within ISO allowances to accound for the slightly smaller maximum physical aperture.

The 360 f6.8 is of Dagor type, hence the greater coverage over the later f5.6 Plasmat.

I have a 360 f5.6, which lights up 12x15" nicely. 7x17 should be no problem. That said, multicoated 360 Plasmats like the Symmar-S and Sironar-N seem to be going for very low prices these days, so you might look at those too.

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

Struan - The 360 mm f5.6 Symmar became a 355 f5.6 Symmar when Schneider switched from a Compound 5 to a Copal 3 shutter. As far as I know, the glass is actually the same, and they just adjusted the spec. within ISO allowances to accound for the slightly smaller maximum physical aperture.

Struan is correct that the focal length of the Symmar (convertible version) did change from 360mm to 355mm when it was "upgraded" to fit into the Copal No. 3 shutter. However, the aperture also changed from f5.6 to f6.8 due to the smaller throat size of the Copal No. 3 shutter. The converted focal length (620mm) remained unchanged, but the max. aperture was also reduced (from f12 to f16). I recently bought one from a seller off the German eBay site. By coincidence, it just arrived yesterday. Here's a photo of it:

http://www.thalmann.com/Ebay/355mm_Symmar_11893097.JPG

One thing to watch for on these older Symmars (in addition to the well-known "Schneideritis") is haze between the elements. I have three of these lenses (180mm, 300mm and this new-to-me 355mm) and they all have varying degrees of haze between the elements - likely due to outgasing from the epoxies used during assembly. Both the 180mm and this 355mm are late sample in Copal shutters and both have a small amount of haze between the elements. This 355mm is in otherwise good enough shape that I may pay a professional to disassemble it and give it a proper cleaning. The 300mm I have is older (in a Compound) shutter and has some VERY bad haze in the rear lens group. I fear it may cost more to have it cleaned than the lens is worth. So, be careful when buying these older convertible Symmars sight-unseen.

Kerry

[Michael Jones]

Sorry: I should have been more specific: my 355 Symmar was in a Copal #3 like Kerry's.

mike