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Duolab123
6-Nov-2018, 18:47
Just saw this

https://www.beselerphoto.com/light-sources/

Tin Can
6-Nov-2018, 18:54
I see LED is finally accepted. Good for them!

At least Beseler is still in business and supplying parts.

Some schools must buy new gear only, making a market.

Duolab123
6-Nov-2018, 21:33
I wonder where it's made? They have a fancy new timer as well

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1377561-REG/beseler_8197_digital_timer.html.

I have a theory, I think it might be an additive head with subtractive readout, like the late Beseler Universal.

Could be when you flip to b&w, the dials spin around to vc. 1 for Ilford, Kodak, Agfa units ? I stumbled on this today.

Wouldn't it be great to see high schools start teaching darkroom again :-)

Tin Can
7-Nov-2018, 03:35
12 miles from me the large High School and the declining State College both have very popular and long running Darkrooms with excellent instructors.

There are excellent B&W Fiber prints at the local State Park Lodge a CCC era original. The private local Art center, which emulates the Art Insitute of Chicago in scope and style on a smaller scale currrently has its largest hall exhibing 113 prints. Many are B&W 8x10 contact prints. A one man show.

Corran
7-Nov-2018, 08:18
This is good to see! I talked to a Beseler rep a couple of years ago and he told me this was in development. I have been waiting ever since to see it come to market.

The question is how much it will cost? I just sold off a digital camera yesterday...

Tin Can
7-Nov-2018, 08:35
I gotta guess $2.5K.


This is good to see! I talked to a Beseler rep a couple of years ago and he told me this was in development. I have been waiting ever since to see it come to market.

The question is how much it will cost? I just sold off a digital camera yesterday...

Corran
7-Nov-2018, 08:41
I am worried that you are right! I could not justify that expense right now. I only wish the Dichro 45 I was given actually worked!

ic-racer
7-Nov-2018, 10:26
If my D5500 heads ever stop running (I have 4) that thing is going on top of the enlarger. In fact, I might consider buying one while it is available. Reminds me of when I bought my first used D5500. They were still selling them NEW but I bought an old beat up one. 20 years later I wish I had bought the new one.

Duolab123
7-Nov-2018, 18:17
I called Beseler today. They expect the product to be available very soon. Sounds like a very elegant straight forward design. Three dials CMY, white light for black and white. If you want VC you dial in appropriate yellow and/or magenta. It does have dichro filters and a standard all in one 4x5 mixing chamber. Just like all the other heads you remove the entire condenser assy. and lock on this head. I didn't inquire about price. Stabilized power supply external. The illuminated dials dim when you turn out the room lights. Sounds like a great tool for educational purposes.
Jobo is making processors, Beseler is making new colorheads, Great! !

Oren Grad
7-Nov-2018, 19:14
I gotta guess $2.5K.

The predecessor version of the Beseler 4x5 dichro head is still listed by Adorama at $2264, so that sounds about right.

Duolab123
7-Nov-2018, 20:11
DICHRO 45SL SPECIFICATIONS Line Voltage: Model #8278L 120V ±5%, 60Hz Electronics: Internally stabilized, solid state Lamp: 3 Lamps, LED Array, Factory Replace Only (5 Year Warranty on LED Lamps) Type of Filtration: Dichroic Interference Filters Filtration: Yellow, Magenta, Cyan Auxiliary Filtration: None Blower: None Mixing Chambers: Standard 4x5 (Included) Dimensions: Head – 17”W x 14”H x 13”D Power Supply – 7”W x 4”H x 10”D Weight: Head – 17.25 pounds Power Supply – 5.8 pounds Shipping Dimensions: Head – 20.5”W x 19”H x 16.5”D Power Supply – 11”W x 6”H x 13”D Shipping Weight: Head – 21.5 pounds Power Supply – 6.5 pounds

This is from Beseler. I called customer service number. It sounds like people that have seen this are pretty excited. I think this is great news.

Tin Can
8-Nov-2018, 06:25
I have 2 Beseler CB7 with very different Beseler Color Heads both OE mounted on top of the larger CB7 double condenser set. One head is very old with some sort of light emitter square. I assume pre Dichroic filters, grey paint. It's in storage. Agfa label Beseler paint and has sliding filters.

The obviously newer CB7 head is a blue paint Beseler Dichro dg colorhead.

There were also non sliding filter Beseler color heads that use a normal P212 bulb and condensers.

The question is, are condensers better or worse for a Color Head that uses sliding Dichroic filters?




I called Beseler today. They expect the product to be available very soon. Sounds like a very elegant straight forward design. Three dials CMY, white light for black and white. If you want VC you dial in appropriate yellow and/or magenta. It does have dichro filters and a standard all in one 4x5 mixing chamber. Just like all the other heads you remove the entire condenser assy. and lock on this head. I didn't inquire about price. Stabilized power supply external. The illuminated dials dim when you turn out the room lights. Sounds like a great tool for educational purposes.
Jobo is making processors, Beseler is making new colorheads, Great! !

Bob Salomon
8-Nov-2018, 07:24
I have 2 Beseler CB7 with very different Beseler Color Heads both OE mounted on top of the larger CB7 double condenser set. One head is very old with some sort of light emitter square. I assume pre Dichroic filters, grey paint. It's in storage. Agfa label Beseler paint and has sliding filters.

The obviously newer CB7 head is a blue paint Beseler Dichro dg colorhead.

There were also non sliding filter Beseler color heads that use a normal P212 bulb and condensers.

The question is, are condensers better or worse for a Color Head that uses sliding Dichroic filters?

Several European color enlargers are condenser dichroic with a mixing box above the negative. They work very well!

Duolab123
8-Nov-2018, 17:22
Several European color enlargers are condenser dichroic with a mixing box above the negative. They work very well!

Beseler has a kit, I have this, it definitely adds contrast to VC papers. I've not tryed it with color. Another thing on my list to try

Takes a special light chamber that puts a circle of light in approximately the position of a regular light bulb

184304

Christopher Barrett
8-Nov-2018, 17:56
I bought Heiland's LED head with splitgrade controller for my L1200. About 2k Euro. Pretty cool stuff.

Drew Wiley
8-Nov-2018, 18:25
My advice, never be the first kid on the block to try out something expensive. The bugs might not be worked out yet. And while it's been a long time since Beseler came out with a new colorhead, they've flopped before, and frankly, flaked on service afterwards. The present company might indeed have a legitimate excuse when it claims it's not responsible for premature products under previous ownership; but that risk could equally apply in this case. Who knows who will own Beseler when you have an analogous problem? By contrast, halogen colorheads are tried and true, and far less expensive. How much output do these LED units actually have is another pertinent question. How big do you need to enlarge? How fast of a lens do you own? What kind of paper? I'm not trying to interject suspicion, and do commend their ongoing interest in darkroom products. But if it were me looking to purchase something like this, I'd want to do a lot of homework in advance.
But per condensers, I can't imagine why anyone would want em for color work. People nearly always diffuse em anyway.

Duolab123
8-Nov-2018, 19:33
I have plenty of stuff. I doubt I will be in the market soon. There's a lot of 30 year old Beseler heads out there still running. Old equipment is the biggest competition for any darkroom equipment company.

Educational market is prime target. I hope it works as good as it looks. What I suspect is it's sophisticated on the inside and very user friendly on the outside. I have a copy of the user manual, 5 pages, 3 dials and a switch. No lcd digital menu, etc etc.

Corran
8-Nov-2018, 19:49
Simplicity is good. While there are plenty of used color heads out there, it seems they are developing problems. Old electronics - what do you expect? And shipping those big things is expensive. I paid for shipping one to me from a nice person who gave it away but it didn't work. Money/time wasted. Too expensive to fix.

New color heads with traditional bulbs are still very expensive. Supply and demand.

John Layton
11-Nov-2018, 05:46
Educational market is good so long as such institutions continue to value analog photography as part of their curricula...which they indeed should if they want to remain responsible to their students.

As for LED output...Heiland's is phenomenal - more than enough to print 30x40's with a 150mm G-Claron stopped down to its "optimized" aperture of f/22. A bit painful for me to sell my beloved (but under utilized) SWC in order to afford this (Heiland) unit, but its turned out to be a great decision!

Duolab123
11-Nov-2018, 09:49
Educational market is good so long as such institutions continue to value analog photography as part of their curricula...which they indeed should if they want to remain responsible to their students.

As for LED output...Heiland's is phenomenal - more than enough to print 30x40's with a 150mm G-Claron stopped down to its "optimized" aperture of f/22. A bit painful for me to sell my beloved (but under utilized) SWC in order to afford this (Heiland) unit, but its turned out to be a great decision!

This is an important point, it will be interesting to see how Beseler executes LED. I can't help but wonder if this new unit will be followed up with a VC model. When I talked to Beseler I was told the dials are much easier to turn and smooth. I suspect (hope) that these are not a mechanical linkage. If these are smooth electronic dials, this would make split grade VC printing easy. I always used mixed M and Y for constant neutral density. I was afraid to change filtration on the old Dichro S heads, too much wiggle. I've never even seen the Heiland unit, but I've heard nothing but rave reviews.
I wouldn't buy a new unit that I couldn't use for split printing.

Drew Wiley
12-Nov-2018, 17:13
Seems to be an apples vs oranges comparison here, with the Heiland being a VC head, but the Beseler allegedly a YMC colorhead. Is this correct?

interneg
12-Nov-2018, 17:30
Seems to be an apples vs oranges comparison here, with the Heiland being a VC head, but the Beseler allegedly a YMC colorhead. Is this correct?

Heiland is RGB LED of specific wavelengths with different controllers for colour, VC, splitgrade. Beseler seems to be white LED & dichroics apparently.

tgtaylor
12-Nov-2018, 17:35
I don't know if this is correct or not but it seems that I remember reading some time back that the new color papers were designed to be exposed with LED light sources. Is this true and if so what is the benefits over using the old heads like the 45S?

Thomas

interneg
12-Nov-2018, 18:02
I don't know if this is correct or not but it seems that I remember reading some time back that the new color papers were designed to be exposed with LED light sources. Is this true and if so what is the benefits over using the old heads like the 45S?

Thomas

Faster emulsions optimised for shorter exposure & more saturation from the couplers essentially. More for digital exposure in general than just LED.

Drew Wiley
12-Nov-2018, 18:39
No, color papers are NOT designed for LED exposure. Why would they be? The remaining big labs which consume the lion's share of color paper are equipped with proven devices. Certain Fuji and Kodak papers have been slightly tweaked for higher contrast and a bit more green sensitivity for sake of commercial RGB laser printers, but this does not diminish their suitability for optical enlarger use. But I have yet to find any reference to the Heiland unit for actual color paper use. Does anyone here have that kind of experience with it? I really don't see how a bunch of little LED dots could be engineered precisely enough at this stage of the game without accessory dichroic narrow-band trimmer filters and a mixing box.

Duolab123
11-Oct-2021, 09:32
Has anyone seen the new Beseler 45sL led head? This needs a review from a user.