Coating Pt/Pd prints: results to-date

[Ken Lee]

I haven't finished my testing yet, but I have found some favorable results with an acrylic varnish made by Golden. They claim is is made with convervators in mind: it is removable, and contains an anti-UV agent.



It is called GOLDEN Polymer Varnish with UVLS (http://www.goldenpaints.com/technicaldata/polvar.php" target="_blank). The trick is to follow their instructions about applying an "isolation layer" before proceeding with thicker coats. Be sure to get the Gloss version, since the Satin and Matte lighten the low values in the print.



I have been using it on Pt/Pd prints, and notice an increase in dMax. It's not a huge increase, but it's enough to remove the "dead" look that some can have. Not all Pt/Pd images need this treatment, but it's nice to have it available as another tool.



A helpful trick is to polish lightly between coats, with a plastic "steel-wool-like" scrubber, either 000 or 0000. This will prevent bumps and irregularities as you apply more coats.



The Golden Varnish does much better than any wax I have tried. Of all the waxes, Gamblin Cold Wax did the best, (which was very little) but Mr. Gamblin told me that he has no idea how long or how well that wax would hold up on Pt/Pd prints on fine-art paper.



As Bruce so aptly stated, none of these products will likely give you the fabled "air dried fiber darkroom print" look. My lame attempts have given me a deep respect for the people who developed it.



So far, I have had no luck with turp-based varnishes on watercolor-type papers. They penetrate the paper instead of staying on the surface. Additional coats merely sink deeper, until the entire print is saturated, and dries like a large potato chip, but still no gloss per se.



Shellac stays on the surface, but even the best quality Shellac contains some yellow coloring, and this is objectionable on most prints. On the other hand, when applied and lightly polished between coats, it has given the best coating to date. I can understand why it is used on fine furniture.



If anyone has some helpful information to share, I would be most grateful !

[Jorge Gasteazoro]

Terry King reported that if you pre coat the paper with albumen before coating with the pt/pt solution, that you get the "wet" look.....did not work for me, extended printing times too long, but it might work for you... :-)

[Annie M.]

Ken if you intend to use varnishes your paper will require an isolation layer... such as some waxes ... then you can apply the classic varnishes.... (strangely... Marshall's photo oil 'Dryer' acts as a wonderful isolation layer on smooth papers even adding a soft luster and increasing Dmax on it's own) once you have an isolation layer suitable to your paper you can varnish your print to anywhere from luster to high gloss...... the process is rather time consuming though!!

Cheers Annie

[Ken Lee]

Annie -

Thanks - I don't mind the time spent, if the result is worthwhile.

I will try the Marshall's product.

If you can recommend a particular wax, that would be very helpful ! When I tried varnish over wax, the wax was dissolved by the solvent of the varnish.

[Annie M.]

Ken... most of my stuff is still packed away (moved again!!) so I don't have my notes to hand. However, as I recall it would not have been a pure wax but most likely a wax medium (these also contain resin among other things) used in oil painting burnished into the surface... my suspicion is that the Marshall's dryer is a similar product. Also I think there is a wax product specifically for photographs made by Dorlands... if you wish to proceed with the varnishing much depends on the strenth of dilution and medium for the resin of the varnish... you might also wish to consider an acrylic isolation layer as varnishes will also adhere to these. I really didn't end up doing a lot with varnishes as I felt it separated one from the image (also the dust factor was a nightmare!) and am now looking for something to size papers with that will get the dmax but still allow you to 'enter' the paper surface. Cheers & good luck!

[Annie M.]

Just a thought.... keep it simple... they still don't know what caused all the problems with Stieglitz's platinum work.... might have been the varnish or the wax!! : )

aic.stanford.edu/jaic/articles/jaic34-01-001_indx.html (http://aic.stanford.edu/jaic/articles/jaic34-01-001_indx.html)

[paulr]

Ken, instead of the isolation coat, you can also try Golden's Airbrush Transparent Extender. It functions like an isolation coat, but has more levelers in it, and may do a better job of going on without raising the grain of the paper. This was recommended to me by the people at Golden. I also recommend calling them ... their tech support is great.

My teacher used to coat pt/pd prints with gelatin. He showed me how to do it ... not very hard to get good results. Not quite as glossy as an air dried silver print, but close. I haven't heard of other people doing this since then.

[Jorge Gasteazoro]

I haven't heard of other people doing this since then.

Did your teacher coat before coating with the pt/pd solution? This might be just a gelatin sizing and most papers dont need it for pt/pd, although some do. If he coated after the print was made, I tried that too.......it did not work as well to bring back the wet look of the print. I am thinking some kind of acrylic coating might be the solution, applied while the print is wet and let it dry with the coating. Who knows? I am in the process of trying similar solutions. One of the reason we have the "thud" IMO is the shrinking of the paper, it is the only reason I can think for the Dmax to get lower as the paper dries, and it is the reason why a few people do a double or triple pass on the same print. Is there a tape that would adhere to wet paper and dry surfaces?

I know watercolor artists tape their paper and wet it, this might be a way to do it. I tried pre shrinking the paper, but that did not work. So here you have a few thing I have tried Ken, or thinking of trying.

[Ken Lee]

"One of the reason we have the "thud" IMO is the shrinking of the paper, it is the only reason I can think for the Dmax to get lower as the paper dries, and it is the reason why a few people do a double or triple pass on the same print".



Is this the same as filling in the irregularities of the surface ? When I think of a car that needs waxing, I think of the paint having a rough, gritty surface under magnification. Once the wax or polish is applied, the surface becomes smooth, and light which reaches the dark areas no longer scatterswin many directions. The surface becomes more mirror-like, more "plano-parallel", and the light which reaches the dark areas bounces off, so the darker areas look darker. (?)

[Jorge Gasteazoro]

Could be Ken. I was looking at the Golden link you provided and the have a hard Varnish made of acrylic....this might be the ticket. Apply it when the print is wet and it might prevent it from getting too much dry down...

[sanking]

I fooled around with waxes and acrylics for a while in an effort to re-create the wet look of Pt./Pd. prints but finally decided that what I really like about the process is the matte look so that made my life a lot easier. Also, I am inherently suspicious of coating prints as I have seena lot of old ones that have been ruined by various kinds of coatings.

Have you tried coating on fiber based photograhic papers? A fellow from Canada named Craig Koshyk has written an informational bookleet on this and it is not all that hard to make work. And the results are much better than you can get with any coating method I have seen. You need to fix out the paper first, of course, and a special coating technnique is required, but when you get the knack of it it works great.

[Jorge Gasteazoro]

finally decided that what I really like about the process is the matte look

:-) ...specially when nothing seems to work huh?......

I tried the Koshyks method as well as a variation of my own, and frankly the prints to me looked like toned silver prints.....not something I liked.

My intention is to keep the look of the paper and the wet look as well, I suppose this is the holy grail for many of us... :-)

[Ken Lee]

Thanks for the reference. A little googling revealed that Craig has a web site called www.prairieview.ca (http://www.prairieview.ca" target="_blank).



I sent him an email.

[Ken Lee]

Jorge - I have always diluted the acryic varnishes with water when applying them. Just to be clear -you are suggesting that the entire print be completely wet, through and through... right ?

At paper companies, I presume there are scientists or other specialists who deal with these and related matters on a daily basis. Might there also be professors or other experts, who could be consulted ?

[Jorge Gasteazoro]

The Golden site has this acrylic varnish, I think maybe brushing it undiluted on the wet print might do the trick.

[james mickelson]

Has anyone ever tried "burnishing" the paper after the print has dried? Burnishing is done with a hard stone or metal by rubbing the paper with an even hard pressure. I used to make high dollar furniture and jewelry boxes and that is the method I used to bring a luster to the wood when I didn't want to use a finish. I use this method on my hand coated emulsions of flowers on art paper. It doesn't hurt thew look of the paper other than polishing the surface' Maybe give this a try.

[paulr]

"Did your teacher coat before coating with the pt/pd solution? This might be just a gelatin sizing and most papers dont need it for pt/pd, although some do. If he coated after the print was made, I tried that too.......it did not work as well to bring back the wet look of the print."

After. I don't know about it bringing back the wet look of the print, but it gave a surface that's a little closer to an air dried fiber print, with somewhat higher d-max. He didn't do this with all his prints ... just a few. He suggested that I try the gelatine coating on inkjet prints, but since it involves dunking the paper in water, I have a hard time imagining it working. Might be worth a try on a rainy afternoon though.

[paulr]

Ken,

how exactly are you applying the varnish? When I was using the same varnish I was unable to get an even coat by brushing. maybe my brushing technique is lousy, i don't know. i moved on to airbrushing, which solves a lot of problems, and of course creates a lot of new ones.

[Ken Lee]

I diulte the varnish, and polish lightly in-between coats, as is done with shellac on furniture. Ideally, lots of very thin coats.

In my simplistic view, the dMax is ultimately a function of the whiteness of the paper, the darkness of the sensitizer, and the smootheness of both. Coating can't change the first two parameters, but it can help out with the other.

[Annie M.]

OK... I've had a chance to dig through my old 'swatches' ....

To obtain a luster finish comparable to an air dried silver glossy fibre based paper such as Agfa Classic... Dissolve by volume 1 part rabbit skin glue or hide glue (my apologies to all the bunnies) to 6 parts water in a double boiler or over very low heat. DO NOT BOIL. This is a thicker mixture than the usual preparation for canvas prep in painting etc. While the mixture is hot apply it to your paper... as this starts to goo up quite quickly I have found the best method is to attach my Pt print to a board with butcher tape around the outside edge (if you wish to maintain the dekel edge you will have to figure out a different method as I cut the tape off at the end of the process). I use a squeegee to apply the hot glue in one pass over the image.... if you use a brush I assume any marks will flow back into an even surface due to the viscosity of the mixture. You can let the print air dry or use a dryer if you wish. When dry the print is a bit stiff I just give it a run over the edge of the table as the finish is a little plyable and will not crack.

Now... this finish will warm the image and the paper slightly... so no pure bright whites... however the dry down effect is gone... absolutely gone. Another concern may be the method of mounting... I do not use a hot press so I have no idea how this would effect the coating. The test swatches I have here are on Cranes and Kodak PX-3001 (emulsion removed) so I have no idea how the glue would adapt to a more textured paper... you may have to adjust your dilutions according to the penetrability of your paper

This coating once dry will also accept varnishes and you can take it to high gloss if you are inclined to do so.... which reminds me it wasn't varnish over wax as I said in my post above... it was a 'fat' wax over a 'lean' wax (such as the wax mediums & the Marshall's oil dryer) I found the paper experienced less distressing when the wax gels were used prior to the crystalline.

Anyway... keep up the good work and let us know if you find your magic coating!!

Cheers Annie

[paulr]

"I diulte the varnish, and polish lightly in-between coats, as is done with shellac on furniture. Ideally, lots of very thin coats."

Do you use a brush? If so, what kind works best for you?

And Annie writes .... "Dissolve by volume 1 part rabbit skin glue or hide glue (my apologies to all the bunnies) ..."

Just be aware that virtually all natural coatings (including authentic pine oil varnish) will yellow significantly as they age. One of the advantages of some of these acrylic products, like the Golden polymer varnishes, is their stability and resistance to yellowing.

livick.com has some pretty thorough artificial aging tests done on a few of these products, including different combinations of fixative and varnish. He's dealing with inkjet prints, not platinum prints, so lightfastness is a major part of his tests. It's still relevent to platinum prints though, because of lighfastness/yellowing issues of the coatings themselves.

As far as lightfastness of Platinum prints, I haven't seen any real studies done on this. I would expect the image itself to be stable, but some of the natural finish papers are probably susceptible to bleaching from UV exposure. I did one very informal test that showed this might be an issue. It's possible that some of these UV blocking varnishes could help.

Obviously, not hanging prints that you like in the window will also help.

[Annie M.]

One of the advantages of the rabbit skin glue is that it is archival and can be removed without harming the print..... employment opportunities for museum archivists of the future!

[Ken Lee]

I have been using a Princeton 1.5 inch "Flat Wash" brush - but there are others which are probably much better.

I just went to the art supply store and when I bought the varnish, I asked them for a brush to go with it. I haven't really explored the effects of brushes - other than to note that the cheap ones lose their hairs and leave streaks.

I have not tried spray application, as I would prefer to avoid the health hazards if possible - and hope not to spend money on a ventilation hood.

Rather than applying one heavy coat, it is best to apply many thin coats, and reduce any imperfections between each one. This requires time and patience.

When we consider the effort and time required to prepare Pt/Pd paper - and that time is money - I'm starting to realize that perhaps those AZO people ain't so dumb after all. ;-)

[Nicholas Whitman]

Thought I'd revive this old thread as it came up in a search regarding post processing of platinotypes.

Also check out the link in post #6. One of the coolest treasures I've ever stumbled upon on the www!
aic.stanford.edu/jaic/articles/jaic34-01-001_indx.html

I've printed platinum for many years and know is characteristics for better and for worse. The difference in dry down is always a factor in all wet processes but it can be acute with platinum. So you compensate , i.e. the print should look too light when wet. But sometimes even in a properly exposed print the shadows will be "smokey". A salt print will have the same effect - so it is more a function of the paper than the metal in the image. But the lower values can be brought to the fore with post processing.

I've been experimenting with some readily available products and thought I'd post these results.

Years ago I used a gelatin formula (knox gelatin with a preservative and photoflow) from Booth & Weinstein's Collection, Use & Care of Historic Photographs. Worked ok but was messy and very temperature sensitive. Is archival and reversible though.

Spray on Krylon acrylic. Makes the paper bullet proof but no improvement in the blacks - dead end.

Water based varnish - Minwax polycrylic clear semi gloss. Got this stuff to try coating canvas images. Adds durability but difficult to get an even coating. Tried various dilutions and got better results with a build up and sponge brushes. but abandoned it for canvas.

The other day I coated some platinotypes - just to see. Results showed promise but I had poor coating results and puckering. I used a sponge brush. Figured the solution to puckering was to do the same thing to both sides of the sheet - so I immersed the print in a tray non-diluted polycrylic and allowed to drip dry. The result was a really rich print, wonderful low value separation and pearly whites. Not a platinum "feel" but a super rich gel/silver.

Aside from the fact that non-reversible treatments make conservators crazy there could be potential here. I think a diluted solution will be worth a try. Also I might try immersion and the pushing the excess off with a glass rod - like some do to coat emulsion.

Just thought I put this up and ask what you other workers have had luck with?

Thanks,
Nick
www.nwphoto.com

[davidjohnlotto]

Renaissance wax works very well on all papers for that "wet look" ...even handmade Japanese papers. I haven't found varnish necessary.

[patrickjames]

I think I talked to David John about this several years ago. I found that buffing the wax is what does the trick for me. I don't do it to platinum prints though, but when I use wax I buff it with a hand held shoe buffer from Sharper Image I picked up for a few bucks. I used to buff them by hand and it gave me a good workout, but I ruined a lot of prints with creases. I don't have that problem with the shoe buffer. One of these days I will buy an electric one.

[Ken Lee]

Thanks for your interest.

I have put my efforts aside for the time being, and focused on improving my vision instead.

I hope to return to the process some day, and perhaps then there will be an agreeable solution.

[Nicholas Whitman]

I am wary of adding anything organ to an image as it is food for some life form. There are of course a lot of gelatin based images out there, they have preservatives added and don't support mold under reasonable conditions.

It would seem an inorganic acrylic coating would be immune from rot - though admittably not reversible. If the image is pure metal pt/pd and the paper is 100% acid free rag then sealed in an inert medium what could go wrong (within reason - not cooking in a sunny window)?

[Attack]

OK... I've had a chance to dig through my old 'swatches' ....

To obtain a luster finish comparable to an air dried silver glossy fibre based paper such as Agfa Classic... Dissolve by volume 1 part rabbit skin glue or hide glue (my apologies to all the bunnies) to 6 parts water in a double boiler or over very low heat. DO NOT BOIL. This is a thicker mixture than the usual preparation for canvas prep in painting etc. While the mixture is hot apply it to your paper... as this starts to goo up quite quickly I have found the best method is to attach my Pt print to a board with butcher tape around the outside edge (if you wish to maintain the dekel edge you will have to figure out a different method as I cut the tape off at the end of the process). I use a squeegee to apply the hot glue in one pass over the image.... if you use a brush I assume any marks will flow back into an even surface due to the viscosity of the mixture. You can let the print air dry or use a dryer if you wish. When dry the print is a bit stiff I just give it a run over the edge of the table as the finish is a little plyable and will not crack.

Now... this finish will warm the image and the paper slightly... so no pure bright whites... however the dry down effect is gone... absolutely gone. Another concern may be the method of mounting... I do not use a hot press so I have no idea how this would effect the coating. The test swatches I have here are on Cranes and Kodak PX-3001 (emulsion removed) so I have no idea how the glue would adapt to a more textured paper... you may have to adjust your dilutions according to the penetrability of your paper

This coating once dry will also accept varnishes and you can take it to high gloss if you are inclined to do so.... which reminds me it wasn't varnish over wax as I said in my post above... it was a 'fat' wax over a 'lean' wax (such as the wax mediums & the Marshall's oil dryer) I found the paper experienced less distressing when the wax gels were used prior to the crystalline.

Anyway... keep up the good work and let us know if you find your magic coating!!

Cheers Annie

Hello to all! Who ever tried Annie's recipe?
Or did new varnish recipes for Pt/Pd appear?

[faberryman]

I'm not letting wax or varnish anywhere near my platinum palladium prints. Why would I want to make them look like something other than what they are?

[tgtaylor]

Renaissance wax works very well on all papers for that "wet look" ...even handmade Japanese papers. I haven't found varnish necessary.

+1 on Renaissance Wax - it increases the prints DMax and gives it that shiny, wet look. Applying it with a soft cloth didn't work for me as the cloth picked up some of the prints emulsion. I switched to softly applying it with my index finger and buffing when dry. Works. The shoe buffer sounds interesting - will have to try that.

Thomas