Darkroom plumbing advice needed, please

[David Wolf]

Hello All!

Now planning a darkroom, and have a few questions about plumbing configuration, please:

The darkroom will have an L-shaped sink for processing and printing, and a smaller, separate sink to fit a 20x24 print washer. I'm still looking for a reasonably priced Hass Intellifaucet in good condition. May end up splurging or going without one, don't yet know. (My previous B&W darkroom work did not have the benefit of such a fine device.) I'll be hiring a plumber to do all the installation work, so I want to have all I need ready to go.

1) Will a single "whole house" water filter suffice, or should I have a filter dedicated to both cold and hot lines as seen in many darkroom pictures?

2) Many home darkroom pictures show two (or more) sets of faucets. Is more than one better, necessary? For what do you use your multiple taps?

3) Is there anything about plumbing your darkroom you wished you had done to begin with, but only saw the need/advantage later on?

4) If I don't spring for an Intellifaucet, is there a brand of mixing valve you'd recommend?

5) Any other suggestions, tips or tricks would be appreciated ~

Thanks in advance to all who respond!

[Eric Woodbury]

Darkroom plumbing is a personal thing, but my setup is one eight foot sink with one hot/cold mixer and three cold valves. Then at the end there is a 30 x 36" (approx) sink with another mixer and two more colds. One of the cold for the print washer and another for a tray siphon. The darkroom has a small dedicated 5gal electric water heater. There is one cold water filter for all the darkroom (up stream from hot water heater) and a shut off valve for the darkroom. There is one final plumbing thing not usually mentioned, but I have a water detector on the floor (like a smoke detector) to detect rising water in case all else fails.

Because of my hot cold arrangement, I doubt an intelligent faucet would work. Print washing is such low flow I'm not sure the intell-faucet would be regulating properly.

Water here is very hard with calcium but not much else. No chlorine, light metals, iron, or pesticide runoff. However, leave a glass of tap water standing and sediment forms in a few hours.

I use distilled water for film developer mixing.

Faucets are mounted well above the wet surface. It is easier to add faucets or places for faucets now rather than later. I don't use all my faucets all the time, but glad they are there. I had to add one after all was done. What a pain. All my plumbing is copper, but latest connections are done with Shark-bites.

I could have put all this in the walls, but I prefer it in the open. If I decide to move again (dog help me if I do), it is nice to quickly disconnect the plumbing and take it along. You should go through the "Show Me Your Darkroom" section here and look at all the different darkroom arrangements. What a wonderful resource.

[Duolab123]

You dont need to spend the money on a Intellifaucet (unless you want one). We recently renovated a bathroom. Delta has a Thermostatic cartridge that goes into a standard rough in. It holds temperature dead on. I have a couple beautiful Lawler chrome plated mixing valves, I scrounged up they are beautiful. You can find darkroom valves on Ebay.

Here's a link to Delta.
https://www.deltafaucet.com/design-innovation/innovations/shower/multichoice-universal-valve

[Luis-F-S]

I've never found the thermostatic mixing valves worth using. Made for showers and I just don't find them that accurate for darkroom work. The Intellifaucet works perfectly. My K250 regulates to less than 1/4 gal/min flow within 0.2 degrees F for print and film washing. You can decrease the total flow range of the unit down to 20% (I use 30%) for increased low flow accuracy. Set it and forget it. Before the Intellifaucet, I spent all my time checking and fiddling with the mixing valve.

I have a single particulate filter before the cold water line splits to go to a dedicated 10 gal water heater. This is shown on the referenced thread. When I was using well water, it filtered out quite a bit of gunk. Now that I use potable water the filter just sits there since our city water requires no additional filtration. I have a hot/cold faucet and also 4 spigots from the intellifaucet PEC line. I usually have an archival print washer, a wash tray, an open faucet to mix chemistry and a spare spigot off the intellifaucet line.

I feed both chilled water as well as hot and cold to the K250. During winter, I use hot/cold; in Summer it's cold/chilled since the "cold" comes in around 80 deg F. I described my setup in this thread:

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?109688-Hass-Intellifaucet-Installation&highlight=intellifaucet

I gave the old photographic thermostatic control valve to someone for shipping cost. FYI, there's a D-250 at the auction site now.

To answer your specific questions:

1. A single whole house filter should suffice. Why filter water that has already been filtered? As long as a filter is needed in you area, the whole house filter should do the trick.

2. & 4. see above.

3. Not really

I would ask what part of the Country are you in and what is your water source? Does your water source even require filtration?

L

[LabRat]

To add to the above, try to locate the filters close to your taps to final filter all of the system before using...

Some locales have better worse water supplies, so dual filters can help if bad (some stuff can get through dirty filters)...

When buying filter cartridges, don't just buy the finest filter, but use the coarse filters, as fine filters can disturb the chlorine in the water that can make it fizzy and milky...

Do not mix plumbing fitting metals together, as this can make an electrolysis condition that can eventually internally badly corrode plumbing and start particles from being dislodged...

Safety shower mixing valves from your home store regulate temp well, and don't cost too much $$$, but do have to be preset to your working temps...

Steve K

[Keith Pitman]

I have a 10’ sink with four plumbing fixtures: one themostatic valve dedicated to print and film washers; a regular mixing valve with a spray hose on it that is used for cleaning up and other miscellaneous functions; another thermostatic valve dedicated to mixing solutions; and a plain mixing valve for whatever I need it for. Easier and probably less expensive to decide what you need now while you are building versus later. A little overkill doesn’t hurt.

I filter both hot and cold separately and change the filters every six months. Put the filters in an area with easy access. I put mine under my sink and it’s a PIA to crawl under there, screw the filters apart, avoid spilling water on the floor, and get it back together without a leak.

I’ve seen Chinese-made thermostatic valves on Ebay that look intriguing and not expensive. Most I’ve seen are listed as tub/shower valves. Worth investigating.

There is a guy on You Tube (maybe “the naked Photographer”), that made his own thermostatic valve. Worth reviewing.

[Robert Bowring]

I use a shower mixing valve and it has worked well. It takes a few minutes to stabilize the temperature but it will hold a constant temperature and flow rate. 198148

[aduncanson]

5) Any other suggestions, tips or tricks would be appreciated ~



I added a second spigot to my sink, connected to a fixed mixer and a foot operated valve. The idea being that I can step on the foot valve to deliver tempered water to rinse my hypo laden hands without worrying about leaving traces of hypo on the valve.

[Tin Can]

Surface Mount PEX

This is a corner of my DR right now. Notice the power strip is highest on wall, Hass has a great controller. 7' main sink with cheap new Laundry sink for the 16X20 Print wash, the 11X14 washer is in the main sink with hangers on it. The Gas Burst is in the second laundry sink. 6 water valves. All sinks have their own P trap and are close enough to be legal when connected. One red air hose has 2 outlets, one 25 PS! to left of of main sink. The other feed 90 PSI to my DIY Gas Burst timers

If you use Pex, buy a crimper don't use all Sharkbite as they cost too much.

Air compressor is behind the wall in furnace room. No noise. All airline, water and drains go through rear wall in one light tight hole.

5 enlargers in the room, 1 5X7 Elwood wall mount outside DR as instructional tool aka lamp.

Covered the one window with blackout white vinyl, tinfoil, 2 layers of plywood re enforced with 2X4 and big lags. Storm room NE corner...

Cheap remotes switch red LED and room light

A work in progress, it was a bedroom.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49173890841_35f87d711b_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hVk3ya)DR 2.1 (https://flic.kr/p/2hVk3ya) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[Doremus Scudder]

Maybe my set-up and my thinking behind it will help with your planning.

My darkroom has a 10-foot sink. My water supply I had plumbed to enter just above the sink backsplash about 1/3 of the way in on the left. The two lines have ball valves that I can close to shut off the water to everything else downstream from it so I can put my darkroom plumbing to sleep for a time when on the road or whatever. Everything downstream from the main valves can be drained; makes changing filters easy. I'm now in the habit of shutting off the main water supply whenever I leave the darkroom.

All my water lines are mounted exposed on the wall or on a painted 1x4 board mounted to the wall above the back of the sink. My water filters are mounted to the bottom of a shelf above the back of the sink. All the lines are exposed and easy to see, inspect, work on, or alter if needed.

From the main valves, the lines go to two dedicated hot and cold Delta filters. From there the line splits; one side goes to a regular utility faucet (hot/cold taps and swinging faucet arm) on the left side of the sink that I mounted on a small shelf. It's high enough that I can fill five-gallon buckets with it. It's also a good source of hot water when I'm using the tempered water for washing or whatever.

I installed a temperature-control valve at the center of the sink. Mine is a shower mixing valve and works just fine for a B&W darkroom. The mixing valve has two outlets with ball valves. One, which is in the middle left of the sink just has a long poly hose attached to it. I use it for tempered water for mixing chemicals, for a rinse tray when toning, etc., etc. The valve on the right of the mixing valve is connected to a long half-inch ID PVC pipe that runs the length of the sink from center to right. At approx. 18-inch intervals along this line I've installed small PVC ball valve taps that are equipped with nipples to fit 3/8-inch ID poly hose. I use I have three of these (one more would have been nice...). I use these for print/film washers, running-water rinse trays, running water for local bleaching, etc., etc. All in all, I have five different spigots along the length of the sink. I still need a piece of five-foot hose every now and then to get water to one end of the sink when the closest ones are in use.

If I were to have an L-shaped sink, I'd make sure to have tempered water spigots and separate hot/cold faucets along each side. Same for the washer sink; a tempered line and a regular hot/cold faucet.

My drain is in the middle of my sink at the back. That minimized the amount of slope I needed to get the sink to drain. I sloped in from either end and the front. If I'd put the drain at one end, the slope along the entire ten feet would have been 2 1/2 inches or so (1/4-inch per foot), which was too much for me.

I installed a three-inch wide drain, which is really too small for rapid dumping of chemicals, etc., so I now have a large 12-inch-diameter funnel that sits in the drain so I can dump a tray full of whatever down the drain easily without the solution missing the drain and spreading around the sink. Works fine for up to 16x20 trays.

Make sure you leave lots of headroom over your washer sink; enough to easily lift out the largest print you plan on washing. I have a cabinet over my washer space that makes life a bit difficult at times.

My cold-water lines sweat when the darkroom gets humid, which is often with all that water and open trays. Run yours so that they will drip somewhere that won't be a problem.

Here's a photo of my plumbing. The tempered-water line extends farther to the right.

Hope this helps.

Doremus

[Luis-F-S]

Easy isn't it? Now that you have all this advice, what are you going to do? L

[Arne Croell]

Here are a 3 images of the wet side of my - relatively - new darkroom (about 4 years old now). Two connected sinks, 2' 8" deep, one 8' long, the other 4'. We have an electric instant water heater two stories up, so I have both a cold and a hot line coming in. They both go through their own set of filters, one coarse, one fine. Even though municipal water is normally pretty clear and filtered, any work on the waterline upstream of you will produce debris in the line, so I think filters are necessary - just check the aerator filters in your faucets in the bathroom or kitchen from time to time. Behind the filters the lines are diverted, one couple goes into the Intellifaucet, the other goes to a regular kitchen faucet at the left side of the sink. The Intellifaucet water then goes to two faucets on each side of the sink(s), one of them with a long hose. I have garden hose type attachments with quick connects on each of them to switch between different washers or the Jobo.

[Duolab123]

I've never found the thermostatic mixing valves worth using. Made for showers and I just don't find them that accurate for darkroom work. The Intellifaucet works perfectly. My K250 regulates to less than 1/4 gal/min flow within 0.2 degrees F for print and film washing. You can decrease the total flow range of the unit down to 20% (I use 30%) for increased low flow accuracy. Set it and forget it. Before the Intellifaucet, I spent all my time checking and fiddling with the mixing valve.

I have a single particulate filter before the cold water line splits to go to a dedicated 10 gal water heater. This is shown on the referenced thread. When I was using well water, it filtered out quite a bit of gunk. Now that I use potable water the filter just sits there since our city water requires no additional filtration. I have a hot/cold faucet and also 4 spigots from the intellifaucet PEC line. I usually have an archival print washer, a wash tray, an open faucet to mix chemistry and a spare spigot off the intellifaucet line.

I feed both chilled water as well as hot and cold to the K250. During winter, I use hot/cold; in Summer it's cold/chilled since the "cold" comes in around 80 deg F. I described my setup in this thread:

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?109688-Hass-Intellifaucet-Installation&highlight=intellifaucet

I gave the old photographic thermostatic control valve to someone for shipping cost. FYI, there's a D-250 at the auction site now.

To answer your specific questions:

1. A single whole house filter should suffice. Why filter water that has already been filtered? As long as a filter is needed in you area, the whole house filter should do the trick.

2. & 4. see above.

3. Not really

I would ask what part of the Country are you in and what is your water source? Does your water source even require filtration?

L

Sounds like a great setup. Here is the upper Midwest one of the benefits of 30 below is no shortage of cold water, even in summer. Your point about flow rate is important, bigger thermostatic mixing valves aren't as effective at low flow rates. My Delta thermostatic bathtub valve holds temp, but at full bathtub filling rate, 10 g / min? In my darkroom I have 2 thermostatic valves I think they are both Lawler valves, one is a Kodak, the other a Pako. These have strainers to protect the valve, I have big canister filters on hot and cold supplies for one of the valves.
No doubt if you really want to use as a temp controlled critical bath, a setup like you have is ideal.

[Duolab123]

My senior advisor. Pistol Pete, Sr. Darkroom Cat. Not worth a darn with plumbing.
198180

[Daniel Unkefer]

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48532539096_c0a9be53f7_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2gWDX2s)Darkroom Sink Finally Plumbed 2 (https://flic.kr/p/2gWDX2s) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49033057343_7623533c74_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hGTeEp)Latest Darkroom Renovation 3 (https://flic.kr/p/2hGTeEp) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48872991611_e77d52c749_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hsJRGp)Washing and Drying Side Sink Preinstallation (https://flic.kr/p/2hsJRGp) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

I have built this (so far) in about a year, working with a rather minimal budget. Prints are exposed and processed in the back room, on the other side, is the expansion (the washing and drying area)

After the first of the year, want to run electricals and further plumbing. Also add additional heat in the back room.

[Willie]

A whole house filter is good to have. At the spigot, a screw on(garden hose type of fixture) hose with a 1 micron filter in the line helps with final filtration. Easy to do and gives the added protection as you work with negatives. Can be unscrewed and not used for rinse water for prints.

[Daniel Unkefer]

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48680233057_9e97f037ba_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2haGVi4)Eagle Drain Tubs (https://flic.kr/p/2haGVi4) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/material-handling/drum-barrel/spill-containment/2-drum-budget-basin

A while back a couple of these Eagle "Drum Spill Containment Basins" arrived. It took a couple of months to receive them. I believe they are 3D printed.
I will build tables to hold them, and add drains, and plumb them to drain the water. This one will contain 25 gallons. One will hold my 16x20 Calumet Print Washer, and the other will become a low sink.

Not bad for $63 each.

[HMG]

I would suggest building a water distribution panel that will allow for future changes. The likelihood of getting it exactly right (for you) the first time is not great. Besides, things change. I think it's wise to have a darkroom water shutoff (for hot and cold) before all the fancy valves, filters, etc. Copper makes for a neater install (to me) vs. pex. I use stainless steel braided flex hose to provide

I have a whole house sediment filter on my incoming house water line. I filter my darkroom water again after the temp control. In that setup, a separate hot water filter isn't needed. Might be "belt and suspenders" as I don't see much in my darkroom filter.

The effectiveness of any temperature valve will be somewhat dependent of the rest of your house plumbing. Older homes, with smaller water lines, might have more pressure variability. It's best if the water lines to your darkroom serve only the darkroom.


I remember seeing a Bob Carnie video where he showed his darkroom.


I think it's wise to have a darkroom water shutoff (for hot and cold) before all the fancy gyrations.

[Luis-F-S]

So is Mr. Wolf AWOL or is he digesting all this information? L

[Tin Can]

Darkrooms evolve, plumbing will change.

Sometimes plumbing is difficult to make neat. Dyno Cell 6, the big cell, contains a Cummins Mll (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cummins_M-series_engine) The space is the size of my current DR, a small bedroom. Everything in this disaster removable ASAP. Big water requirements for a water brake dynamometer
(http://courses.me.berkeley.edu/ME102B/Past_Proj/f03/Proj11/discuss.htm)........Those are junk.

Here are the dream Test Cells (https://powertestdyno.com/dynamometer-products/), I used almost everything they show in much smaller rooms.

As foreman I had to force my men to expedite and not make Art. The 3rd shift man was fantastic at Artful plumbing. The last pic is a montage, my Art...

Below is a Cummins MII year 2000 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cummins_M-series_engine) and a Ford

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49182603276_b15b9fce57_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hW6Gsy)1-DSCN0002 (https://flic.kr/p/2hW6Gsy) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49182603241_6539ed1dcd_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hW6GrX)3-DSCN0275 (https://flic.kr/p/2hW6GrX) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49182106808_a1e7c4775d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hW49SL)4-DSCN0282 (https://flic.kr/p/2hW49SL) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49182818512_92b39136e2_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2hW7Nrw)2-#1bwpana (https://flic.kr/p/2hW7Nrw) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

[neil poulsen]

I put all my electrical and plumbing equipment on a single sheet of 5/8" plywood. It rests on two vertical 2x2's that are screwed into the wall. The sweated copper lines and connections are between the plywood and the wall out of sight.

In addition the electrical to the left on the board, there are two different water sources, filtered and unfiltered. The latter are used for washing prints, cleaning the sink, trays, etc. The former are used for mixing chemistry. Filtered lines are run through hot and cold darkroom filters I bought years ago. It's important that the hot water filter can stand the heat.

This took me months to complete while it sat upturned in our living room entryway. But it's handy, because when I leave this house, it leaves with me.

This darkroom board is connected to water through two hoses, and connected to electrical via a plug.

[mpirie]

My senior advisor. Pistol Pete, Sr. Darkroom Cat. Not worth a darn with plumbing.
198180
It's the lack of opposable thumbs that does it.

Still, that's no excuse to criticise his abilities ;)

Mike

[Luis-F-S]

Mine is my third and final darkroom. My next move will be either to a nursing home or a box. Don’t think I’ll need a darkroom in either. My plumbing setup is the same I had in my two previous darkrooms and is not going to change. This one was done by a plumber so it's a little more elegant. That's it.

[Michael Kadillak]

The intellifaucet is the only way to go. Had a Wing Lynch and it was more than problematic. Too many circuit boards. The trick is to find a used Intellifaucet on the cheap and send it in to have it refurbished to like new. Believe it only cost me $150 but since I only spent $100 on the used Intellifaucet it made sense rather than the $695 they cost new. The unit works like it was brand new.

[Luis-F-S]

The intellifaucet is the only way to go. Had a Wing Lynch and it was more than problematic. Too many circuit boards. The trick is to find a used Intellifaucet on the cheap and send it in to have it refurbished to like new. Believe it only cost me $150 but since I only spent $100 on the used Intellifaucet it made sense rather than the $695 they cost new. The unit works like it was brand new.

+1!! Mine was made in 1994 and didn't even need refurbishing. Your suggestion is definitely the way to go!!

[David Wolf]

Thanks to all for the more than generous response to my post! I've learned a ton from all of your experience (and pictures!), and appreciate the time and thought that each of you has given me. Thank you! I'm still putting all this together, and would be more than happy to share the outcome once everything's in place, if anyone's interested.

PS FWIW, I'm still considering the Intellifaucet given the mixed reviews of shower-type mixing valves, however the cost of refurbishment is now $275 as quoted by the very helpful owner, Mr. Hass.

[Fred L]

I just picked up a Hass, but before that, I was putting my Powers Foto panel through its paces. Killer unit but I believe it needs soft water as mine slowed down and clogged with calcium, at least that's what it looked like. Tempted to get new cartridges or whatever they're called but would suffer same fate.

My personal experience with the shower type controls... run ! haha. A non profit community lab I help out at, has one and it's a royal PITA to set the temp. Extremely sensitive.

Also had a Rosy panel and it worked fine, and would not hesitate recommending them.

iirc, a member here, (Greg ?) posted a video or blog about making his own temp control set up. All from parts available at a home improvemnt store.

[Michael Kadillak]

Thanks to all for the more than generous response to my post! I've learned a ton from all of your experience (and pictures!), and appreciate the time and thought that each of you has given me. Thank you! I'm still putting all this together, and would be more than happy to share the outcome once everything's in place, if anyone's interested.

PS FWIW, I'm still considering the Intellifaucet given the mixed reviews of shower-type mixing valves, however the cost of refurbishment is now $275 as quoted by the very helpful owner, Mr. Hass.

Sorry to hear that the refurbishment costs has risen to that level. I can only surmise that Mr. Hass has figured out that if the new units are not moving as rigorously as he would like, the costs of repairs need to escalate to generate a sufficient level of profitability. I will say that I looked at this piece of equipment as a long term investment in my darkroom commitment taking this variable out of play. These units last decades. Playing around with a mixing valve is not where I want to allocate my time. I want to set the dial and know that when the red light is on that is where the temp is going to stay. So if you can find a used unit that has seen better days for $100, it would still make sense to have to refurbished. If you can find one that works for under $300 like Luis did, it is a no brainer. The challenge is being Johnny on the spot when one shows up which they do occasionally. Good Luck!

[Tin Can]

I really like my Hass. Set it and forget it

Controls temp at very low flow to high flow right now

Almost silent yet I like to hear it quietly adjusting

One less variable and I have a high quality analog dial temp gauge in outlet flow

I cover the red leds with black gaff tape as I do with all DR led

[Luis-F-S]

Just bought a second unit on the auction site as a backup to mine. Made a low offer on a K250, they took it, and an RK250 showed up a few days later. Oh well I'll probably spend the few extra bucks to turn it back into a plain K250 without the communication harness. I'm guessing the RK units were used on mini-labs and the like to automatically change the water temperature as required. Kind of obsolete now. Sent it to Hass for a checkup and they said it will work just fine as it is if I don't get rid of the communication harness and the like. I'll see what the total service cost is and make a decision on the remote harness. The problem with these control valves is that they, as with a lot of professional photo equipment, just don't break. Mine after 23 years still works like brand new! Just look at Speedotron strobes, Durst, Devere and Omega enlargers! They just don't die. L

[ic-racer]

Some before, during and after pictures of my mixing panel installation. I don't really use tempered water, other than to fill the Jobo. But this un-used unit was on ebay for $50 (this was ten years ago) so I thought it would be a nice addition.

198661
198660

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[Renato Tonelli]

My plumbing set up is very similar to Arne's (Post# 12).
As others have mentioned, don't skimp on the plumbing - it can be very frustrating later own. I highly recommend the HASS Mixing Valve - saves time, water and no frustration setting it. If possible, place the water filters above the sink for easy access as suggested by Keith Post# 6).

It has been almost a year since I started the Darkroom build (a few hours on the weekend with long hiatuses for work and family obligations). I am just now starting to clean up the space to get it ready for the equipment.

[Luis-F-S]

Sorry to hear that the refurbishment costs has risen to that level. I can only surmise that Mr. Hass has figured out that if the new units are not moving as rigorously as he would like, the costs of repairs need to escalate to generate a sufficient level of profitability. I will say that I looked at this piece of equipment as a long term investment in my darkroom commitment taking this variable out of play. These units last decades. ...... it would still make sense to have it refurbished. If you can find one that works for under $300..... it is a no brainer. The challenge is being Johnny on the spot when one shows up which they do occasionally. Good Luck!

An ancient thread, but at least Hass is still in business. When I bought my backup unit and sent it in for an overhaul, Mr. Hass told me that after the photo labs tanked, the bakers have been using his control unit and kept him in business!! Happy to pay the current refurbishment costs. His units are built so well, with care they basically last for a really long time (forever?). My K-250 was made in 1996 and still looks and works like new! He'll also give you hints to can do yourself to keep from having to send your unit in to the shop.

[FirstImpact]

Oh, building the darkroom was such a headache for me! First, it's not cheap at all. The equipment was about 900$, and it wasn't brand new, so either the seller scammed me, or the prices are really so damn high! Second, it was quite challenging to deal with plumbing, because the studio didn't have any sink, hose or smth else. I tried using a jug in order to pump water into the sink and drain it into another tank, but it was a big pain. Therefore, I turned to Plumbing Gold Coast company (https://goldcoastplumbingcompany.com.au/), because I was sick and tired of this thing, and I wanted to start working as soon as possible. I don't know how did they manage to fix everything, but I wish I had called them earlier!

[Renato Tonelli]

Oh, building the darkroom was such a headache for me!

Give us all the details on what caused the headaches, please.

[domaz]

Give us all the details on what caused the headaches, please.

I'm in the process of building out a darkroom, all by myself. It's a bit challenging because I'm not a framer, carpenter, drywall installer or electrician. But everything is working out so far thanks to lots of research and YouTube videos (although take those with a grain of salt). If you get a contractor to do it, well that has it's own set of headaches and frustrations too, believe me.

[Luis-F-S]

My builder did my darkroom though not cheap no headaches.

[eli]

I suggest a twin filter system, 5 micron to a 3 or smaller, which will have a longer life because of the first filter in line.

You might also consider a 10-5-3 system, which again, will give the two following filters longer life, and be good for years.

Once you make the investment into the hardware, the filter costs very little to replace and if you need to replace them more often than every 12 - 14 months, are definitely needed.

Try "Habitat for Humanity" stores for both filter housings and filters, before a big box store.

IMO.

[Tin Can]

Plumbing standards vary by location. Most big cities have all kinds regulations and laws.

A big one even in the middle of nowhere is 'anti siphon', even garden hose bibs should have them

A darkroom often has chemicals we don't want in the freshwater for everybody in your neighbor, it can syphon right up to the neighbors child. PEX allows for curved shorter piping.

https://www.thespruce.com/anti-siphon-faucet-1824942

I installed what Hass recommends

When I worked in factory every water source had them by law, OSHA etc

My local water supply makes everybody in our tiny town sign a compliance letter, every year!

Stainless pipe is nice and expensive. I used DIY PEX in DR, and just had a new water main installed by licenced plumbers. I paid a tiny bit more for PEX. It's better than anything...else, PEX Test. (https://buildshownetwork.com/blogs/copper-vs-pex-vs-sharkbite-freeze-testing?page=2) I now use PEX bands with crimper, cheaper than Sharkbyte.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50294151041_aa6285c24f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jCjETc)11X14 Mistake Darkroom (https://flic.kr/p/2jCjETc) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr


My plumbing set up is very similar to Arne's (Post# 12).
As others have mentioned, don't skimp on the plumbing - it can be very frustrating later own. I highly recommend the HASS Mixing Valve - saves time, water and no frustration setting it. If possible, place the water filters above the sink for easy access as suggested by Keith Post# 6).

It has been almost a year since I started the Darkroom build (a few hours on the weekend with long hiatuses for work and family obligations). I am just now starting to clean up the space to get it ready for the equipment.

[Renato Tonelli]

I'm in the process of building out a darkroom, all by myself. It's a bit challenging because I'm not a framer, carpenter, drywall installer or electrician. But everything is working out so far thanks to lots of research and YouTube videos (although take those with a grain of salt). If you get a contractor to do it, well that has it's own set of headaches and frustrations too, believe me.

I definitely get it.
I was fortunate to enlist the services of two friends, one a carpenter and the other a licensed plumber. The carpenter helped me with the sink stand and shelving above it. The plumber did all the plumbing to code (including anti-siphon valves). I paid them and it was well-worth it, plus I am not at all comfortable doing plumbing work. The rest I did on my own as time allowed: more shelving, mounting the enlargers on wall mounts, refinishing a salvaged table for the mounting press and so on. I now realize that I have too much stuff crammed in there - but that's another story for another thread :)