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manfrominternet
28-Apr-2019, 00:59
Hi there,

I'm a photography MFA student who is relatively new to large format photography. I bought an enormous box of large format gear including a Toyo 45g and 8 lenses. (My professor sold me his entire large format set for next to nothing.) I sold the clunky, yet beautiful in its own way, Toyo 45g and purchased a Linhof Technikardan 45. Anyway, instead of going through all these lenses and burning money and learning the hard way (and I stupidly spent nearly all the money I had thanks to my gear acquisition syndrome), I appeal to you experts to ask which of these lenses you think are worth keeping, and which of these lenses are worth selling. I'm primarily a landscape and architectural shooter. Any help would be very much appreciated.

Here's my list, from wide angle to telephoto:

-65mm Nikon Nikkor-SW f/4
-90mm Sinar (Rodenstock) Sinaron W f/8 (Multicoated)
-135mm Schneider-Kreuznach Xenotar f/3.5
-150mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-180mm Fujifilm Fujinon-W f/5.6 (really NW, New Wide)
-210mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-270mm Rodenstock Rotelar f/5.6
-360mm Rodenstock Sironar-N f/6.8 (multicoated)

Many thanks!

Leszek Vogt
28-Apr-2019, 01:50
If that was me, I'd give all of them a try and see what you wish to keep. From my narrow knowledge of optics, Rotelar seem to have a smaller circle, tho you can still shoot (@F22). The Xenotar could have thorium in it, but I'd presume negligible....it also has a tight circle, but I've see them "cultish" expensive ($500+). Good luck.

Les

Oslolens
28-Apr-2019, 02:07
Hi there,
Linhof Technikardan 45.
-360mm Rodenstock Sironar-N f/6.8 (multicoated)

Many thanks!

Be careful trying to mount the 360!
A friend tested my 360mm Nikkor without success, so I doubt you can. As you always can crop later, it's not a big loss.

Big Wehman, Toyo 5x7" and a small Chamonix

Pere Casals
28-Apr-2019, 03:25
Hi there,

I'm a photography MFA student who is relatively new to large format photography. I bought an enormous box of large format gear including a Toyo 45g and 8 lenses. (My professor sold me his entire large format set for next to nothing.) I sold the clunky, yet beautiful in its own way, Toyo 45g and purchased a Linhof Technikardan 45. Anyway, instead of going through all these lenses and burning money and learning the hard way (and I stupidly spent nearly all the money I had thanks to my gear acquisition syndrome), I appeal to you experts to ask which of these lenses you think are worth keeping, and which of these lenses are worth selling. I'm primarily a landscape and architectural shooter. Any help would be very much appreciated.

Here's my list, from wide angle to telephoto:

-65mm Nikon Nikkor-SW f/4
-90mm Sinar (Rodenstock) Sinaron W f/8 (Multicoated)
-135mm Schneider-Kreuznach Xenotar f/3.5
-150mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-180mm Fujifilm Fujinon-W f/5.6 (really NW, New Wide)
-210mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-270mm Rodenstock Rotelar f/5.6
-360mm Rodenstock Sironar-N f/6.8 (multicoated)

Many thanks!

New to LF and sporting that amazing kit ??? You are privileged !!

This is a very equilibrated kit, the man that gathered such a glass stack had a very refined criterion, full of wisdom. Selling glass without having tried it is lost opportunity. For example (say) the Xenotar may not be suitable for your kind of photography as you may want (or not) multicoated lenses for landscape Velvia, but selling the xenotar without having learned what a xenotar is... The xenotar has a bokeh in the hard side, but it allows you experienting with such wide aperture to force things in the OOF !

Specialized architecture glass is expensive, and it's easy to make painful mistakes when selecting an expensive glass. I'm a newcommer to LF and I can assure you I've recently made such mistakes... You may spend some at least $2000 in film before you have the right criterion to know what large circle glass you want for architecture, or if you don't wnat such a large circle because the involved drawbacks from that large circle.

My recomendation is that you shot with this fantastic glass until you learn the character of each unit, later you may find the need for a certain specialized lens, you also may find that you may make cash with a lens you don't use...


Me, I would not change anything in this kit for the moment, as it was gathered by somebody sporting a lot of wisdom. And think that Ansel Adams made his entire career with technically worse glass than what you have.

Here you have some links about glass specs, the first link is about portraiture, but it's interesting to see what kind of nuances a LF photographer may find a glass has:

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/portrait-lenses/

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF4x5in.html

http://www.hevanet.com/cperez/testing.html

http://www.arnecroell.com/lenstests.pdf

https://onedrive.live.com/?id=8D71BC33C77D1008%21324&cid=8D71BC33C77D1008

Regarding the Technikardan 45, this is a refined thing ! It won't make better or worse photographs than an old wooden camera, but it's a really serious piece of gear.

j.e.simmons
28-Apr-2019, 03:39
Unless you’re desperate for money, I wouldn’t sell any of them now. I’d suggest picking one of the lenses in the 135 to 210 range (all near “normal” focal length) and shoot with it for at least six months. Then you will have a much better idea as to which lenses you will need.

jnantz
28-Apr-2019, 04:20
Hello
If it was me? I'd keep the 150 and ditch the rest. Too many lenses and too much gear is more of a curse than anything else.

Have fun with the new toys !
John

Andrew Plume
28-Apr-2019, 04:53
"..............Too many lenses and too much gear is more of a curse than anything else............"

Well said and entirely 'spot on' from my experience(s)

Andrew

Tin Can
28-Apr-2019, 05:54
If you are in for the long run, keep any lens with a well working shutter and exercise it. The glass is worth less for the distance.

Watch for shims when dismantling anything.

rdeloe
28-Apr-2019, 06:47
Don't sell any of them yet. I agree with others who suggest you have more than you need. But at this stage you don't really know what you need... Are you coming to LF from other kinds of photography? If so, do you have a favourite focal length (or tendency)? You could start with the lens that fits in that range and pack the rest away for now. For example, my widest lens on 4x5 is 90mm because I don't favour wide angles. I seem to prefer just a bit wider than normal, and just a bit longer than normal.

Anyway, you own some great glass. You're not going to get a lot of money from selling it, and if you're still shooting LF in a year you may find yourself re-buying things you sold.

Bernice Loui
28-Apr-2019, 08:05
IMO, why sell any of them now?

Use them all to see what you like and what you do not like then decide. This is a very balanced set of LF lenses that can server virtually any image making need focal length wise for 4x5.


Bernice

Kiwi7475
28-Apr-2019, 12:19
I may be a romantic, but I don’t think it’s “nice” to be given a set of tools and just sell them out. Obviously I know nothing about the “giver” and the “taker” but it would be nice to think that he chose/entrusted someone that would perpetuate its use.

Sorry— like I said, hopeless romantic.

Tin Can
28-Apr-2019, 12:36
A mentor never found me, yet some do get help from a mentor. Or muse.

Perhaps OP's mentor wants him to find his path even if it means using every advantage he is handed.

Including a box of glass which could be sold for a shiny object that gives OP a chance in this unsteady world.

The last thing I realized in MFA school was the absolute need to blaze your own path. One way to know you are ready, "Is when you throw all advisors, mentors, muse out of your studio for good."

Captain of your own ship as it were.

Seems a simple lesson, but MFA is daunting in any school.

It's an insane quick 2 years.

NOT ART

alan_b
28-Apr-2019, 16:44
Unless you’re desperate for money, I wouldn’t sell any of them now. I’d suggest picking one of the lenses in the 135 to 210 range (all near “normal” focal length) and shoot with it for at least six months. Then you will have a much better idea as to which lenses you will need.

I'd suggest this approach as well, but given your interest in landscape/architecture, maybe lean towards the 90/135.

Roger Thoms
28-Apr-2019, 18:41
Until you get out and start shooting, your not going to know which lenses to keep and which to sell. Wasting some time and money is part of the learning experience so I don’t really consider it waste time and money. It really shouldn’t take you too long to figure out what lenses you want in your kit. I could give you my recommendations but they would be just that. A good friend of mine who does nice work really leans towards longer focal lengths and I lean towards shorter focal lengths. Neither ones right or wrong, just different styles.

Roger

Bob Salomon
28-Apr-2019, 18:47
Sell the 135, 180 and 270mm.
Keep the 65, 90, 150, 210 and 360mm unless the size and weight of the 360 is a problem for you. It isn’t a problem on the TK.

You do want the Linhof Fresnel lens if your camera does not have one installed.

Linhof makes a special order board for the 360mm lens. It is marked with a Z indicating a centered hole so the lens mounts properly on the front standard. It is always a special order board

You,will need a center filter for the 65 to 90mm lenses.

Bill Burk
28-Apr-2019, 18:57
You've gotten some good advice, keep all you can and shoot with them and get to know them.

But to be devil's advocate... suppose it was necessary to sell a few lenses to pay for school or to buy film... What would be the most valuable lens that you don't need?

I don't know enough to be helpful here, but simply looking at the focal lengths and thinking about what I'd have to have handy...

This range seems to me to be the most "optional." If I were to pack for a weekend, I'd only take one of these three:

-180mm Fujifilm Fujinon-W f/5.6 (really NW, New Wide)
-210mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-270mm Rodenstock Rotelar f/5.6

Considering that, which of these is most valuable? You could probably sell one or two of these without degrading the range of work the whole set covers.

Bob Salomon
28-Apr-2019, 18:59
Sell the 135, 180 and 270mm.
Keep the 65, 90, 150, 210 and 360mm unless the size and weight of the 360 is a problem for you. It isn’t a problem on the TK.

You do want the Linhof Fresnel lens if your camera does not have one installed.

Linhof makes a special order board for the 360mm lens. It is marked with a Z indicating a centered hole so the lens mounts properly on the front standard. It is always a special order board

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 01:14
If that was me, I'd give all of them a try and see what you wish to keep. From my narrow knowledge of optics, Rotelar seem to have a smaller circle, tho you can still shoot (@F22). The Xenotar could have thorium in it, but I'd presume negligible....it also has a tight circle, but I've see them "cultish" expensive ($500+). Good luck.

Les

Dzieki Leszek,

The 270mm Rodenstock Rotelar seems to be giving me the most issues. I finally got some negatives back after using it, and I have to say that I'm less than impressed. The focus is very soft, if not way off.

Anyway, you're right. There's probably no better way to do this than to try each of the lenses individually.

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 01:42
New to LF and sporting that amazing kit ??? You are privileged !!

This is a very equilibrated kit, the man that gathered such a glass stack had a very refined criterion, full of wisdom. Selling glass without having tried it is lost opportunity. For example (say) the Xenotar may not be suitable for your kind of photography as you may want (or not) multicoated lenses for landscape Velvia, but selling the xenotar without having learned what a xenotar is... The xenotar has a bokeh in the hard side, but it allows you experienting with such wide aperture to force things in the OOF !

Specialized architecture glass is expensive, and it's easy to make painful mistakes when selecting an expensive glass. I'm a newcommer to LF and I can assure you I've recently made such mistakes... You may spend some at least $2000 in film before you have the right criterion to know what large circle glass you want for architecture, or if you don't wnat such a large circle because the involved drawbacks from that large circle.

My recomendation is that you shot with this fantastic glass until you learn the character of each unit, later you may find the need for a certain specialized lens, you also may find that you may make cash with a lens you don't use...


Me, I would not change anything in this kit for the moment, as it was gathered by somebody sporting a lot of wisdom. And think that Ansel Adams made his entire career with technically worse glass than what you have.

Here you have some links about glass specs, the first link is about portraiture, but it's interesting to see what kind of nuances a LF photographer may find a glass has:

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/portrait-lenses/

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF4x5in.html

http://www.hevanet.com/cperez/testing.html

http://www.arnecroell.com/lenstests.pdf

https://onedrive.live.com/?id=8D71BC33C77D1008%21324&cid=8D71BC33C77D1008

Regarding the Technikardan 45, this is a refined thing ! It won't make better or worse photographs than an old wooden camera, but it's a really serious piece of gear.

Thank you so much for your response! Truth be told, my professor actually gave me the following 9 lenses:

-65mm Nikon Nikkor-SW f/4
-90mm Calumet Caltar-W II f/8
-135mm Schneider-Kreuznach Repro-Claron f/8
-135mm Schneider-Kreuznach Xenotar f/3.5
-150mm Rodenstock Sironar-N f/5.6
-180mm Fujifilm Fujinon-W f/5.6
-210mm Calumet Caltar-S II f/5.6
-270mm Rodenstock Rotelar f/5.6
-305mm (12") C.P. Goerz Apochromat Artar f/9 (Red Dot Version)

Then I sold the Toyo 45G with 5 of the lenses (the ones in red are the ones I sold) and got extremely lucky and bought the Linhof TK45 with 4 lenses off of eBay for next to nothing. The 4 lenses that were included in the Linhof Technikardan 45 kit are as follows:

-90mm Sinar (Rodenstock) Sinaron W f/8 (Multicoated)
-150mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-210mm Schneider Symmar-S f/5.6 (Multicoated)
-360mm Rodenstock Sironar-N f/6.8 (Multicoated)

So both my professor and the original owner of the TK45 are the wise ones! I'm afraid that I might have sold some of the good lenses in my professor's original kit (some of the ones in red), but honestly, the ones I sold looked like they weren't in the best of shape.

Anyway, that Xenotar seems to be like a lens that many people rave about, especially because of the bokah it produces. It seems to be pretty expensive too, so I assume that the LF community holds it in high regard, which is why I kept it. I haven't shot with it, but it is enjoyable to play around with while under the focusing cloth. My professor said that he used it a lot.

I'll have to keep your quote about the glass that Ansel Adams used in mind. That's very true. I can only imagine what amazing things he'd do with modern day lenses. Then again, this was a guy at the paragon of his craft. He'd probably scoff at my asking such a newbie question, haha.

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 01:44
Unless you’re desperate for money, I wouldn’t sell any of them now. I’d suggest picking one of the lenses in the 135 to 210 range (all near “normal” focal length) and shoot with it for at least six months. Then you will have a much better idea as to which lenses you will need.

That's a good idea. Especially using lenses in the "normal" range and then getting a better idea of which lenses I'll really need.

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 01:52
Don't sell any of them yet. I agree with others who suggest you have more than you need. But at this stage you don't really know what you need... Are you coming to LF from other kinds of photography? If so, do you have a favourite focal length (or tendency)? You could start with the lens that fits in that range and pack the rest away for now. For example, my widest lens on 4x5 is 90mm because I don't favour wide angles. I seem to prefer just a bit wider than normal, and just a bit longer than normal.

Anyway, you own some great glass. You're not going to get a lot of money from selling it, and if you're still shooting LF in a year you may find yourself re-buying things you sold.

I'm coming into this with an full-frame architectural photography/fine art photography background. I'm a Julius Shulman/Andreas Gursky wannabe, essentially. I tend to favor slightly wider angles, somewhere between 20mm and 35mm in the full-frame world. Actually, now that I think about it, I'm like you in the sense that I tend to prefer slightly wider than normal and a bit longer than normal.

You do make a good point about my potentially re-buying the lenses I've sold; this actually has happened to me in the past.

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 01:54
Hello
If it was me? I'd keep the 150 and ditch the rest. Too many lenses and too much gear is more of a curse than anything else.

Have fun with the new toys !
John

Ha, I see what you mean. I can believe that. I'm finding myself fussing over silly things instead of going out there to shoot.

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 01:57
I may be a romantic, but I don’t think it’s “nice” to be given a set of tools and just sell them out. Obviously I know nothing about the “giver” and the “taker” but it would be nice to think that he chose/entrusted someone that would perpetuate its use.

Sorry— like I said, hopeless romantic.

Yes! I totally agree with you. My professor sold me the set and told me that I was free to do whatever I wanted with it, including selling it. Otherwise I would have never sold it. I'm still keeping some of his lenses and putting them on Linhof lens boards and giving them new life, so to speak. At least, that's how I feel...

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 02:03
Until you get out and start shooting, your not going to know which lenses to keep and which to sell. Wasting some time and money is part of the learning experience so I don’t really consider it waste time and money. It really shouldn’t take you too long to figure out what lenses you want in your kit. I could give you my recommendations but they would be just that. A good friend of mine who does nice work really leans towards longer focal lengths and I lean towards shorter focal lengths. Neither ones right or wrong, just different styles.

Roger

The consensus here is that I should keep the lenses and use them to figure out which ones I like and need. I guess I agree. There's no quick shortcut for this - I'm just going to have to test out all the lenses myself.

I will say that I recently got the negatives back from using the 270mm Rodenstock Rotelar and I was pretty horrified. The areas that were actually in focus were very patchy and soft.

I guess the Rodenstock Rotelar is out. :/

manfrominternet
29-Apr-2019, 02:11
Sell the 135, 180 and 270mm.
Keep the 65, 90, 150, 210 and 360mm unless the size and weight of the 360 is a problem for you. It isn’t a problem on the TK.

You do want the Linhof Fresnel lens if your camera does not have one installed.

Linhof makes a special order board for the 360mm lens. It is marked with a Z indicating a centered hole so the lens mounts properly on the front standard. It is always a special order board

You,will need a center filter for the 65 to 90mm lenses.

Hi Bob! Thanks so much for the suggestion!

I actually do want to get rid of the 270mm Rodenstock Rotelar. I just got my processed negatives back today after shooting with it and was pretty disappointed with the results. The focus was very spotty and very soft. It was discouraging to say the least.

I am curious as to why you think I should sell the 180mm Fuji and the 135mm Schneider Xenotar. Are they not up to par? I keep seeing the 135mm Schneider Xenotar, or really and Schneider Xenotar, listed at high prices on eBay and thought that the consensus among the LF community was that it's a terrific and coveted lens. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Is the 180mm Fuji not that great either?

Much thanks again!

Peter De Smidt
29-Apr-2019, 02:58
You're very lucky. Having a bunch of lenses to try out is a good thing. If choice is overwhelming you, only pack a couple of lenses depending on what you're doing. If I'm shooting mid-western landscapes with 4x5, I pack a 120mm, 210mm and a 300. If I was shooting Western grand vistas, I'd add a longer lens. I don't bother with in-between focal lengths, as a step forward or back usually works, even though I have many of them. If I'm doing architecture, then I bring a 90 and lose the 300. I've never used a center filter with a 90 and BW film. Today I walked around my neighborhood pulling a cart with my Sinar. I used an Ilex 254mm Paragon and a 300mm Imagon. That was fun, too. Different lenses for different purposes.

LabRat
29-Apr-2019, 03:13
I agree with the others, don't sell... (This will save you from staying all night thinking you NEED some lens or another, so you can wake up and shoot in the morning...)

With that 270mm, it takes some practice to set up the camera properly so the camera is balanced and still, so your problem might be vibration or settling, so the right tripod + smarts will help a lot... That lens might help you "reach out and touch"something further than you can access ... No regrets please...

There are no "bad" lenses (unless damaged or molested), but some are a little better than others, so no fears here...

It will take a lot of shooting and practice to get the best out of them, but it's a good idea to just use one lens for awhile (as suggested), and really get into the groove... You have other steps to master, so get out there, then into the darkroom...

Good luck and have fun!!!

Steve K

Pere Casals
29-Apr-2019, 05:22
Hmmm... the rotelar is more suitable for 6x9cm, because of the corners

but it fills a long gap between 210 and 360

A 300mm composition can be shot with the 210mm and cropping, but better to shot MF in such a case.

The rotelar would be a choice for a light field camera with short bellows, having a 6x9cm roll film back for velvia

Velvia is expensive in sheets, and a roll film back cuts cost to perhaps to 1/4 per shot, while a 6x9 cm still has at least effective 250mpix equivalent image quality

We may remember that AA made his most (imho) important shot with a very bad glass, an adon.

Also the rotelar has an spare shutter. This is important because shutters in shape are scarce, more than glass