121mm f8 Super Angulon in Synchro Compur lens board size

[jprat]

Hello

I have the old Schneider 121mm f8 Super Angulon in a Synchro Compur shutter, that looks like been built as part of the lens rather than a independent shutter (like Copals). Does any one knows wish lens board hole size will it take? My guess is that it will fit on 42mm hole, but I'm not sure.

Many thanks

Jorge

[Dan Fromm]

Look at the lens again and measure again. The cells should be screwed into a Synchro-Compur #0 in the usual way. The #0 mount hole is, according to SKGrimes, 34.6 mm.

[dentkimterry]

I have that same lens and it took a 2" hole in the lens board to mount it.184080

[Dan Fromm]

I have that same lens and it took a 2" hole in the lens board to mount it.184080

Are you sure? I ask because all of the catalogs I have for the 121/8 SA say it is in a #0 shutter. The 120/8 is also in a #0. Ain't no standard Compur/Copal/Prontor that wants a 2" (50.8 mm) hole. Per Grimes, the progression is #0, 34.6; #1, 39.0; #3, 62mm; #3S, 61mm.

#2s want several sizes, from 50 mm to 55.8 mm. Is your lens in some sort of #2?

[Daniel Unkefer]

Schneider called it a "Compur Special" as they could fit it into a smaller shutter (one size smaller than cells directly into a std shutter). I have this same lens but it is permanently mounted on a Norma rabbit ear board.

[dentkimterry]

Here is the locking ring for this lens.
184093

I think this is an earlier version of this lens. Later models came with a #0 shutter.

[Dan Fromm]

Schneider called it a "Compur Special" as they could fit it into a smaller shutter (one size smaller than cells directly into a std shutter). I have this same lens but it is permanently mounted on a Norma rabbit ear board.

Dan, are you sure? I ask because the Schneider catalogs I have access to -- clearly, not all -- don't mention a Compur Special shutter. This Linhof catalog https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B50p4jef-eUcY3ZWcU13RTd5aDA/edit mentions a couple of lenses, not all Schneider, in Compur special shutters and explains that they have linked speed and aperture settings.

To avoid pointless wrangling, would you please tell us the diameter of y'r 121/8 SA's front cell's mounting thread? That'll answer the questions of whether it is in a standard shutter and, if so, which size.

Thanks,

Dan

[dentkimterry]

Dan, are you sure? I ask because the Schneider catalogs I have access to -- clearly, not all -- don't mention a Compur Special shutter. This Linhof catalog https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B50p4jef-eUcY3ZWcU13RTd5aDA/edit mentions a couple of lenses, not all Schneider, in Compur special shutters and explains that they have linked speed and aperture settings.

To avoid pointless wrangling, would you please tell us the diameter of y'r 121/8 SA's front cell's mounting thread? That'll answer the questions of whether it is in a standard shutter and, if so, which size.

Thanks,

Dan

My front cell is secured to the shutter by 3 set screws. I am not going to mess with those!
Terry

[Daniel Unkefer]

Dan, Here is the Schneider Catalog:

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1916/31852196528_17c309036a_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/QwEQjd)Super Angulon Catalog (https://flic.kr/p/QwEQjd) by Nokton48 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/18134483@N04/), on Flickr

According to the specs it's a #0, but I'll wager it's a #1 or bigger mounting hole. This lens can not be simply unscrewed, you would have to completely strip it down. You can plainly see the #0 inside the outer lens casing.

[Dan Fromm]

Thanks, Dan. I wasn't asking you to strip the lens down, just remove the front cell from the shutter and measure its mounting threads (the ones that screw into the shutter). Your news that the shutter is marked #0 is as good.

Could you remove the rear cell? This would make the last couple of mm of the shutter's rear tube accessible and measurable.

Thanks again,

Dan

Oh, and by the way, your catalog agrees with mine about the shutter sizes the various lenses go into. It is for newer f/8 SAs. The 1963 catalog shows every f/8er shorter than 121 mm in a #00, just like the 90/8 s/n 6 621 942 (1960 or so) that I use as a paperweight.

[Jeff Keller]

The shutter appears to be mounted in a housing which has a larger diameter mounting thread than the shutter itself. The rear lens group screws into the housing rather than the shutter. (As best I can tell) Hopefully the attached picture comes across. I measure 48mm for the outside of the housing but it is mounted on an extended board and my calipers barely fit inside the tube.

jeff
184095

[Daniel Unkefer]

It's impossible to remove the front cell without taking the entire lens completely apart. There's a #0 deep inside the outer casing (per the catalog), but obviously the rear mounting flange is way bigger than that. I seem to recall that they did that so as to utilize the smaller shutters faster top speed? Back when people used Super Angulons wide open and handheld...….

See above ^^^ Not so easy to accurately measure this unit but two others so far have provided measurements. Close enough to cut a hole in a lensboard?



Looks like he has a Sinar lens also from the look of the rear board. The catalog references 75mm, looking at the above I could believe that.

[Dan Fromm]

Thanks, Dan, for the pictures and explanations. Who'da thunk it?

The retaining ring looks pretty normal for a #0.

[Daniel Unkefer]

Could be!

[ottluuk]

The 121/8 SA apparently came in several different mounts - some (later production?) are mounted directly on common shutters.
Others have a special casing and modified controls around the shutter.
Mine has a casing but is (at least cosmetically) different from dentkimterry's (see attached picture). The shutter is labeled Synchro-Compur, its plastic-tipped controls move in a slot cut to the outer casing and the shutter's own casing is smooth metal, not the wavy pressing seen on dentkimterry's. The rear element has a fat cylindrical adapter piece going straight to the lens board. I haven't tried to remove it so I can't say what size hole is under it. I could check the size and take better pictures in a couple of weeks when I'm near the lens again – just posting to show another variation.

184173

[C Henry]

I have two versions of the 121mm SA lens. The first is in an integrated lens/shutter which requires a 52.5mm lensboard hole. I then subsequently purchased a Copal 0 version.

[neil poulsen]

I have two versions of the 121mm SA lens. The first is in an integrated lens/shutter which requires a 52.5mm lensboard hole. I then subsequently purchased a Copal 0 version.

That's what I'm wondering . . . why not get the more recent version? I have a recent version mounted in a Copal shutter. It's been a good performer, and there's no problem mounting the lens.

Or, trade up to the multi-coated 120mm SA.

[Jeff Keller]

The older version has the 10 blade aperture.

The Nikkor 120 f8 has a larger image circle.

There are quite a few choices. Pick whatever makes you happy,

Jeff