Advise & Recommendations on 4x5 cameras

[cinetango]

Hello,

I am contemplating purchasing a new 4x5 camera. I am a beginner in large format photography, I do have a Toyo 45D but looking into a press camera, Intrepid or Chroma.
The intrepid calls my attention because it can also be used as an enlarger. The Chroma looks a bit more solid. Then there is eBay with its array of press cameras. My budget is around U$D 500. What are your opinions and recommendations?


Thanks in advance,

Raul

[Larry Gebhardt]

If it were me I'd use the Toyo 45D and buy a 4x5 enlarger. What's wrong with the Toyo that one of the others would fix?

[Daniel Casper Lohenstein]

Hello Raul,

apparently Intrepids are delivered faster now. I ordered a 4x5 Mk III in December and yesterday they told me the camera was shipped. Amazing.

I don't know whether the new version is good or bad. I already know the 4x5 Mk II, and there are a few flaws they corrected now, apparently. That's the reason why I ordered the new version.

But there is another user here in the forum who said that he felt like a beta tester, which is frustrating. https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?148295-Intrepid-8x10-experiences/page6 - I understand him: I have this feeling, too.

But I also had some £'s after selling my dickey Linhof Technika V - enough to pay that new camera and support those folks in Brighton (they merit every penny because they are working hard to produce these cameras), and perhaps enough to get a cheap carbon fiber tree to travel with, eg. a new Feisol CT-3442 or a second hand Gitzo.

Of course - when buying my second Intrepid 4x5 I realize that the 500 £ for the two cameras would have been enough to get a Rittreck View 5x7 (200$) and a Durst 138 Laborator (another 200 $ here) ...

The reason I ordered the second Intrepid is its portability. Last weekend I was in Emmental, hiking with a Gitzo Safari Reporter, the Sekonic 558 and the old Intrepid Mk II with a tiny Sironar-N 5.6/150 and 6 Riteway holders - it weights next to nothing, 5kg, which is convenient in the field and fits easily in a backpack. But the Wista 45N adds only another 1000g.

I wouldn't trust the 3-D printed plastic toys called "Chroma" or "Proxima Centauri" because it seems that they are made with degradable plastic. Wood seems to be more reliable. Birch plywood seems to be a reliable material, as others mentioned in this forum.

- But, ok, Max Grew from Intrepid mentioned in the post I cited above that "a year [...] is a fairly standard product cycle in many industries". Does this apply for his cameras, too? I hope that "end-of-sale" doesn't mean "end-of-life" - in this case, a metal Linhof would be a better investment.

What I appreciate most is that there is evolution in camera design, at all. The Intrepid company seems to respect the opinions of its customers. They adopt new ideas and there is a lot of development.

So, that's the question: do you like and appreciate your metal Toyo 45D? Perhaps a Toyo 45A or a Toyo 45CF would make sense. Perhaps there is some interchangeability (shade, lens plates, finder accessories)? Or a comparable handling (same knobs whit same spin, same materials, same dimensions, same placing of knobs and movements)?

Issues of weight often are issues of backpacks. Get a waterproof Ortlieb Atrack 45L that you can open in mud and snow and use as a sleigh. This is far more important than saving 1500g.

Regards

[John Kasaian]

What is it that your Toyo won't do that you suspect an Intrepid can do?
How long have you been shooting the Toyo?
I ask because it is so easy to waste time & money chasing magic bullets, especially for beginners (don't ask how I know this!)

It helps to have shot and developed enough film under enough different circumstances that you have the experience to evaluate what equipment changes are absolutely necessary.

FWIW I think my priority would be to find a real 4x5 enlarger while used enlargers can still be found cheap. YMMV of course.

[Pfsor]

Hello,

I am contemplating purchasing a new 4x5 camera. I am a beginner in large format photography, I do have a Toyo 45D but looking into a press camera, Intrepid or Chroma.
...
Thanks in advance,

Raul

I apologize for my ignorance, in advance. What does make you believe that Intrepid or Chrome are press cameras? Why do you think you need a press camera?

[cinetango]

The Intrepid and Chroma are not press cameras. I am interested in the portability of the camera and wanted to get some opinions.

[cinetango]

Thanks for the advise so far. Keeping the Toyo definitely makes sense. I am interested, as I mentioned above, in the portability of the camera.
Also, any suggestions for LF enlargers, good and economical?

Thanks

[Pfsor]

Good grief. Never mind.

[Leszek Vogt]

You might want to look at lighter cameras as such Tachi, Chamonix, Shen Hao, etc. Just saw 4x5 LPL being sold on local CL - just relaying the news.

Les

[Larry Gebhardt]

Thanks for the advise so far. Keeping the Toyo definitely makes sense. I am interested, as I mentioned above, in the portability of the camera.
Also, any suggestions for LF enlargers, good and economical?

Thanks

There really are no bad 4x5 enlargers, but some are better than others. I have a few Omega D5s and they are good, but not premium. There are a ton of spare parts at reasonable prices for those. Shipping is the big issue with enlargers. They need to go in a few boxes and some parts are fairly heavy. I can easily see shipping being as much as the enlarger sells for. So shop local? Where are you located?

[cinetango]

Thanks everyone for the comments and the good sense of humor!

[cinetango]

There really are no bad 4x5 enlargers, but some are better than others. I have a few Omega D5s and they are good, but not premium. There are a ton of spare parts at reasonable prices for those. Shipping is the big issue with enlargers. They need to go in a few boxes and some parts are fairly heavy. I can easily see shipping being as much as the enlarger sells for. So shop local? Where are you located?

I am in Los Angeles, California...I will look at CL. Thank you for the tips

[John Kasaian]

I am in Los Angeles, California...I will look at CL. Thank you for the tips

Since you're in the US you might come across an old Omega D-2 or D-II(same thing with one less crank.) Very capable grand old machines with an enthusiastic following because at one time most high school and college dark rooms had Omegas ---even the US Navy had Omegas ---so there should be a lot of these out there waiting for homes.

[Peter Lewin]

I'll go back to the OP's starting point. The Toyo 45D is a fairly heavy monorail, so if his desire is to have a 4x5 to take into the field, we can debate whether an enlarger is his top priority. I took a quick look at KEH just for pricing. The difficulty is that the folding woodies are all in the $750-$850 range, outside of budget. There are a number of Sinar F models down in the $200-$300 range. I started with an F, and while it was a bit bulky, I did quite a bit of day-hiking with it stuck in my daypack. (The F was Sinar's "Field" model, the simplest and lightest in its range monorails.) This isn't an ideal answer, but the OP should at least compare weights and see if that is even a direction worth pursuing. Personally I wouldn't go for the Intrepid or similar, because everyone who starts with something like that trades up, Press cameras, which have quite a following, would be the cheapest folding cameras, but they lack complete movements, and were designed for press use, not as field 4x5s. In the end you have to find the trade-offs that make the most sense to you.

[Jim Jones]

There really are no bad 4x5 enlargers, . . .

There was the Testrite. While I was overseas a friend bought one for me. I don't remember ever using it. The ancient DeJur I eventually used for a few decades is better in every way except being considerably heavier.

[pepeguitarra]

The Intrepid 4x5 Mk III is pretty good. It is only 2.2 pounds and has the most important movements and controls. I have the Mk II and I like it too.