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andreios
12-Aug-2018, 00:48
As I am returning to more and more LF shooting, I realized that I don't like constantly re-mounting a lens (namely my 305 GClaron) from one board to another and back again... And yes, I know there are solutions to avoid it but I have yet to find a sinar to graphic(toyo field) adapter so that I could use a lens on both my Toyo metal field (half plate) and my Tachi 8x10.
Anyway, since my other two lenses for 8x10 are of a vintage persuasion (the WA velostigmat and a 19in artar) I've been thinking about adding something of similar age / character in between them - like a commercial Ektar. But to find one on this side of Atlantic is not very easy. But surely, I thought, there must be a plenty of lenses that were produced here and are lying somewhere on the shelves...
So my question is, what might be a good alternative to good old sort of "everyday" 8x10 lenses for mainly landscape/architecture/general use somewhere in the reagon 12-14 inches (300-350mm)?

Of course there is plenty of modern 300mm plasmats, but I'd prefer something lighter / more compact.

Thank you!

Oslolens
12-Aug-2018, 01:29
As I am returning to more and more LF shooting, I realized that I don't like constantly re-mounting a lens (namely my 305 GClaron) from one board to another and back again... And yes, I know there are solutions to avoid it but I have yet to find a sinar to graphic(toyo field) adapter so that I could use a lens on both my Toyo metal field (half plate) and my Tachi 8x10.
Anyway, since my other two lenses for 8x10 are of a vintage persuasion (the WA velostigmat and a 19in artar) I've been thinking about adding something of similar age / character in between them - like a commercial Ektar. But to find one on this side of Atlantic is not very easy. But surely, I thought, there must be a plenty of lenses that were produced here and are lying somewhere on the shelves...
So my question is, what might be a good alternative to good old sort of "everyday" 8x10 lenses for mainly landscape/architecture/general use somewhere in the reagon 12-14 inches (300-350mm)?

Of course there is plenty of modern 300mm plasmats, but I'd prefer something lighter / more compact.

Thank you!300mm Nikkor-M and the smallest plasmat Fujinon-W /CM-W comes to mind. Older lenses might be a triplet Gundlach or....? If you test your G-claron against the sun, do you see unwanted reflections? If not, buy another one :)

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mdarnton
12-Aug-2018, 05:52
Tessars, lots of Tessars! The Commercial Ektar is basically a carefully made f/6.3 Tessar design, in most instances.

Dan Fromm
12-Aug-2018, 06:16
Commercial Ektars were post-WW II coated f/6.3 tessar types. A number of European makers made f/6.3 tessar types after WW II. Nearly all were coated. The problem with most is finding one in shutter, especially in the focal lengths the OP wants.

OP, your idea that tessar types and Artars are vintage made me giggle. The real divide, extreme wide angle and telephoto lenses excepted, is between anastigmats and other, with a small secondary divide between coated and not coated. This last is more or less 1947 and later vs. pre-1947.

Drew Wiley
12-Aug-2018, 18:24
"Smaller and lighter" means something more around f/9 if you're talking about a tessar. The 300 Nikkor M is quite small and precise, but the image circle doesn't offer much wiggle room. The dialyte 300 Fuji C is a little more generous in this respect, and also quite compact. These are fully modern multicoated lenses. But neither will be ideal for architectural shots needing significant rise. Fuji 300A will have a lot more coverage. It's a modern plastmat in a lightwt no.1 shutter; even the 360 version is in a number 1, has a huge image circle, and is way lighter than general-purpose plasmats like W's and CMW's. But these are uncommon and pricey. G-Clarons are similar to Fuji A's but single-coated and more common. Old 6.3 Ektars came in huge shutters. But any way you look at it, you're going to spend way more than a simple adapter board, which any basic machine shop can easily make if you supply them with the Sinar blank. But if you need vintage, it's easy to find 360 f/9 process tessars in barrel, and then have them fitted into a no.3 shutter. They tend to have smoother background blur that the more modern lenses I listed above.

Mark Sawyer
12-Aug-2018, 19:13
An equivalent focal length and aperture Xenar.

Bernice Loui
12-Aug-2018, 20:10
Xenar is similar to C. Ektar but different in some ways.

Xenar in barrel can be f4.5 full aperture up to 480mm, while the C. Ektar is f6.3 full aperture. There are non C. Ektars that are f4.5 full aperture
181486

Stopping down to f8, they are pretty similar with the Xenar being a bit lower contrast than the C. Ektar. Color balance (IMO, the Ektar is excellent) is different between the two. C. Ektar and other Ektars used Lanthium glass, glass types used in the Xenar might not have Lanthium glass.


Other Tessar in Europe, Doctor Optic, Zeiss Tessar, CCCP Industar, Boyer, Cooke and a host of others.


Bernice

andreios
13-Aug-2018, 09:27
Thank you for your responses... Obviously my lens-lore is very poor... :) At least my question allowed someone to practice the virtue of mirth.. :)

Anyway, I will use your pointers and have a look around what's available, in the end, I could live with a lens even without shutter (my 19in artar is shutterless and so far I did not have any trouble with that). The Nikkor Ms and Fujinon As are maybe as scarce on the old continent as the commercial ektars, so that would not be much help..

Dan Fromm
13-Aug-2018, 11:29
Andreios, if you can live without a shutter look for a post-WW II CZJ f/6.3 Tessar or a coated Berthiot Ser. IIa f/5.7 Olor. These are both rough equivalents of the f/6.3 Commercial Ektars. If you can live with an uncoated lens, there are some quite inexpensive 300/5.7 Ser. IIa Olors on ebay.de and ebay.fr.

Pere Casals
13-Aug-2018, 14:49
I have yet to find a sinar to graphic(toyo field) adapter

This is something you can DIY, simply use the frame of a sinar standard and fix it on a toyo lensboard that has a big hole, enough to allow the rear cell to pass.

You can use a cheap Multi-Purpose sinar standard for that.

If you use two cameras, better if you solve the lens boardcompatibility as soon as possible, this is what I found...

I use sinar and cambo and it was a nightmare, I made a 3D printed adapter and I'm really happy with that.

181505

Liquid Artist
13-Aug-2018, 19:51
andreios,
When I bought my 8x10 it had a Packard nicely installed, so it gave me the chance to use some of the barrel lenses I had been collecting.
Now I prefer shooting with the often vintage barrel lenses and only use a traditional shutter for my portrait work.

DG 3313
13-Aug-2018, 20:09
Think about using SK Grimes.....you can send them a Sinar board, a Toyo board and about 100 usd and they will modify the Sinar board to receive the Toyo board.

I did.......and all of my 45AR lenses can be used on my View camera. My older barrel lenses can sit in front of the Sinar shutter without changing boards or duplicating lenses.

Grimes needs the Toyo board to make sure it is a perfect fit inside of the modified Sinar and it will be.

consummate_fritterer
13-Aug-2018, 20:21
I have yet to find a sinar to graphic(toyo field) adapter so that I could use a lens on both my Toyo metal field (half plate) and my Tachi 8x10.

Just buy the front standard from a 4x5 Graphic (or a junk Graphic camera and rob the part) and mount it to the front of a Sinar board. Drill a hole in each corner and attach with machine screws (don't overtighten). Use a bit of black silicon between them to assure light-tightness.

andreios
13-Aug-2018, 22:59
This is something you can DIY, simply use the frame of a sinar standard and fix it on a toyo lensboard that has a big hole, enough to allow the rear cell to pass.

You can use a cheap Multi-Purpose sinar standard for that.

If you use two cameras, better if you solve the lens boardcompatibility as soon as possible, this is what I found...

I use sinar and cambo and it was a nightmare, I made a 3D printed adapter and I'm really happy with that.

181505Thanks for the suggestion, but it's the other way round, my travel camera is the half plate toyo metal field that uses smaller Graphic lens boards.. But some of the suggestions like attaching a butchered front standard from a graphic camera to a sonar board do actually make sense!

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Pere Casals
14-Aug-2018, 04:05
Thanks for the suggestion, but it's the other way round, my travel camera is the half plate toyo metal field that uses smaller Graphic lens boards.. But some of the suggestions like attaching a butchered front standard from a graphic camera to a sonar board do actually make sense!

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ok, I understand...

Just it can be added that there is another straight way I had considered in the past, you modify a lensboard from each camera to take a third (small) lensboard, that can be a custom design, a view camera design, or even a enlarger lensboard similar to this:

181514

This is interesting for field photography because lens boards can be way smaller, and this saves a lot of space in the bag, allowing to store all lenses in a single plastic tupper that has a foam block with the right holes. The circle of the lensboard can be as small as the largest rear element you have.

John Kasaian
14-Aug-2018, 06:30
Not Tessars, but certainly regarded as alternatives for the Commercial Ektars were older Schneider Symmars.
Commercial photographers appear to have used them in the same ways as Commercial Ektars with very similar (to my old eyes) results
Congos are more recent Japanese Tessar versions of Commercial Ektars and are found in modern shutters.
Either may be more widely available in Europe---truthfully, I wouldn't know.
Another Commercial Ektar type Tessar lens is the 375mm Ilex, which might be worth looking out for.

Oslolens
14-Aug-2018, 06:36
Another Commercial Ektar type Tessar lens is the 375mm Ilex, which might be worth looking out for.

I can recommend the f7 Ilex 508mm. Mine is super sharp wide open, but the shutter size #5 is not what you are looking for. The Kodak 135mm anastigmat light out 5x7" and is sharp all over 4x5" image, so this might be a way to go with longer focal lenghts.

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R. Peters
19-Aug-2018, 12:37
Rodenstock made a coated 210mm f6.3 Ysarex in Synchro Compur shutter that should be a fine lens. The Zeiss 210mm f6.3 Tessar has already been mentioned. I would expect both to be comparable to the Kodak Commercial Ektar.

R. Peters
19-Aug-2018, 13:03
Rodenstock offered a 210mm f6.3 coated Ysarex in synchro Compur that should be in the same league as the 8-1/2" Commercial Ektar.

andreios
19-Aug-2018, 13:05
Thanks. Did they make them in longer focal lengths as well? I am looking more into the 300-360mm area..

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Mark Sampson
19-Aug-2018, 13:56
i've owned, used and enjoyed many different Kodak Ektars, Commercial and otherwise, from 125mm through 355mm. Long-time readers here will remember that I worked as an industrial photographer at Kodak for decades (so there were plenty of Ektars around).
I'll guess that any coated Tessar-style lens will give you the kind of results you seek. Assuming good mechanical and optical condition, of course.