Alert about a possible problem batch of Xtol

[Oren Grad]

There is an alert about a possible problem batch of Xtol (2019/08/09) following the recent shift in manufacture:

https://twitter.com/KodakProFilmBiz/status/1197212541753143297

[Nodda Duma]

Anybody who works with subcontractors knows how painful switching suppliers can sometimes be.

[Duolab123]

Say it ain't so Joe!
I think the Ukrainians are just spreading false rumors!

I have just received (1) one package of this from my good buddies at B&H. I have plenty of the old stuff. I may do a quick test. This stuff is also made in Germany?

[NW2Wheeler]

Aw Crap.
Guess which date the stuff I was going to mix tomorrow has printed on the bag?

[Mark Sampson]

NW2Wheeler, here's an idea. Why don't you mix it up, process a test roll, see what happens, and report back?
(If I still shot small-format film I'd be an XTOL customer myself.)

[Oren Grad]

Examine the A packet closely - I think that's where the reported problems have been. If the stuff isn't free-flowing powder as expected - if it's clumped or otherwise atypical - then save your effort and use something else until more definitive information emerges.

[Tin Can]

Now I get news from Kodak on Twit

[Duolab123]

Examine the A packet closely - I think that's where the reported problems have been. If the stuff isn't free-flowing powder as expected - if it's clumped or otherwise atypical - then save your effort and use something else until more definitive information emerges.

I have 1 package of the suspect product. It is clearly labeled made in Germany. New packaging, this isn't the Tetenal stuff. Adox has invested in blending operations. Part of the new Adox Captura technology is employed to reduce dust. The Part A that I have looks very much like the images that Adox has of their fixer.

Could it be that that this is the reason for the difference in appearance of the A side? Totally uninformed speculation on my part.

I remember when NASA hit Mars at 10,000 mph with a lander. It was traced to an English to Metric conversion error. :mad: Yes changing suppliers is a pain, especially when your supplier goes bankrupt.

I hope that this product continues to be available. I will buy more when it becomes available. If this new product has better dust control that would be a great thing.

Save the XTOL!

[Oren Grad]

Could it be that that this is the reason for the difference in appearance of the A side?

The concern is that this may be a re-occurrence of the problem that Kodak had with the smaller Xtol packages years ago, with the package seal failing and allowing moisture to get in.

[Peter Gomena]

We received a large order of the bad batch. It didn't mix properly and didn't develop film. We've switched to D-76 for now.

[Duolab123]

I couldn't resist looking at the A side. It's a clean, dust free, reasonably free flowing material, I got it to flow through a large powder funnel. No static at all, very slight Ivory color, smelled like XTOL. The package (both A and B) were completely sealed.
Material was within 1 gram of weight on package. It's lovely dust free material, I suspect this was a improperly mixed batch.

[Sal Santamaura]

...changing suppliers is a pain, especially when your supplier goes bankrupt...

Pain redounds to the supplier when its customer goes bankrupt. As when Eastman Kodak stiffed Champion. :)

[Duolab123]

Pain redounds to the supplier when its customer goes bankrupt. As when Eastman Kodak stiffed Champion. :)

You are correct. I worked for Maytag when Montgomery Wards went broke, we retrieved some product before an official declaration, still we got stiffed. It wasn't that bad to the best of my recollection.

[Bob Salomon]

You are correct. I worked for Maytag when Montgomery Wards went broke, we retrieved some product before an official declaration, still we got stiffed. It wasn't that bad to the best of my recollection.

But that retrieved product could have been clawed back by the trustee!

[Sal Santamaura]

...we got stiffed. It wasn't that bad to the best of my recollection.

Champion got stiffed for $1,746,376. See PDF page 152:


http://securities.stanford.edu/filings-documents/1048/EKDKQ.PK00_01/2013123_r01c_12CV01073.pdf

[Duolab123]

My new XTOL is AOK. Mine is the suspect date code. Must be a hit and miss problem. 1 strip is new formula the other old. Weird color,
is cell phone picture of a fluorescent light table
197736

[Duolab123]

But that retrieved product could have been clawed back by the trustee!

It never got off the semi trailers. We still lost money, probably only a few million. At that time Maytag was a top tier producer, now it's one of a dozen brands of Whirlpool. The Maytag Repairman isn't lonely any more ;)

[Greg]

While back I purchased a load of Xtol envelopes from a State Surplus store. All 30+ years old. The ones that were still in powder form, like as new, have been working out fine so far. The ones that were in not so pure powdered form but just the least bit bit "caked up" inside, well... DO NOT USE THEM, trust me on that. Have used 20+ year old Rodinal (glass bottle) and Kodak HC-110 from stock bottles without problems. Current bottles of Rodinal come in plastic containers so don't really stock up on them as I did in the past. Using unopened Edwal FG-7 bottles of developer... per my experience, just pour them down the drain. Still have and still use two 5 gallon cube containers of Kodak A + B Kodalith developer dating from the 1980s for Lith printing without problems.

[Sal Santamaura]

While back I purchased a load of Xtol envelopes from a State Surplus store. All 30+ years old...XTOL was introduced in 1996.

[Greg]

XTOL was introduced in 1996.

Thanks, Then I guess 20+ years old :-)
Greg

[paulbarden]

Update: I have received a response from KA stating that they will ship me a replacement product soon.

[Mark Sampson]

It's a shame that Kodak should have had such troubles with XTOL, as I think that it's a great developer. When I worked at Kodak and XTOL was new, we tested it against our then-standard developers (for several specific and long-running research applications). It was a big improvement over D-76 1:1, and we switched over in short order. And after that, all my personal small-format work was processed in XTOL 1:1 (until I gave up 35mm film in about 2010). If I didn't use Pyrocat for sheet film, XTOL would be my choice. I just hope that these troubles don't drive photographers away from a superior film developer.

[Duolab123]

Kodak Alaris is shipping replacement packages for the suspect batch.
My auto plates
198329

[Willie]

The concern is that this may be a re-occurrence of the problem that Kodak had with the smaller Xtol packages years ago, with the package seal failing and allowing moisture to get in.

It was not just the smaller packages, it was also with the 5 litre packages. Somehow they keep leaving that part out whenever the topic comes up.

[robbiemcclaran]

Any updates to this story? Is current stock trustworthy? I need to resupply and really don't want to get any of the bad stuff.

[Duolab123]

Any updates to this story? Is current stock trustworthy? I need to resupply and really don't want to get any of the bad stuff.

No problems.

[alt.kafka]

Any updates to this story? Is current stock trustworthy? I need to resupply and really don't want to get any of the bad stuff.

I've done well with one of the batches that had the exact date of the problem. I think it was basically a labeling or packaging issue, with two part A's, or B's, or whatever. As long as you had one of each, you were fine.