Ok I might have gone overboard with my betterscanning holder

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Replaced the nylon screws with stainless steel ones with nylon tip and once I found my optimum focus height, I then used a dial gauge to be sure the scan glass holder was perfectly level. Next I will make a 4x5 focus target and optimize the focus distance. Currently it is approximately 0.125 in from scanner glass to top of tabs the anr glass sits on. Another thought I had was to replace the screws wirh 3/16 x 100 dcrews for super fine adjustments. Thats 100 threads per in as opposed to 32 threads per in.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

I am gonna tweak the focus, once I get a target to do so, I have something may work, but won't know till I try it. Otherwise, have to order a target.

[Alan9940]

I like the idea of replacing those fiddly nylon screws; may do that with mine. Sounds like you're putting much more precision into the height adjustment than I...I just used a sharp, well exposed 4x5 negative making many scans at slightly different heights, then compared at 100% in PS. Once I found the optimum height, I turned back the screws to zero, then out to the height needed. Since I use my flatbed scanner only for work prints to live with for awhile, it's close enough for me. If I find I have an exceptional image, I'll send out for a drum scan.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

When I have the height set properly, I get very sharp images. I think the only thing that it falls a tad short on is super dark areas (really dense areas of negative) Sometimes they just come out black (very small details) but when I view on light table, I can make out detail. Too bad Vuescan and other scanning software does not allow for local adjustment to allow that detail to come thru. I've tried the multi-exposure, but it doesn't seem to really work. With my scanner, I get images I would not hesitate to print at 32x40 and larger like huge panos or portraits, etc.

The nylon screws do not have good fit so they wiggle and are easily knocked out of position. I was using thread tape on them to get a tighter fit of the nylon fasteners and that worked really well.

[Alan9940]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply my scans weren't sharp; they are sharp enough for any size print I could generate at home. And, if scanning 8x10 film, well...output size is not a problem. ;) But, as you said, it's difficult to impossible (at least, with my old flatbed scanner) to pull good detail out of dense shadow areas. I run Silverfast Ai 8 and have tried all the tricks, but it's still not there. A drum scan can easily handle the dynamic range. But, at what cost? I've got to really like an image to pay for a drum scan. There is a guy over in CA that provides a scanning service at very reasonable prices. He uses a Hasselblad Imacon 848 Flextight scanner and can handle everything up to 4x5. Haven't tried him, yet, but I plan to sometime soon.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

I know. You didn't infer anything wrong. So, all good. I was just saying for the cost of a drum scanner or getting drum scans the V850 does great. I bet there is a way to pull out shadow detail, just have t figured it out. Template e Camerea can do drum scans so I kight try them on a difficult negative and have it scanned at same dpi as I do with my Epson at 4200. Would be a way of direct comparison. Downside is the prices they charge are a rip off. The machine doesn't care what resolution it is told to scan at. Same cost whether 1dpi or 4200dpi.

[Laminarman]

Sorry to revive this old thread. Steve, I am intrigued, where did you get the stainless screws and what thread size are they that will fit? I hate to say that I didn't notice a very big improvement with the Betterscanning fluid mount holder, but then again I have an Epson V850 and I've been impressed out of the box. The learning curve was steep. I found the Epson holders do a nice job but I don't like how they handle. The new ones do have adjustable feet on them. I found the nylon screws finicky and tough to work with, hard to get the allen wrench in and pretty tough to be exact with them. So my initial scan comparing in Lightroom showed that 1/4 was best, and I think Doug said that was about .2mm. I cut little strips of the plastic sheet that came in the Aztek mylar and I micrometered them at .21mm. So I backed the screws flush and used masking tape to hold a piece and the thickness is about .25mm, much more stable than the screws. Then I did two pieces thick, three pieces thick...and I didn't notice much difference. Then I got tired. I think I'm going to repeat it but use PS at 100% as stated. I'm curious how you used a dial gauge to double check glass height to tab surface, having trouble picturing that from the photo. I thought a shim would be more stable than the screws. Overall however I love the holder, and like that I can make my own masks and the film stays flat.

[Jim Andrada]

Seems to me that the machine cares very much about the scan resolution - well not really the machine but the owner of the machine who's running a scanning business. Higher resolution translates into longer scan times which implies that you can shove fewer scans a day through the system which would imply that you need to charge more for higher resolution scans..

[Steven Ruttenberg]

On my V850, I don't really notice a whole lot of difference in scan times between resolutions once you get above 2400 dpi (rough estimate) Given the amount of time one spends on setting up a shot, whether portrait or landscape or anything else, and the cost of film, developing, etc. Getting the very last drop of performance out of your scanner or enlarger should be a requirement. It is for me. Otherwise, what is the point?

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Sorry to revive this old thread. Steve, I am intrigued, where did you get the stainless screws and what thread size are they that will fit? I hate to say that I didn't notice a very big improvement with the Betterscanning fluid mount holder, but then again I have an Epson V850 and I've been impressed out of the box. The learning curve was steep. I found the Epson holders do a nice job but I don't like how they handle. The new ones do have adjustable feet on them. I found the nylon screws finicky and tough to work with, hard to get the allen wrench in and pretty tough to be exact with them. So my initial scan comparing in Lightroom showed that 1/4 was best, and I think Doug said that was about .2mm. I cut little strips of the plastic sheet that came in the Aztek mylar and I micrometered them at .21mm. So I backed the screws flush and used masking tape to hold a piece and the thickness is about .25mm, much more stable than the screws. Then I did two pieces thick, three pieces thick...and I didn't notice much difference. Then I got tired. I think I'm going to repeat it but use PS at 100% as stated. I'm curious how you used a dial gauge to double check glass height to tab surface, having trouble picturing that from the photo. I thought a shim would be more stable than the screws. Overall however I love the holder, and like that I can make my own masks and the film stays flat.

O got my screws from Mcmaster Carr in 6x32 same as the better scanning holder. https://www.mcmaster.com/90291a143 they have a nylon tip so not to scratch scan glass. They fit better than the nylon ones.

1. Set up dial gauge so it is on a flat surface (same as the holder)
2. Zero out the screws in the holder
3. Zero out the dial gauge on holder frame next to a screw
4. Check that gauge remains zero next to each of the screws keep gauge in one spot and move holder around, by sliding on surface if possible ) granite table top works good for this
5. Now adjust the screws to your starting point (take a guess) and do a rough scan to see how close you are. Use a resolution target. I used one from Stouffer
6. See this for how focus was changed https://www.flickr.com/photos/157376714@N08/albums
7. I adjust the screws with the holder on the scanner glass (don't remove it lest you mess a screw up, etc
8. Before each scan I check the height of each screw as above
9. Once I am satisfied with focus for my given scan resolution (it can change a bit from one resolution to the next), I put a small stripe of white fingernail polish on each screw and wait for it to dry before moving it. This ensure the screws never move and if I do move one by accident, I can readily see that and correct.
10. Remember, the height is the height of the frame above the scan glass, not the scan glass itself.
11. you can then check the height of the ANR glass (side away from scan glass) by sliding the frame under the dial gauge and measuring the variation. If you did it right and your surface is flat, there should be no variation. If there is, make adjustment and recheck, then stripe with fingernail polish and let it dry. This is actually how I made my final measurement after finding focus and setting all screws to ensure holder/glass where perfectly level and parallel to each other. I could have gone one step further and checked how flat/level the scan glass to the frame, but didn't want to get crazy.

You can also use the tabs to set the height as well, but at some point, you will need to measure the frame and the glass as I outlined above.

My next step will be to order the 100 threads per in fasteners mentioned above and either re-tap the holes or if there is room, put inserts in (which I prefer) This will give the most precise method of adjustment and thread tightness (no play)

One other thing is that one making adjustments, be sure to have dial gauge on the frame of the holder (or glass in line with a each screw) to be sure you remain parallel to scan glass. If frame is not even and parallel, you will get an image that is sharp on one side and goes out as you move across the image. Much like a large format camera with movements not zeroed.

[Laminarman]

I was having some variable results and Doug emailed me. I was scanning in Silverfast and he recommended Epson Scan. I did the "scratch the unexposed emulstion" trick which helped. I finally settled, after much much work, at .70mm height for a much better result. After doing this a bit, wet mounting is very quick. As a side note, I got some Gamsol (sp?) odorless mineral spirits from Michaels which others have recommended. Very greasy and leave some marks after evaporating. There are times you just pay for a better product so I'm sticking with Kami.

[Peter De Smidt]

Lumina is also a good scanning fluid.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

I use the Kami fluid from Aztec. Never tried LUmina. I like the Kami as it evaporates quickly and leaves zero residue.