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Steven Ruttenberg
8-Feb-2019, 20:33
A JC10PLUS air compressor by Rolair. It is actually kinda cute and very quiet. Also git a 5 micron particle filter that incorporates a water trap. Office will be remodeled end of month. Large humidifier and air purifier/ionizer along with an ionizing air nozzle will arrive end of month.

Room will be sealed as much as practical, screen materially be replaced with special particle trapping screens (live in AZ) hepa filter on AC output vent to room, air ionizing fab/bar as well. Will also be getting a very expensive vacuum with hepa system completely sealed unit.

With any luck, I may get a scan with little to no dust :)

Fred L
9-Feb-2019, 07:35
humidifying the room would be my priority over special screens/filters. in my experience, this has made a noticeable difference to clean scanning

Steven Ruttenberg
9-Feb-2019, 08:38
True, part of this is because of allergies of wife and I. Dust and pollen are brutal in this area and fresh air hard to come by with windows closed.

Alan Klein
9-Feb-2019, 09:04
Steve: I have dust and dust mite allergies too. Everyone has always said go to the Southwest - Arizona, where you live. I thought it was better out there?

Randy Moe
9-Feb-2019, 09:33
Steven your air compressor looks very similar to my smaller one that is Made in Taiwan. Is yours?

I look for Made in Taiwan as I believe they manufacture high quality products.

Yesterday I scanned films with obvious skin flakes, today I kept my long sleeve shirt on and saw none.

Anecdotal...

Audii-Dudii
9-Feb-2019, 09:47
Steve: I have dust and dust mite allergies too. Everyone has always said go to the Southwest - Arizona, where you live. I thought it was better out there?
It was better here, until everybody from everywhere else moved here and brought their non-desert landscaping with them. <sigh>

Randy Moe
9-Feb-2019, 09:52
I remember when Swamp Coolers in the basin still worked before the golf course expansion

Heck we golfed on sand in MN, then many from MN moved to Scottsdale...


It was better here, until everybody from everywhere else moved here and brought their non-desert landscaping with them. <sigh>

Bernice Loui
9-Feb-2019, 10:06
Consider adding a means to produce balanced ionization. This can significantly reduce sticking particles due to static E.

https://www.terrauniversal.com/blog/all-terra-blogs/ionizing-blow-off-gun-improve-product-quality/



Bernice

Steven Ruttenberg
9-Feb-2019, 10:37
Steve: I have dust and dust mite allergies too. Everyone has always said go to the Southwest - Arizona, where you live. I thought it was better out there?

It is good for you if you have things like asthma because we are so dry. But that is in phx, Yuma and Tucson areas. Farther north in AZ less dust more moisture etc. I don’t know about dust mites though. Never heard it was a problem out here.

Steven Ruttenberg
9-Feb-2019, 10:39
Consider adding a means to produce balanced ionization. This can significantly reduce sticking particles due to static E.

https://www.terrauniversal.com/blog/all-terra-blogs/ionizing-blow-off-gun-improve-product-quality/



Bernice


Interesting

Steven Ruttenberg
9-Feb-2019, 10:50
Steven your air compressor looks very similar to my smaller one that is Made in Taiwan. Is yours?

I look for Made in Taiwan as I believe they manufacture high quality products.

Yesterday I scanned films with obvious skin flakes, today I kept my long sleeve shirt on and saw none.

Anecdotal...

Just says foreign made. Doesn’t say where. Had to get from websites not on compressor itself.

Steven Ruttenberg
9-Feb-2019, 10:51
I remember when Swamp Coolers in the basin still worked before the golf course expansion

Heck we golfed on sand in MN, then many from MN moved to Scottsdale...


We had swamp coolers back in the day. If you left your crackers out they turned to soup.

jp
9-Feb-2019, 11:04
If you're looking for more allergy and dust removal options, I'd suggest a central vac. It obviously removes dust and dirt and does not recycle that same dirty air back into your living area.

Steven Ruttenberg
9-Feb-2019, 12:21
Quick shot of compressor on counter

Randy Moe
9-Feb-2019, 12:31
I looked it up from Drew's recommendation

Drew Wiley
9-Feb-2019, 13:06
I had some input into that model. After Thomas Industries tanked (scuse the pun) in the US, and stopped putting their compressors pumps on portable tanks, I asked Rol-Air to come up with something equivalent - quiet, dual-piston, low RPM, low startup surge. I had used them in the past, and their primary line of portable construction compressors originated at my request, and was prototyped in our own shop a long time ago, around the late 70's. But it was not deemed feasible for them to be cost effective making a whole new pump series from scratch. So they found a factory overseas who had a head start on the same idea, and got it tweaked into JC10 fashion. But equivalent units are being imported and sold under several different brand names here in the US. They're made in China. Makita compressors are made in Taiwan, but have had quality control issues due to lack of individual testing prior to shipment. Rol Air pressure tests every single compressor they themselves make. This can have unintended consequences. I once had a furious phone call from a contractor way up at Lake Tahoe four hours from here, who complained that his new Rol Air wouldn't start when he plugged it in and flipped on the switch. I thought about it a moment, then asked him to check the tank gauge. Sure enough, it still held 120PSI from the factory pressure test, so wasn't supposed to go on until some air was let out. That placated him. But they don't pressure-test import units here. So then it just becomes a matter of statistical warranty issues. The only problem I've ever had with JC-10's is a couple of them had a grease clog in a little odd solenoid valve, which can be user corrected via phone call instructions to the Rol Air service dept. My own Service Dept recently closed due to all the old-timer retirements, or sadly,deaths; but at least they're willing to truck things down the freeway on regular lumber delivery runs to the Makita Service Center in Hayward, which does repair other brands than their own. In the meantime, I've done some repairs in my own shop for neighbor contractors, but certainly don't intend to expand that kind of favor. I generally get paid back in other useful tools, horse-trade style.

Alan Klein
10-Feb-2019, 10:12
If you're looking for more allergy and dust removal options, I'd suggest a central vac. It obviously removes dust and dirt and does not recycle that same dirty air back into your living area.
Interestingly, when we moved into our home here in NJ 5 years ago, it had a central vac. Really great. I also got rid of all carpets and about half our furniture is leather, not clothe. Also have no curtains. The dust is really very little here compared to what I put up with all my life living in NYC. The house here is also pretty air proof and I use the maximum rated air filters in my ducted heating and air conditioning system and change them every three months. Steve, dust mites are tiny tick like bugs that mainly eat the dead skin that falls off humans. They actually float around the room on the dead skin. They're usually found in pillows, bedding and in couches and carpets. You can buy mite protected covers for mattresses and pillows that blocks them from getting through. Vacuuming and washing carpets and couch pillows etc helps, but not having them is better.

All these things are also good for film processing although I do that through an outside lab. But when I scan, I still have to spot out the dust in post processing. Comes with the turf. But it's really not too bad.

Steven Ruttenberg
10-Feb-2019, 12:25
I had some input into that model. After Thomas Industries tanked (scuse the pun) in the US, and stopped putting their compressors pumps on portable tanks, I asked Rol-Air to come up with something equivalent - quiet, dual-piston, low RPM, low startup surge. I had used them in the past, and their primary line of portable construction compressors originated at my request, and was prototyped in our own shop a long time ago, around the late 70's. But it was not deemed feasible for them to be cost effective making a whole new pump series from scratch. So they found a factory overseas who had a head start on the same idea, and got it tweaked into JC10 fashion. But equivalent units are being imported and sold under several different brand names here in the US. They're made in China. Makita compressors are made in Taiwan, but have had quality control issues due to lack of individual testing prior to shipment. Rol Air pressure tests every single compressor they themselves make. This can have unintended consequences. I once had a furious phone call from a contractor way up at Lake Tahoe four hours from here, who complained that his new Rol Air wouldn't start when he plugged it in and flipped on the switch. I thought about it a moment, then asked him to check the tank gauge. Sure enough, it still held 120PSI from the factory pressure test, so wasn't supposed to go on until some air was let out. That placated him. But they don't pressure-test import units here. So then it just becomes a matter of statistical warranty issues. The only problem I've ever had with JC-10's is a couple of them had a grease clog in a little odd solenoid valve, which can be user corrected via phone call instructions to the Rol Air service dept. My own Service Dept recently closed due to all the old-timer retirements, or sadly,deaths; but at least they're willing to truck things down the freeway on regular lumber delivery runs to the Makita Service Center in Hayward, which does repair other brands than their own. In the meantime, I've done some repairs in my own shop for neighbor contractors, but certainly don't intend to expand that kind of favor. I generally get paid back in other useful tools, horse-trade style.

Very cool. I also saw a JC5. It’s even cuter.

Drew Wiley
11-Feb-2019, 17:20
Yeah, and I noticed a new twist on their mid-sized compressors too the other day when I stopped by my old haunt, but didn't have time to look at it closely. Too busy chatting with old customers and co-workers.

Steven Ruttenberg
11-Feb-2019, 20:33
I am considering Rolair's 10 gallon storage tank. What would you recommend for a pressure regulator?

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 07:32
I use Wilkerson.

Mine are now 10 years old, working perfectly. We used 1000's of them in the factory, with steel safety cover water bowls. Auto water drain spitters, which you will not want in a house.

Try to discover origin.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 08:26
Okay. I am wanting to use the storage tank to keep the compressor from coming on so much. I figure with what we do, it will not be very often with a 10 gallon tank. Definitely no spitters in the house!

This one is not expensive and looks cool.

https://www.gamut.com/p/wilkerson-filter-regulator-lubricator-manual-push-metal-NjAwMzE4

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 08:47
Okay. I am wanting to use the storage tank to keep the compressor from coming on so much. I figure with what we do, it will not be very often with a 10 gallon tank. Definitely no spitters in the house!

This one is not expensive and looks cool.

https://www.gamut.com/p/wilkerson-filter-regulator-lubricator-manual-push-metal-NjAwMzE4

You don't want a lubricator for your purpose.

I can't read my part #'s. I use a dryer filter with auto drain, which never operates as my up side air is dryed too. Then a low pressure regulator that only goes up to 30 psi with matching gauge. Adjusted to 25 psi fo for dusting with pencil blow gun. I use an old one as if ound the new ones come loaded with grease! I bought 2 new ones recently as my good one is 35 years old and heavily used. https://store.snapon.com/Non-Vented-Blow-Guns-Blow-Gun-Blue-Point-reg--P634439.aspx

I could probably dust my eye with this thing, but I am not going to try. Very adjustable to extremely low flow. Surface bubbles on water. BUT new ones are full of grease!

I have 3 dryers and regulators in my darkroom. 2 for gas burst. The variations are endless go to the main catalog.

Video is coming soon...

Wait for Drew for his advice, I sense him

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 11:57
The force is strong in that one!

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 12:02
something like this...

https://www.gamut.com/p/ingersoll-rand-filter-regulator-0.3-micron-filter-rating-std-manual-NjAwNjMz

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 12:42
:)

That will work

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 12:43
Woo Hoo!

Now for a tank!

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 13:20
Another one https://www.grainger.com/product/6B315?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7JbwpIK34AIVDttkCh0tRgztEAQYASABEgICt_D_BwE&cm_mmc=PPC:+Google+PLA&ef_id=EAIaIQobChMI7JbwpIK34AIVDttkCh0tRgztEAQYASABEgICt_D_BwE:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!50916684477!!!g!66418500199!

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 13:23
I like the Ingersol one as it goes down to .3 micron. So it would be like this, from compressor thru 5 micron filter/water trap, then into larger tank, then out of larger tank thru the regulator/filter/water trap, then into ant-static hose, thru a .01 micron filter just before the ionizing air nozzle. I might put a small regulator just before final filter to control final air pressure out of nozzle. Of course, this might seem a bit over kill, but this stuff is cheap and I like to play around sometimes. :)

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 13:28
I'm sure you know what you want.

Granger usually has only good items.

Grainger also stocks tons of parts for industry and home owner. Odd stuff you would not imagine.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 14:29
Cool. I think we have a brick store in the area. I could be thinking of a different place though.

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 14:33
The stores are in every USA major market.

They are not the cheapest, but they stock a lot.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 15:46
That is what I am looking for. I like to try it out and test fit things before buying site unseen.

Drew Wiley
12-Feb-2019, 16:39
Unlike Randy perhaps (do we agree on anything?), I'd classify Grainger as often overpriced and certainly not anywhere near the league of a true top notch tool distributor, especially when it comes to portable tools. Motors, pumps, AV items like fans, test equipment - they're great for that kind of thing. I have used them a great deal over the years for what they do tend to specialize in, and do consider them routinely worth keeping in mind. Their website stinks, and represents only a fraction of what they carry. I recommend trying to get ahold of a real paper catalog. It's thick, and even that doesn't show all the stuff they have in regional master warehouses, which sometimes involves supplementary catalogs.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 19:24
Here is the.01 micron disposable filter. Which end for air input? Isn’t marked so I assume doesn’t matter.

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 19:47
Saw one up. Our lab cut everything up. We would cross section all filters and compare. Then send to chem lab.

We routinely cross sectioned entire new car engines to check them out.

Then build 6 more with our parts and run the heck out of them.

Great fun. Destructive testing.

When done we had to smash the blocks with hammers, take Polaroids with serial #'s and send the paper evidence to Ford. 6 months later we could recycle them.

The final filters I sold for spray guns were directional with arrows. Now 37 years ago...

Age 45 I took work aptitude tests at the Junior College to see what new career they thought I should study.

The test's indicated Lab Rat, but that name is already in use here!

So I studied Art for a change of life. Almost worked....:)

Water under the bridge.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 19:55
I think it did work!

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 20:02
Some say live your life backwards.

The Bible and Wood Allen...


I think it did work!

Drew Wiley
12-Feb-2019, 20:28
Filters generally have directional air flow arrows. Unfortunately, Steve, the filter you've posted has two male ends. I don't know if it came with fittings that way. Every detachable air line or component should be male one end, female the other. Otherwise you're going to have trouble. No time to elaborate right now. I'm not a fan of disposable filters, but you can try it out and see what happens. My filters are high quality and have lasted for decades because the filter elements are bronze fiber. Those won't decompose and potentially create crud in the airline. Often mictofilters will have a porous ceramic element instead. But at least you're off the a start. ... And congratulation to Randy for finally getting into High School at 32, and Junior College at 45. That means he won't get into the old folks home until he's 162.

Randy Moe
12-Feb-2019, 20:35
Drew your insults precede you. STFU


Filters generally have directional air flow arrows. Unfortunately, Steve, the filter you've posted has two male ends. I don't know if it came with fittings that way. Every detachable air line or component should be male one end, female the other. Otherwise you're going to have trouble. No time to elaborate right now. I'm not a fan of disposable filters, but you can try it out and see what happens. My filters are high quality and have lasted for decades because the filter elements are bronze fiber. Those won't decompose and potentially create crud in the airline. Often mictofilters will have a porous ceramic element instead. But at least you're off the a start. ... And congratulation to Randy for finally getting into High School at 32, and Junior College at 45. That means he won't get into the old folks home until he's 162.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 20:58
Filters generally have directional air flow arrows. Unfortunately, Steve, the filter you've posted has two male ends. I don't know if it came with fittings that way. Every detachable air line or component should be male one end, female the other. Otherwise you're going to have trouble. No time to elaborate right now. I'm not a fan of disposable filters, but you can try it out and see what happens. My filters are high quality and have lasted for decades because the filter elements are bronze fiber. Those won't decompose and potentially create crud in the airline. Often mictofilters will have a porous ceramic element instead. But at least you're off the a start. ... And congratulation to Randy for finally getting into High School at 32, and Junior College at 45. That means he won't get into the old folks home until he's 162.

One end is female other is male. I put fittings on.

Steven Ruttenberg
12-Feb-2019, 21:01
If I can find .01 micron filter that is not disposable I am there. These were good but and let’s me see if I like.

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 12:45
Anyone every try one of these? If it works, could use my existing air hose instead of buying an antistatic one.

https://www.autobodytoolmart.com/ionix-static-eliminator-sm200-2-p-15109.aspx?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI4Ob6yP274AIVwiCtBh3rRA2PEAkYBSABEgL7ufD_BwE

Randy Moe
14-Feb-2019, 12:55
Not I, but I look forward to your review.

Seems like a real thing. I notice some are high volume, larger hose ID and yes, low pressure.

http://www.ionixtechnologies.com/

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 13:29
Roger that

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 14:37
Company says it won't work. Apparently it spits out little particles. Why they don't recommend for use in the airline for paint gun.

Randy Moe
14-Feb-2019, 14:56
Good to know.

There are cheap Ion guns on eBay.


Company says it won't work. Apparently it spits out little particles. Why they don't recommend for use in the airline for paint gun.

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 15:12
Got one on the way by simco. Shame though the price of shipping is almost as much as the gun!

Randy Moe
14-Feb-2019, 15:20
Yes, I noticed that.


Got one on the way by simco. Shame though the price of shipping is almost as much as the gun!

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 18:02
Now to figure out how to make my office under positive pressure. :)

Drew Wiley
14-Feb-2019, 18:08
Don't forget cleanroom suppliers. They can be overpriced but are at least helpful reference sources. McMaster too. Grainger is beginning to carry some of those things, but they might not be in a general catalog. But most of what you need will be found in the main catalog, just like Randy already implied. I had direct accounts with manufacturers, but that is all now past. I ordered air fittings over a thousand at a time, and multiple 500 foot bulk rolls of privately-labeled true hydraulic hose in lieu of conventional air hose. But I only need a single new fitting in my lab about every five years, and might not ever need another length of hose. I was given all kinds of free samples over the years, even high-end portable compressors. Came with the territory.

Randy Moe
14-Feb-2019, 18:17
Easy but the family won't like it.

Slow down HVAC outlets in all rooms except the clean room which is supplied by Merv 16 filters.

I sorta do that here with by tuning my house. I live alone and sometimes shut off rooms.

ymmv


Now to figure out how to make my office under positive pressure. :)

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 20:49
I can do that. Have two ac units one for upstairs and one down. I can take over second Floor!

Steven Ruttenberg
14-Feb-2019, 20:51
Don't forget cleanroom suppliers. They can be overpriced but are at least helpful reference sources. McMaster too. Grainger is beginning to carry some of those things, but they might not be in a general catalog. But most of what you need will be found in the main catalog, just like Randy already implied. I had direct accounts with manufacturers, but that is all now past. I ordered air fittings over a thousand at a time, and multiple 500 foot bulk rolls of privately-labeled true hydraulic hose in lieu of conventional air hose. But I only need a single new fitting in my lab about every five years, and might not ever need another length of hose. I was given all kinds of free samples over the years, even high-end portable compressors. Came with the territory.

They are expensive for sure. I would actually like to build a table top clean room 48 long by 30 deep by 24 tall working area. Just need to find a ll the components.

Steven Ruttenberg
17-Feb-2019, 12:16
Construction on my office for processing images should start this week with building my new desk. Granite or quartz will be 10’x5’ with something like either 36” x 44” slots or drawers for storing printed images and paper supplies on one side. Other side will be open. This where I will mount images, scan, process digitally etc. will post before and after pics.

Jody_S
17-Feb-2019, 12:32
Some say live your life backwards.

The Bible and Wood Allen...


I have a sign above my office 'puter: "It's never too late to have a happy childhood."

Randy Moe
17-Feb-2019, 12:36
What height will the surface be?

I adjust my work heights to the job.

My DIY stand-sit bench is 42" for me. Gets me up and down, the chair is height adjustable.

I like knee and toe room on all sides of my room center bench.

I also have many folding tables for projects. The best are adjustable to 3 heights.

Randy Moe
17-Feb-2019, 12:37
I really try to have the wonder of a child. Not always easy at any age. :)


I have a sign above my office 'puter: "It's never too late to have a happy childhood."

Steven Ruttenberg
17-Feb-2019, 12:44
What height will the surface be?

I adjust my work heights to the job.

My DIY stand-sit benche is 42" for me. Gets me up and down, the chair is height adjustable.

I like knee and toe room on all sides of my room center bench.

I also have many folding tables for projects. The best are adjustable to 3 heights.

Not sure yet, but will be where it is comfortable to stand or sit in an adjustable chair. Probably same height as half wall in office. Which is around 4’ tall. I will measure tonight and let you know. My back fusion makes me stand and sit depending on how sore it gets. Sometimes it’s like I am perfect and other days it’s like I worked out too hard the day before. But glad it got done or I wouldn’t be doing anything right now. Been 6 years since surgery and it gets better with each day. 95% perfect.

Steven Ruttenberg
17-Feb-2019, 12:46
I have a sign above my office 'puter: "It's never too late to have a happy childhood."

It is exactly my plan. Now tell my bones that!

Drew Wiley
17-Feb-2019, 16:10
I just use the Craftsman Micro Cleaning Kit. So cheap you can't go wrong. But there's no soft camel hair brush in there suitable for film. You could easily make one yourself modifying one of those little attachments with a lens lipstick brush. I'd imagine something better is available for eletronics tech repair applications. Then you need to find an appropriate tapered step-down diameter sizing adapter, or "step adapter". Fein used to make nice pliable rubber ones. Don't get the hard plastic kind.

Drew Wiley
17-Feb-2019, 17:34
I took home my black leather office chair for my retouching station. Really comfortable. But I'm probably still the most knowledgeable person in the US with regard to Festool picture framing applications. I've equipped a number of big industrial shops. But my own setup is geared more to on-demand framing applications. I can quickly set up or store away the whole system "Euro-Shop" modular style, and even make my own hardwood mouldings with a near dustless portable rig. My most bang for the buck tool purchase along with a vac to get the discount would probably be the little iron-shaped Deltex sander. It's superb in all kinds of cabinet shop and paint prep finish sander applications; you can even do drywall with it without damaging the innards. The linear LS sander is wonderful for sanding volume mouldings per se, but is otherwise an expensive one-trick pony which is not very versatile. I was part of the focus group behind the Festool mitre saw, along with three German Engineers and the CEO (himself an engineer), so know its pros and cons quite well. It's an electronic tool, so you never want it in the hands of a grunt framing carpenter who doesn't understand how it works and just wants to ram it into the material once he hits the switch. And the clamps are hokey; but that kind of thing can be improvised. The Domino is a wonderfully versatile joinery tool - a real game changer. I have made a couple of specialized picture frame attachments for it, but really use it more for general cabinet shop applications, including making various darkroom furnishings and jigs, kitchen remodeling, even high-end fence work. I wouldn't buy it just for picture frame applications.

Bruce M. Herman
18-Feb-2019, 15:20
You might also consider an antistatic system. Mine was made by Zone IV many years ago, but others with a similar design are available. Do a web search for antistatic transformer.

This won't eliminate dust, but it will minimize it.

Steven Ruttenberg
18-Feb-2019, 17:44
I do have an inonizing nozzle on way and an ionizing air purifier. I did a search, but I got things that just look like the power supply for the ionizing air nozzles. Got an example?

Sfroza
19-Feb-2019, 03:22
I use a bench top anti ESD fan. I turn it on 5 minutes before I begin to work blowing on my film holders. Then I'll vacuum the bench and all adjacent surfaces. I'll let holders sit for another couple of minutes then vacuum the holders. My film in the box is placed under the blower for a couple of minutes.
Then it's it's lights out and load holders. The holders are loaded into ESD ziplock bags and I'm finished. My approach is to eliminate the dust and the static electricity that causes to to adhere to surfaces that are prone to generating static. Polly plastics are eliminated in the work area. The bench, vacuum, chair and myself are grounded. This is a modified procedure that I've worked under in aerospace clean rooms with both optics and electronics. It works well for me, but like all things in life our personal results are what is important. YMMV.

Michael

Randy Moe
19-Feb-2019, 03:47
Yes, I also use ESD bags. They come in many sizes and affordable.

One does need to buy in quantity

A few years ago I sold here excess bags I had that hold 7x17 holders.

A number here bought.

Sfroza
19-Feb-2019, 04:01
I use a few of the providers of industrial supplies. Uline, Van Water and Rogers and surprisingly Amazon and others always chasing performance and price. The difficult part is keeping perspective and not going over the top.

Michael

Bruce M. Herman
19-Feb-2019, 14:59
I do have an inonizing nozzle on way and an ionizing air purifier. I did a search, but I got things that just look like the power supply for the ionizing air nozzles. Got an example?

http://www.amstat.com/anti-static-gun/top-gun-ionizing-air-gun/
This may be similar to what you already have. For those of you still seeking a solution, the setup that I purchased from Zone IV looks like this but with a camel hair brush adjacent to the anti-static gun and no connection for compressed air. It has a Chapman 5000v power supply, model 10798. Unlike the Amstat product, my system will shock me if I touch it in the wrong spot.

Steven Ruttenberg
19-Feb-2019, 19:50
I use a bench top anti ESD fan. I turn it on 5 minutes before I begin to work blowing on my film holders. Then I'll vacuum the bench and all adjacent surfaces. I'll let holders sit for another couple of minutes then vacuum the holders. My film in the box is placed under the blower for a couple of minutes.
Then it's it's lights out and load holders. The holders are loaded into ESD ziplock bags and I'm finished. My approach is to eliminate the dust and the static electricity that causes to to adhere to surfaces that are prone to generating static. Polly plastics are eliminated in the work area. The bench, vacuum, chair and myself are grounded. This is a modified procedure that I've worked under in aerospace clean rooms with both optics and electronics. It works well for me, but like all things in life our personal results are what is important. YMMV.

Michael

I have a small ionizing esd fan on the way so probably similar to what you have. I also thought about an ionizing bar mounted on ceiling above my desk as well. The hard part will be to have it set low enough that it doesn't cause my mounting fluid (kami) to evaporate prior to getting the mylar on and over to the scanner. Once at the scanner, I will blow of with ionizing gun and then point fan at it while scanning. Of course I need to experiment a bit to find the optimum set up for scanning and initial film loading. I typically don't worry about it and have not had issues. I load many a holder in the field.

I also use an esd mat under my wet mount station and an esd strap. Also getting an esd mat to stand on and some of those cute lint/dust free clean room disposable bunny suits.

Steven Ruttenberg
19-Feb-2019, 19:51
http://www.amstat.com/anti-static-gun/top-gun-ionizing-air-gun/
This may be similar to what you already have. For those of you still seeking a solution, the setup that I purchased from Zone IV looks like this but with a camel hair brush adjacent to the anti-static gun and no connection for compressed air. It has a Chapman 5000v power supply, model 10798. Unlike the Amstat product, my system will shock me if I touch it in the wrong spot.

The one I am gonna buy is a SIMCO for about 100 bucks. Not quite ready to drop 900 bucks on one yet.

Sfroza
20-Feb-2019, 03:23
With ESD fans you will generally have acceptable performance out to three feet from the fan to the surfaces that you are looking to control. There are field meters available to confirm that you are actually getting a zero static field. For our needs a bit pricey. I find that a balloon and rubbing it against my head tells me all that need to know in controlling static to my satisfaction at a reasonable cost. But I can be cheep.

Michael

You most likely will want to control the humidity to no lower than 30% to achieve the performance benefit of the ESD blower in your work area. This is a requirement. I have a humidifier running continually and don't even think about it being there. I'm in Denver the average environmental humidity is approximately 20% although dryer in the winter. It's not a heavy lift to raise the humidity an additional 10%. With the fan circulating the air the humidifier can be far enough away from my work surface that the mist is not a factor. And it is good for your skin.

Steven Ruttenberg
20-Feb-2019, 20:31
I live in a desert so humidity is a good thing!

Randy Moe
21-Feb-2019, 01:57
Yes not living in a desert I have less dust.

I try to keep my whole house at 45% in winter and it never goes below 30 %.

My floor model humidifier is basically a 6 gallon swamp cooler. Works great but I fill it once a day. During cold days twice.

Summer is damp.

Right now lots of rain we are past flood stage.

I lived in Phoenix a while and noticed the huge flood tunnels the homeless lived in. A deadly problem as desert flooding is sudden.

Flash flood also common in desert.

Don’t camp in a dry wash.

Drew Wiley
21-Feb-2019, 10:58
Here along SF Bay we have the opposite problem. It rarely gets hot, so humidity per se is not the issue, but constant dampness due to fog.

Alan Klein
21-Feb-2019, 17:55
Yes not living in a desert I have less dust.

I try to keep my whole house at 45% in winter and it never goes below 30 %.

My floor model humidifier is basically a 6 gallon swamp cooler. Works great but I fill it once a day. During cold days twice.

Summer is damp.

Right now lots of rain we are past flood stage.

I lived in Phoenix a while and noticed the huge flood tunnels the homeless lived in. A deadly problem as desert flooding is sudden.

Flash flood also common in desert.

Don’t camp in a dry wash.

Once I went camping with my first wife along the Delaware River in New York State, green country. I put the pup tent about 30 feet back from the river. When we woke up, we were floating around inside the tent on the inflatable mattress. It had rained all night. So we got up, abandoned the camp and everyone else who had camped on higher ground and found a diner and had breakfast. Afterwards, we went back to the campsite. Everyone thought we had already left for good. So anyway, we packed up and left. End of our camping adventure.

Drew Wiley
21-Feb-2019, 18:22
I've had an indoor swimming pool in a tent a few times.

Steven Ruttenberg
21-Feb-2019, 19:30
Yes not living in a desert I have less dust.

I try to keep my whole house at 45% in winter and it never goes below 30 %.

My floor model humidifier is basically a 6 gallon swamp cooler. Works great but I fill it once a day. During cold days twice.

Summer is damp.

Right now lots of rain we are past flood stage.

I lived in Phoenix a while and noticed the huge flood tunnels the homeless lived in. A deadly problem as desert flooding is sudden.

Flash flood also common in desert.

Don’t camp in a dry wash.

No way! Flash foods are instant and deadly.

Steven Ruttenberg
21-Feb-2019, 19:31
Once I went camping with my first wife along the Delaware River in New York State, green country. I put the pup tent about 30 feet back from the river. When we woke up, we were floating around inside the tent on the inflatable mattress. It had rained all night. So we got up, abandoned the camp and everyone else who had camped on higher ground and found a diner and had breakfast. Afterwards, we went back to the campsite. Everyone thought we had already left for good. So anyway, we packed up and left. End of our camping adventure.


Ouch!

Steven Ruttenberg
21-Feb-2019, 19:45
Ordered this today,

Simco Top Gun Ionizing Air Gun ionizer ESD Sidekick PN 4006992 & 2 new filters https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F254024992336

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HMMJDNY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0722YZ1R1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Ionizing Air Blower Ionizer Bench Top ESD Electrostatic Elimination Eliminator https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F153047223805

And these little things,

Ohaus 311-00 Cent o gram Capacity Scale Calibrated https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F113132226304

Ilford Multigrade Filter Set, 6 x 6in. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F173594330280

Glass Rods for Stirring 8.7 inch Best Glass Stirring Rods 220 mm Pack of 10 https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F323658241136

Canon EOS-1N RS 35mm SLR Film Camera Body Only https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F173774309758

【NEAR MINT】 Mamiya Bellows Lens Hood G3 For RZ67 RB67 Series From JAPAN #099 https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F202602877880

And I got my granite desk top 10' x 5' for 270! Normally they go for 800to over a 1000. Office will be done in two weeks, will post before and after.

Hopefully I got all the links right and they work.

And these,

https://www.mcmaster.com/8075t1

https://www.mcmaster.com/60115k62

A joiner clamp to attach regulator to filter set along with end block set.

Sfroza
22-Feb-2019, 04:17
Are you considering on using an ESD clean room smock and hair and face net/mask?

Michael

Randy Moe
22-Feb-2019, 05:59
I bet Steven is.

I wager one silly pic posted here of me to yours.

?

Sfroza
22-Feb-2019, 06:24
That is a wager that I won't fall for.

He has gone farther with particle mitigation than I have. It is good to see the boundaries pushed out by him. Steve has made a big commitment in time and resources in the search of his vision of perfection.

The difference in our approaches may be the use of compressed gas for cleaning. Vacuuming is the approach I'm working on. I'm truly looking forward to see his results.

Michael

Steven Ruttenberg
22-Feb-2019, 09:58
Are you considering on using an ESD clean room smock and hair and face net/mask?

Michael

Just the cute bunny suit

Steven Ruttenberg
22-Feb-2019, 10:01
That is a wager that I won't fall for.

He has gone farther with particle mitigation than I have. It is good to see the boundaries pushed out by him. Steve has made a big commitment in time and resources in the search of his vision of perfection.

The difference in our approaches may be the use of compressed gas for cleaning. Vacuuming is the approach I'm working on. I'm truly looking forward to see his results.

Michael

I can add the hat and mask for giggles.

I too am looking forward to hopefully less time deleting dust and processing images. I still need a vacuum, but that may have to wait. Film and paper are not cheap!

Of course some of this benefits health as well.

Steven Ruttenberg
22-Feb-2019, 10:01
I bet Steven is.

I wager one silly pic posted here of me to yours.

?


Careful what you wish for :)

Randy Moe
22-Feb-2019, 10:17
To be fair, I have never worn an ESD suit, but have worn full Tyvek many times with head covers with top end respirator both at work and to spray paint in my DIY Full Paint Booth aka garage.

A 2 part ISO epoxy auto paint now banned with cyanide fumes was used twice by me, never again.

And just for fun the pic I would have posted.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7921/33302671518_936073c7fe.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/SJQTZG)1986 Open For Lunch (https://flic.kr/p/SJQTZG) by TIN CAN COLLEGE (https://www.flickr.com/photos/tincancollege/), on Flickr

Steven Ruttenberg
22-Feb-2019, 13:16
LOL. I wore partial esd smock. Sticky floor, wrist strap with alarm on it at NASA in a supposed clean/esd room. More esd though.

Sfroza
22-Feb-2019, 14:28
There are so many things the can be said about a ESD bunny suit but none of them are nice. I feel that I have spent half my life in them, perhaps 1/3.

Michael

Steven Ruttenberg
23-Feb-2019, 00:19
Lol. Makes you look like you belong in Resident Evil or something. In the spooky labs

Steven Ruttenberg
25-Feb-2019, 23:38
Testing out the esd fan. Seems ti work. Added a hepa filter of sorts to the air inlet side of fan. Better to blow filtered air across work then dirty air. Also tried out SIMCO ionizing air gun. Works well. Slowly getting there. Picked up 6x6 contrast filters along with dual filrer. Waiting on regulator. There will be 4 filters total. Didn't plan it that way, just sorta happened. 3 water traps to as.part of filters. 4 water trap us part if orange disposable filter.

Drew Wiley
26-Feb-2019, 10:32
Cleanroom smocks are wonderful. Don't get the antistatic kind! They have metal thread woven in with soft cotton; and the cotton is a lint generator. Get the all-dacron long fiber type intended to mitigate lint. They really work. Static can be tamed with a humidifier is dry situations. You can even get anti-static countertop laminate for a huge premium, but there's a catch to it - it's made by soaking Formica or Wilsonart in silver nitrate; and I don't know if there's a risk to film interaction. Ordinary Formica is fine for me. But for walls you want paint that is either oil-based (and given a sufficient outgassing time of a couple months), or a water-oil hybrid (no longer avail here in CA). Regular latex and acrylic paints are like plexiglas and quite electrostatic, attracting dust. ... Oh well, my own rainy week shop project is to turn my Durst L184 enlarger into a "convertible" - it takes just a couple minutes to change it back and forth from enlarger to copy-stand function. I machined a very solid lens ring from black phenolic which accepts a tripod mount and camera (up to 6x7) where the enlarger lens typically is. And today I'll try to complete the near-instant lighting arm attachments for the baseboard. Dual function will save me a lot of space.

Steven Ruttenberg
26-Feb-2019, 11:19
I will check out the Dacron smock. I have a humidifier on the way along with the other stuff. Right now I am letting the little ionizing fan run over my mounting glass for scanning, the mylar protective tissue and mylar (these two generate a butt load of static electricity and attract dust like nobody's business and my Wacom tablet which gets dust too. Strange thing though, even though room is open, I put a hepa filter on the output vent from A/C in that room and after several days the dust seems to be less. I run the exhaust fan 24/7 and the regular A/C fan as well. Otherwise it gets really stuffy in house.

Post up some pics of this project. Someday,after I build my darkroom, I will get an L184.

Steven Ruttenberg
26-Feb-2019, 22:45
Here is the filter setup with regulator. Wilkerson modular components. Small things, but well built. The way it works is like this, .03 micron filter at tank, then hose to filtet set which starts as 5 micron, then .03 micron filter, then regulator, then hose to ionizing air gun, then .03 micron disposable filter prior to ionizing air gun then ionizing air gun. Okay, over kill, but if I get dydt out of this it is meant to be :)

Drew Wiley
27-Feb-2019, 12:21
It's also good to have a more ordinary line filter right at the compressor in order to prolong the life of the super-fine filters downstream.

Steven Ruttenberg
27-Feb-2019, 16:28
It's also good to have a more ordinary line filter right at the compressor in order to prolong the life of the super-fine filters downstream.

I have one right at the exit of the compressor prior to these.

Alan Klein
28-Feb-2019, 08:25
When I was playing around with painting models, I bought a CO2 tank to provide the "air" pressure for the paint pencil. Has anyone ever tried CO2 for "dusting" film?

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Mar-2019, 07:29
So, my air purifier arrived, plugged it in and it seems to work. I also received the humidifier, but it was broke, Amazon sent a second one it was broke, so I ordered a Honeywell one. Little bit smaller, but still for room much larger than mine. The Hepa filter I put on AC outlet in room seems to work pretty well. I closed off all the vents upstairs. Gonna install additional filter in bedrooms.

So far, so good.

Randy Moe
4-Mar-2019, 07:37
Good news!

I wore out a Honeywell and now have this. It was 1/2 that price last year. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00WAC9VKQ/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

My house is 1300 sq ft and I set it near the single main air inlet for the HVAC. The first outgoing vent is in the Darkroom. And i did shut off some others.

I fill it at least daily and change the filter yearly. I don't need it in summer.

I also learned about these 'swamp cooler' humidifiers right here on the forum when I asked a question years ago!

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Mar-2019, 08:39
I grew up in AZ with swamp coolers. Only way to beat the heat and not pay thru the nose for A/C. Downside is that if you don't cover your crackers, potato chips, pretzels, etc. The next time you bite into one, it is like biting mush, eeewww!

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Mar-2019, 08:41
Good news!

I wore out a Honeywell and now have this. It was 1/2 that price last year. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00WAC9VKQ/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

My house is 1300 sq ft and I set it near the single main air inlet for the HVAC. The first outgoing vent is in the Darkroom. And i did shut off some others.

I fill it at least daily and change the filter yearly. I don't need it in summer.

I also learned about these 'swamp cooler' humidifiers right here on the forum when I asked a question years ago!

I almost bought that one, I had ordered the big brother of that with 5 gallon capacity. It came broke twice and the plastic was flimsy. The second one was covered in styrofoam, balls and dust, like the first, but I tried out my ionizing air nozzle and surpisingly it worked great!

aaronnate
4-Mar-2019, 08:42
Steve: I have dust and dust mite allergies too. Everyone has always said go to the Southwest - Arizona, where you live. I thought it was better out there?

You trade one set of allergies for another when you move out here to a cit. Invasive plants cause most of the issues. If you head for the desert where no one lives it is somewhat better but still there.

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Mar-2019, 08:44
And I bought a vacuum cleaner. I was looking at the Festool midi, great vac, but it would be almost a 1000 bucks after getting bare minimum accessories. It only comes with a hose :( So, I got the Dyson, 10 cylinder, battery operated vac. I was skeptical at first, but surpisingly as well, it will suck the dirt out of anything. I vacuumed just my office, and it was downright shocking the amount of crap that came out of the carpet. Same for stairs. Need to do rest of house. Once my desk is built, I will do a final super cleaning of office and keep everything covered when not using and or cleaning.

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Mar-2019, 08:46
You trade one set of allergies for another when you move out here to a cit. Invasive plants cause most of the issues. If you head for the desert where no one lives it is somewhat better but still there.

I grew up in Delaware before we moved to AZ in 74. My allergies were brutal. They are as bad here, but I have sort of grown some immunity, plus I have had shots and looks like I will start a new round of shots thru the VA soon. Dust is our biggest issue here and it can be brutal. I sometimes get uncontrollable sneezing for 5-10 minutes.

Randy Moe
4-Mar-2019, 08:47
I lived inside Phoenix one summer 1970's. The swamp cooler was very nasty, no AC, but I did have a good time. Sunshine was her name and she laughed backwards, which is very loud and unusual. We told each other jokes. :)


I grew up in AZ with swamp coolers. Only way to beat the heat and not pay thru the nose for A/C. Downside is that if you don't over your crackers, potato chips, pretzels, etc. The next time you bite into one, it is like biting mush, eeewww!

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Mar-2019, 09:34
LOL. She is just plain hot!

Randy Moe
4-Mar-2019, 11:46
No she was the last hippie :(


LOL. She is just plain hot!

Rick A
4-Mar-2019, 12:39
And I bought a vacuum cleaner. I was looking at the Festool midi, great vac, but it would be almost a 1000 bucks after getting bare minimum accessories. It only comes with a hose :( So, I got the Dyson, 10 cylinder, battery operated vac. I was skeptical at first, but surpisingly as well, it will suck the dirt out of anything. I vacuumed just my office, and it was downright shocking the amount of crap that came out of the carpet. Same for stairs. Need to do rest of house. Once my desk is built, I will do a final super cleaning of office and keep everything covered when not using and or cleaning.

Lose the carpet. You'ld be amazed at how much dust they generate, plus a breeding ground for dust mites and other vermin. And, oh yeah, your allergies will probably thank you.

Steven Ruttenberg
5-Mar-2019, 00:01
Lose the carpet. You'ld be amazed at how much dust they generate, plus a breeding ground for dust mites and other vermin. And, oh yeah, your allergies will probably thank you.

In a couple years. Flooring is like buying half a house! Especially since I am doing hardwood throughout house.

Steven Ruttenberg
7-Mar-2019, 22:11
Been running the air purifier for about a week now and it seems to keep the dust down. Also running humidifier and looking to keep humidity around 40%-50%. Was at 30% without it already. Of course we have had a pretty wet winter so far. Once summer hits it will go down drastically till Monsoon season hits full force around July/August time frame.

Definitely need to put for and a window in for office to help keep humidity in and dust out.

I got an Ambient digital weather station to measure temp and humidity inside and out. It also has a barometer so kinda cool. Wanted old school analog gauges, but good ones are not cheap.

Desk taking a bit longer as my contractor supposedly had two heart attacks this week, one of them this morning. So his coworkers are picking up this job for him to be recovers. Dude is like 10-15 years younger than me.

Picture is office with current furniture in it. Will post more as work continues.

aaronnate
8-Mar-2019, 12:25
my contractor supposedly had two heart attacks this week, one of them this morning. So his coworkers are picking up this job for him to be recovers. Dude is like 10-15 years younger than me.



You sound doubtful.

Steven Ruttenberg
8-Mar-2019, 13:20
I am. Who has two heart attack’s three days apart and then txt you just after they had heart attack?

aaronnate
8-Mar-2019, 13:23
Fishy. I had an employee who had lots of grandmas and they all died. Grandma, step grandma, grandma in law, step grandma in law. Needless to say he did not last long. For a while, it was kind of funny. When he wasn't there he did not get paid and complained about the lost wages. It was the super slow season. When the busy season hit we let him go.

Steven Ruttenberg
8-Mar-2019, 14:11
Company been around for very long time. I will give it a week to see if progress made. If not, I may be forced to go elsewhere.

Steven Ruttenberg
16-Mar-2019, 10:56
Here is the layout of the new desk. It is 10’x5’. The rectangle on left is pedestal for support that is also a series of 34x42 drawers that are three inches deep. The space over the drawers is large enough to work on prints up to 32x40 and a bit more. The upc goes under desk along with the computer and hard drive cabinet. Compressor goes under desk below the scanners. If I need more space can move scanners and light tables. Amazing how 10x5!seems big on paper until you lay everything out and then realize it isn’t so big.

Desk is being built as I type.

Steven Ruttenberg
3-Apr-2019, 21:14
This is getting annoying. Now they change price by 1000 bucks. The cabinets have cost me 2200 dollars alone and I could have bought them for 650 if I wanted a different stain color. Then, the granite slab I bought two months ago apparently had not been available for 6 months and the comouter was in error. Plus they had the label for granite I bought on a completely different granite.

I am positive the sold it to someone else after I bought it even though they said they had not had that piece for 6 months.

I found another piece that was even better and much more expensive and get a straight exchange. They were supposed to install everything this Saturday. And tge contractor sucks on communication. I get I am not doing a 70,000 dollar renovation, 4k is kot a drop in the bucket either. Especially when I was looking at a couple other projects that would be in the range of 4k-5k each. The parent company has good reviews and been around for over 20 years.

I guess I just have shitty luck. Okay, I had my rant.

Alan Klein
4-Apr-2019, 18:27
Sounds like my cabinet maker. He's been screwing me around since last September.

Steven Ruttenberg
4-Apr-2019, 20:53
Sounds like my cabinet maker. He's been screwing me around since last September.

Yeah, this guyI think is from across border. And took it upon himself to do stuff I was nt wanting. He is gonna have to do some onsite mods next week when everything is installed.

Keep an eye on the he guy. Why is it taking so long on your cabinets?