Backpack for 8x10

[f9likethekey]

I have been shooting 4x5 for a while now and have a great backpack setup that allows me and my OCD to keep everything separate and organized in one case (lowepro whistler 450). I recently moved into 8x10 and could not find very much at all about a similar setup for hikes more than a couple hundred feet from the car. After searching the internet / forums / dead links the most I could find is an F.64 backpack or a red flyer wagon (a cooler was thrown in a couple of times as well). I currently still own the F.64 bag but it was too limited in space and the hip belt was not very comfortable for long periods with a lot of weight.

Well all, I share with you the bag I bought on a whim and now love... the lowepro trekker 650. This bag keeps things organized the way I like, carries 6 film holders, a tripod, 4 lenses, all my accessories and does so with a frame that could be designed for long distance hiking. So far I've only used it over 12 miles but it is so comfortable compared to the F.64 I had to share.

Also, it fits in overhead bins.

175091 175089 175088 175087

[photog_ed]

Thanks for posting this. I recently bought an f64 pack for 8x10 but I haven't tried any long hikes with it. It's nice to know there's a good alternative.

[Alan9940]

Glad you found something that works for you...it can be difficult with 8x10. I use a Kelty pack/frame with RPT cases inside for the camera and lenses. I carry holders in an RPT cascading case w/strap, which makes long distance hiking out of the question, but for anything I do it works out okay. The nice thing about the Kelty pack is that I have an F-Stop ICU for my 4x5 outfit which allows me to simply unload the 8x10 stuff, toss in the ICU, and I'm good to go!

[Drew Wiley]

I have a whole pile of vintage external frame packs, just enough hopefully to supply me with spare parts till I'm old n shrunken enough to be buried in one of them. But with the 70's Kelty now in use, I have different rectangular liners that just drop into the big top compartment for the respective kits, whether 4x5, 8x10, MF systems. Side pouches are for items used in common like meter, filters, view lenses. Since all these are true packs, they can be configured for anything from a dayhike to two weeks of backpacking gear and supplies. But my long-haul pack per se is set aside for now, already prep for summer, minus only food, camera choice, and goose down gear I don't want rolled tight yet. But I try to keep even day kits heavy for conditioning purposes.

[Torlief]

Thanks for sharing this. I have an older Lowepro supertrekker that holds my Chamonix Alpinist and 2 lenses and all my misc but is only deep enough to hold 2 film holders. Its also not very confortable with outdated and underpadded shoulder straps. I would like something I could get 3-4 holders in and that will not hurt my body after a few hours. Ive been looking at the F-stop bags which seem super nice but are just so expensive. Ill check this bag out for sure. You feel its comfortable even with 4 lenses in it? Cheers.

[David Schaller]

I'm with Drew on this, using actual backpacks made for hiking, with no special "photo" branding. I favor old Dana Designs internal frame packs for their excellent weight-carrying attributes.

[Sal Santamaura]

...underpadded shoulder straps...That's my concern with the shoulder straps (and waist belt) shown in the OP's photos.


...the F-stop bags...Same under padded belt/straps issue with them.

[Drew Wiley]

Hey the wind stopped... Maybe I will get out with the Kelty pack n 8x10 today!

[tgtaylor]

I've been using the 600 AW Trekker for several years now for my Toyo 810MII and I have been quite satisfied. The 600 is similar to the newer 650 except that it allows for tripods to be carried on both sides as well as on the rear. I can get as many as 5 8x10 Toyo holders in an MC Photo holder case and slip it in the outside rear compartment and as many as 4 lens in with the camera if I place one on the folded camera. Spot meter, loupe, lens cleaning kit...etc all fit inside. As a practical matter though I hardly ever pack more than 3 lens and 2 holders as I usually know what I am going to shoot having scouted it out in advance.

Thomas

[Vaughn]

Glad you found something that works great for you!

I have a MEI tour pack set up for my 8x10 -- photo below with my Zone VI 8x10 and three or 4 lenses. My lens selection has shifted since -- unfortunately to heavier glass and/or shutters. The pack looks to be similar in size to yours, but I had to divide and pad the pack myself. I can carry 7 to 8 holders in a pinch, but prefer just 5 (I rarely scout)...the removable exterior pocket/daypack holds 5 holders and smaller stuff. Two hide-a-way side pockets (hidden in the photo) -- can carry a couple quarts of water and lunch if needed. Full-on adjustable suspension, well padded, and very comfortable on all-day hikes. When I was having worse lower back issues, the hipbelt/padding actually supported my back and my back felt better with the pack on than when it was off. It has held up very well these past 20 years.

Now for the way-back machine: I have been backpacking since the late 60s (city boy)...first a Camp Trails pack then moved up to Kelty. In 1973 I bought the first full-on internal frame pack, the Kelty Tour Pack http://patentpending.blogs.com/patent_pending_blog/2008/06/the-first-inter.html $89 bucks! One thing that sold me on it was when I was hitch-hiking around the West, there was no frame to dig into me while sitting in the back of VW bugs, etc with my pack on my lap. I hitchhiked around NZ with it in 1980/81 with my 4x5 camera pack strapped to the back of my backpack. I probably looked pretty silly. I used it heavily for ten years when I decided I needed more volume...and internal frame pack technology changed quite a bit in ten years. I bought a Gregory when they still had their shop in San Diego next to A16. They even gave me an unasked-for discount when I mentioned I was a wilderness ranger. Cool.

The important thing is that transporting one's equipment should not be to painful burden that zaps the joy out of photographing. I have access to some old Kelty pack frames. I have an 11x14 that needs transportation, along with one or two lenses and two to four holders. It would be nice to cover a mile of ground. Working on it...but something with wheels sure sounds nice for the more civilized locales!

[f9likethekey]

Thanks for sharing this. I have an older Lowepro supertrekker that holds my Chamonix Alpinist and 2 lenses and all my misc but is only deep enough to hold 2 film holders. Its also not very confortable with outdated and underpadded shoulder straps. I would like something I could get 3-4 holders in and that will not hurt my body after a few hours. Ive been looking at the F-stop bags which seem super nice but are just so expensive. Ill check this bag out for sure. You feel its comfortable even with 4 lenses in it? Cheers.

I do feel it was very comfortable over the 12 miles, even with all 4 lenses (including a Nikkor W 360). I really thought about using a hiking backpack like some folks are saying, but having to pull out separate cases to access my gear doesn't work for my flow. As for the padding, I've had some older lowepro bags that were very short in the padding department. I'm not sure when, but their newer bags have much more padding and it's designed like a hiking backpack. All in all the pack weighed in at 47.9 pounds and I wasn't sore after 12 miles.

[f9likethekey]

The 600 is similar to the newer 650 except that it allows for tripods to be carried on both sides as well as on the rear.

I did take a look at the 600 but I wanted the side pockets for the dark cloth and accessories. I originally had the tripod on the back center, but the tripod was a bit too heavy to be so far mounted from my back. I typically keep it strapped to the side that carries my darkcloth, and not under the center flap as shown.

[Drew Bedo]

Haven't read every post . . .sorry if this is redundant.

There is a school of thought that argues for finding a dedicated heavy duty backpack that fits you well. Then adapting the pack to carry the LF camera you have. This was the design concept behind the now discontinued "PhotoBackpacker" line of gear.

[jesse1996]

I've been looking for something to haul my gear around the city in! This may be the best solution figuring ill be going in and out of subways so much! I'll definitely be checking this bag out.

[jesse1996]

Hello all,

You've all seen this question schpeal a billion times. However a lot of these threads are old and I wanted to see if and LF users on here had some updated suggestions on a backpack for 8x10. I've been looking at MEI, Lowepro (EXPENSIVE!), and even F64. But I wanted to see if you all had input. I'm pretty spry being that I'm 22 so I'm willing to walk a good distance for the time being to get my shots. As of now the MEI Trekker 2 looks pretty nice given the $210 price and being made in 'Murica. Let's hear your suggestions for this newbie.

[Oslolens]

The biggest LowePro not longer for sale, only used. It has room outside for 45cm rails for my Bender, but is filled with a Wehman with 2-3 film holders and 4 lenses, 150mm XL, 240 Sironar-S, 300mm macro and a 450mm Nikkor-M. I sometimes add a 210mm f5,6 and it gets tiny in there.

Big Wehman, Toyo 5x7" and a small Chamonix

[neil poulsen]

Which 8x10?

[Oren Grad]

Threads merged.

[MikeL]

Some more thoughts, sorta recent
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?139902-8x10-Backpack-Rucksack-options

[domaz]

I've been using this full-zip REI backpack for my 8x10 (https://www.rei.com/product/118815/rei-co-op-ruckpack-40-pack-mens). With the caveat I am using a Gowland 8x10 which is a very compact rail design camera that disassembles easily. I actually prefer this pack to my Photobackpacker pack (which is going up for sale soon on here). This pack really has a lot of room and opens basically all the way open for easy packing and unpacking. There are so many backpack designs available today with a little sleuthing you should be able to find a off-the-shelf backpack for anything up to 8x10.

[Vaughn]

I still loving my MEI Trekker II. Doesn't yell 'Photo Equipment!", tho carrying a large tripod sort of does...

[jesse1996]

What sort of gear can you carry in one of those? I'm looking into them and I'm loving the price and the looks honestly.

[Vaughn]

A Zone VI 8x10 (about same size as a Deardorff), several lenses (Fuij Ws; 250/6.7, 300/5.6, and perhaps the 360/6.3...a beast, so I might leave the 300mm behind), meter, darkcloth. Up to five 8x10 holders in the detachable daypack/front pocket (which also has a front pocket for notebook, pencil, cable release, etc). I can put one or two more 8x10 holders inside the main pack if needed.

I rarely use them, but the two hide-away side pockets can collectively hold a couple quart bottles of water and lunch for the day.

The only weak point is the small zippers that hold the daypack onto the main pack. So far so good on mine after 25 years or so, but someday I might need to sew the pack on permanently (rather than repair the zippers).

Old images from a past post: Self-made dividers and padding from old backpacking sleeping pads (closed-cell foam except for on the bottom, which is a couple inches of open-celled foam to absorb shocks from setting the pack down. I also added a thick layer of dense material that prevents anything poking through and breaking the GG (which is also against my back).

It has only flown once (checked bag), though I have flown with 4x5 and 5x7 a little more (and a lot easier when the camera, film holders and film can be brought on as carry-on).

[Drew Bedo]

The older cdedicated photo backpacks were not designed by or for real hikers. My LowePro Trekker AW from the mid 1980s or early 1990s will hold my 4x5 gear safely enough to go into an airliner cargo hold in a pinch (with me sweating it olut the whole way), but does not ride well for anything beyond a m ile or even less.

The new generation of bags may ride better, but in the camerta store they seem overly heavy even when empty.

Several posters here have adapted backpacks designed for serious backpack camping. This was the concept behind the now discontinued line of RPT and PhotoBackpacker products. This was a system built around a Kelty Redwing back pack adapted to securely carry camera gear in individual dedicated semi-rigid boxes for the camera, lenses and other items. I use the boxes in an old LowePro Magnum-35 shoulder bag . . .old enough to have elastic loops for 35mm film cassettes. My hips won't do backpacking anymore.

[Drew Wiley]

Well, yeah. I talked to Jeff Lowe a few times back then. He was one of the extreme climbers who was also a safe climber. A small guy. LowePro was a camera store spinoff after he sold his gear company. Jansport packs were also user-designed. Most of the outdoor gear mfg was all local here on the east side of SF Bay. A friend of mine owns the old Sierra Designs factory, and has converted it into law offices replete with indoor/outdoor koi ponds, dozens of backcountry photographs, a ceiling consisting of 500 sheets of maple plywood curved like waves. Quite a project. A different one of my backpacking pals bought the very first single-ply Sierra Designs tent, and I was right there in that storm when he sure regretted it! The gent who invented that gear disaster was walking past my house not long ago. We had a fun conversation. He had been quite an off-trail traveler himself, but can now no longer go to high altitude due to age-related cardio issues. One of my current camera packs is the very same Kelty model as I used for about 10,000 miles of hiking in the mountains when I was younger. As soon as the company sold and started outsourcing, however, the straps would break the first day! I don't think anyone ever tests things anymore, unless its some 24 hr use review after the fact.

[Drew Bedo]

At least LowePro has a pretty good guarantee policy. I had a sling bag with a broken zipper slider on one small pocet. Took it to a local outdoor store to ask if they knew of a local zipper-wizard. they said they would try to get it fixed. a week later, the store called saying my bag was ready for pick-up. when I got there, they gave me a brand-new bag!

However, this seems to only apply to bags that are in current production. If they change models you may be out of luck.

Had that problem with a Pelican soft side camera bag. This line is out solurced to the Pacific rim. trhe models change every 6-18 months, so about any bag you buy is out of production by the time a problem comes up. The Pelican hard case line is still supported with a soliod life time guarantee against about anything though.

[Louis Pacilla]

A Zone VI 8x10 (about same size as a Deardorff), several lenses (Fuij Ws; 250/6.7, 300/5.6, and perhaps the 360/6.3...a beast, so I might leave the 300mm behind), meter, darkcloth. Up to five 8x10 holders in the detachable daypack/front pocket (which also has a front pocket for notebook, pencil, cable release, etc). I can put one or two more 8x10 holders inside the main pack if needed.

I rarely use them, but the two hide-away side pockets can collectively hold a couple quart bottles of water and lunch for the day.

The only weak point is the small zippers that hold the daypack onto the main pack. So far so good on mine after 25 years or so, but someday I might need to sew the pack on permanently (rather than repair the zippers).

Old images from a past post: Self-made dividers and padding from old backpacking sleeping pads (closed-cell foam except for on the bottom, which is a couple inches of open-celled foam to absorb shocks from setting the pack down. I also added a thick layer of dense material that prevents anything poking through and breaking the GG (which is also against my back).

It has only flown once (checked bag), though I have flown with 4x5 and 5x7 a little more (and a lot easier when the camera, film holders and film can be brought on as carry-on).

I use this same pack only in black & I LOVE this thing. It is a SOLID and a VERY well manufactured bag with a VERY serious harness system with internal stays and plenty of suspension stabilizing pull downs/straps & loads of room w/ a full front access using a big YKK zipper. Of all the bags I own this one uses the best materials and attention to quality build but it is a bit heavy out of the gate w/out a load so take that for what it's worth. Like Vaughn says plenty of room for my 8x10 & all of what you may want w/ you in the field.

[Drew Wiley]

Well, I can certainly understand Vaughn tearing insulation out of a sleeping bag and using it for cushioning. As a member of the Sasquatch species, he has enough fur to sleep in the woods without a sleeping bag. For Homo sapiens like me, a pack has to have room for a lot more than camera gear, like a tent, sleeping bag, all-weather gear, food, pepper spray for defense against Sasquatch attempting to shred the pack to get a bottle of microbrew - yeah, that helps him keep warm at night too!

[Steven Ruttenberg]

I use an actual backpack Osprey and Gregory. Both with access from the back. Allows me to comfortably carry camera and gear plus survival gear for the long backpack trips.

[Vaughn]

Well, I can certainly understand Vaughn tearing insulation out of a sleeping bag and using it for cushioning. As a member of the Sasquatch species, he has enough fur to sleep in the woods without a sleeping bag. For Homo sapiens like me, a pack has to have room for a lot more than camera gear, like a tent, sleeping bag, all-weather gear, food, pepper spray for defense against Sasquatch attempting to shred the pack to get a bottle of microbrew - yeah, that helps him keep warm at night too!
I have only hiked overnight once with this pack and the 8x10...sleeping bag strapped underneath, sleeping pad (what's left of it!) on top. I'd have to get all new equipment to stay out a few nights -- right now 8x10 gear is at about 60 pounds (Zone VI, 5 to 6 film holders, 2 to 3 lenses, the etceras, and the Ries A100 tripod/250 head.)

I could get something like the Philips Explorer (minus 10 pounds), one lighter lens only (minus 5 lbs), a carbon fiber pod w/o head (minus 10 pounds). That would take 25 pounds off me. I might find a pound or two more to dump, but there is still the space issue. Or just take the 5x7 or the 4x5 and enjoy myself with my fellow bigfoots.

[Drew Wiley]

Well, I think I successfully conned my younger backpacking protege to help me with some of my extra food weight next summer. He started out with 110 lbs for a month-long backpack last year. Regretted it. But if he drops that down to say 80, we'll eat darn well and I'm have more room in my own pack for LF gear plus amenities for a two week trip in the mtns. Pack weight seems to be inverse with age. I'm turning 70 this year, so aim to keep my pack weight below 70. I ordinarily put my Phillips on my larger Ries tripod. But I do have one of Feisol's strongest CF tripods which supports it well, and weighs about a third. The problem with light tripods is that they don't have enough bully mass to keep your camera from becoming a kite in the wind. So my turnbolt below, after I customized it, is actually a stainless 3/8-16 hookbolt, so if necessary I can hang a mesh bag of rocks from it for added weight. On these longer hikes I use a similar combination of a lightwt Ebony 4x5 folder and the original Gitzo Reporter CF tripod, likewise significantly modified, and stronger than their current versions. Ordinarily I use my lighter Ries for 4x5 use. It would be awfully nice to tote my Bibler tent again, since it's almost bombproof in extreme weather. But my ultralight Big Agnes tent weighs half as much. It keeps the rain and snow out, but because it has a rainfly, wind still has a path through. Last time I was at high altitude storm near the crest in Wyoming, I got pretty darn cold. A winter sleeping bag is not necessarily the answer, because at lower altitudes on the approach, these can be just too warm. And my Feathered Friends 3-season bag is Goretex, so was pricey to begin with. The nice thing about Goretex is that it not only keeps the goosedown completely dry, but frost and dew quickly sublimate off and don't soak in. .. All this wind is bringing down not only sticks from my big aracaria tree, but little cotton balls. It was hard to figure out at first. Then as I was repairing my back fence from wind damage, I noticed the neighbors had a rotting mattress in their
backyard junk pile. Then the resident mommy squirrel ran over there and snagged some more nest material.

[Vaughn]

Bought one of my boys a two-person ultra-light Big Agnes in December (Tiger Wall UL). On sale, but not cheap. I used it in Chile -- the two boys used a larger two-person Big Agnes. I am impressed as it weighs almost nothing and stood up to the wind and rain well...nothing too extreme. I tried to talk him into trading for the larger tent, but no go.

We are having a bit of a hail storm -- snow forecasted! I should not have trimmed by beard!

[neil poulsen]

I scoured LA in the late 80's for my current backpack, which I really like! Whether by the same name, it's an MEI that has the same dimensions and structure as the current Trekker I. (22 inch length.)

But, it's not long enough for my 8x10. Until this thread, I didn't realize that a Trekker II is available. With it's 25" length, this would be ideal.

I have a Lowepro for an RB67 outfit that works reasonably well. The thing is, another word for the padding it includes is WEIGHT! I think that these packs "designed" for photo equipment are heavier than they need to be.

Whatever packs that I have, I'm more likely to load them onto my cart, versus onto my person.

https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?128968-Photo-Cart-Based-on-an-Old-Golf-Cart

Whether or not one swings one onto their back, they are quite a convenient way to hold and store a camera outfit. In addition to the Lowepro for my RB kit, I use my MEI for 4x5 and a Photobackpacker for a medium format VC medium format kit.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Could also take fewer film holders and load film as you go once you hit your destination. Maybe take only 1 lens too. I like Chamonix cameras as they are quite lite as well. I use a Gitzo carbon fiber tripod, but for hiking I may get a smaller carbon fiber one. Don’t really need a support for a house when camping just needs to be stable.

[jmontague]

I have an older Super Trekker that is huge, and heavy. Will certainly fit an 8x10, maybe even larger. So large, it will not fit in an overhead bin on an airliner. Anyone interested? Don’t use it any more.


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[Charles Young]

A short while ago I acquired (ebay, ~£66) a Torvol Drone Adventure (https://torvol.com/product/drone-adventure-backpack/) backpack and found that it's a great fit for my Chamonix 8x10 camera. Thought I'd share some pictures on it...

On the main compartment I have (1) the camera and (2) up to 4x 8x10 film holders
On the top roll bit I've got my 300mm lens, meter, loupe etc...

Empty pack is 4.5kg, full pack without tripod ~13kg, tripod+head adds another ~3kg.

It's a comfortable pack but at full load (16kg) it's a struggle for hikes >90min (for me at least!).

Hope that helps someone out there.

Cheers

207835207836

[CreationBear]

I tried to talk him into trading for the larger tent, but no go.


If you're tent shopping, throw the Six Moons Designs "Lunar Duo" on your list--it's a nice "big man" tent, the silnylon equivalent, perhaps, of the old Sierra Designs Meteor Light. I'm not sold on single-wall shelters, especially stream-side and under canopy, but since it basically halved my former weight/volume I've been willing to give it a go. (FWIW, I can also recommend Montbell Super Spiral bags for us burly sorts--perhaps one tier below Drew's FF bag, but for 3-season use below treeline, a pretty good option.)

[jamgolf]

A short while ago I acquired (ebay, ~£66) a Torvol Drone Adventure (https://torvol.com/product/drone-adventure-backpack/) backpack and found that it's a great fit for my Chamonix 8x10 camera. Thought I'd share some pictures on it...

On the main compartment I have (1) the camera and (2) up to 4x 8x10 film holders
On the top roll bit I've got my 300mm lens, meter, loupe etc...

Empty pack is 4.5kg, full pack without tripod ~13kg, tripod+head adds another ~3kg.

It's a comfortable pack but at full load (16kg) it's a struggle for hikes >90min (for me at least!).

Hope that helps someone out there.

Cheers

207835207836

Thanks for this recommendation. I bought the Torvol Adventure backpack based on your post and it fits my 8x10 plus 4 film holders plus lenses quite nicely.

[Drew Bedo]

When I first began with LF, the budget for photo gear was not a shoe-string but a frayed thread. I had a pre-Anniversary Speed Graphic that was a total beater, and one lens. . . .film holders, meter etc.

We went to New Mexico and Arizona for our 20th anniversary and I put together a photo backpack or day hiking. A light weight book bag came from a thrift store. Found royal blue closed cell foam sleeping pads at a surplus store. Cut up the pads into slices that fit the tear-drop shape of the pack and layered them together with a hot glue gun, then cut spaces to custom fit the gear, right through the layers and jammed it all into the pack.

Worked well enough and cost only a little. I think that some variation on this concept could be adapted to the requirements of expansive 8x10 gear and a serious expedition type backpack.

[John Kasaian]

I'd get an old Kelty aluminum frame pack and slide 'er into that. Use your dark cloth for padding and be careful around rocks and trees and other stuff that doesn't like cameras.

[Drew Wiley]

I use Rubbermaid kitchen-sized poly wastebaskets of a size that neatly slips right into the top compartment of the Kelty. That way I can quickly interchange full kits. Side pouches hold the lenses, which largely interchange between various view camera formats, unless I working with MF instead. For long multi-day treks, I don't use that particular system, but do cushion and insulate both my camera and film box with my goosedown jacket (with any potential down-shedding isolated by the jacket being in a plastic garbage can liner, which also keeps the jacket dry in case it rains, as it often does during high country afternoons).

Please note that I'm speaking of REAL Kelty external frame packs of ca 70's - 80's vintage. These still often turn up almost unused. Don't confuse these with neo-Kelty made in China products, which are quite inferior. Nor is this an official "camera pack". It just happens to be excellent for that too, but with plenty of room left over for other gear, clothing, and food.
I'd routinely carry 85 lb loads that way, for days on end in steep terrain. No more. I'll be happy if I'm comfortable carrying 55-60 lbs this summer. Geezerhood has its benefits, but also its shortcomings. Einstein got it all wrong; gravity is not a function of mass but of time - it just keeps tugging a little more as time goes by.

[Drew Bedo]

DW: Sounds like you have a systen that works for you. Is that for an 8x10 outfit? I haven't done any serious backpacking myself since the late 1970s, but do remember the Kelty external frame packs. They were state-of-the art at that time. My 8x10 2D fills the main compartment of a mid '80s vintage LowePro backpack though. Would it fit into the top compartment of an older Kelty?

As an old-guy aside: Few today remember the '60s-'70s era transition from Army surplus camping gear to the new-tech external frame with waist belt packs alolng with goose down clothing and mummy bags. As a Boy Scout in my early teens we shivered in the dark and humped heavy canvass packs filled with WW-II and Korean War leftovers. The Boy Scout logo mess kits and canteens were fragile light guage Aluminum and the rugged GI gear was heavy.

[abruzzi]

As an old-guy aside: Few today remember the '60s-'70s era transition from Army surplus camping gear to the new-tech external frame with waist belt packs alolng with goose down clothing and mummy bags. As a Boy Scout in my early teens we shivered in the dark and humped heavy canvass packs filled with WW-II and Korean War leftovers. The Boy Scout logo mess kits and canteens were fragile light guage Aluminum and the rugged GI gear was heavy.

My uncle owned an Army/Navy store (remember those?) and I remember his transition from selling army/navy surplus to selling cheap Academy gear. He mostly sold the factory seconds from Academy. In some cases It would be a bad seam that would need to be touched up or something else simple, and the discount was worth it, but my father got me an Academy external frame backpack. It fit fine and all seemed good until it was loaded with 40 lbs and I was on the trail and I discovered that one of the aluminum cross beams on the frame had been welded in backward, so rather than arching away from my back, it was arching towards my back. This wasn't noticable until it was loaded and I was hiking with it and the weight and bouncing action kept jamming that bar into the small of my back. It went in the dumpster as soon as that trip was over.

[Drew Wiley]

Hi other Drew - I use that true Kelty Tioga for all my day hike view camera work. Yes, it accepts my 8x10 folder too, quite efficiently, although I don't use a drop-in plastic wastebasket in that case, but foamcore board dividers between flatbed camera, filmholders, and cloth - very light, protective, and efficient. I have even bigger classic external-frame packs for actual multi-day backpacking trips. Being an old-timer myself, and not having much money when I was young, I made my own dirt-cheap first two backpacks; and yes, those were miserable.

Army surplus still has an odd connotation in this neighborhood. It caught on in the early 70's when a tiny storefront on University Avenue in Berkeley was buying up actual Latin American surplus combat camo clothing, boots, etc, plus olive caps with little red stars on them. The Che Guevara look. That overstuffed grungy little store was called Banana Republic - a totally different ethos (distinctly left-wing revolutionary) from what it subsequently became as a widespread suburban shopping mall chain. History always repeats itself - once communist revolutionaries start getting rich, they become capitalists. A lot of that kind of dress-up was just for fun, to give tourists the stereotypical sights they expected. I know an old local who still wears his little green Mao hat with a red star on it, just to irk people, even though he was a fraternity president getting his business degree when he started wearing it - and nothing was more anathema to local activists back then than being a frat or "capitalist" businessman. How times have changed!

But that was also the era when nearly all the serious outdoor gear brands were being made right around here. The original Sierra Designs store was right across the tracks my office; and the factory itself was later bought by a backpacking buddy and turned into a big legal office complex, and the North Face factory was part of a business park which later became genetic and biotech R&D facilities, where my wife once worked. But Kelty was made in Glendale, southern Calif.

[Drew Bedo]

As late as maybe 2010 there was a genuine surplus store in downtown Galveston called "Col. Bubbie's". They had Warsaw Pact surplus, Arctic mittens and US Navy bed pans . . . .whatever. And the place had that musty surplus warehouse smell.

Our son was at Twenty-Nine Palms as a fresh platoon leader in a training cycle set to surge into Iraq that fall. I don't remember the datils of the why of it, but he wanted/needed a desert camo tarp to go with an insulated poncho liner I had gotten him. Couldn't find anything in the then-current (2004)camo pattern. Guess he couldn't either. So we went to Bubbies.

Also nothing . . .anything in desert casamo was gone. But did find Desert Storm era "Chocolate-Chip" spare tire covers . . .three of them. not enough to sew up into a tarp. As we were leaving, "Col. Bubbie routinely asked if we had found what we wanted . . .we said no and explained. HGe shut down his for-the-tourist face and got serious. took us into the back room and pulled out tire covers till my wife said it was enough. Discounted the lot by 75% (his margin I guess) and bagged them up.

That is the old, old-school!

All 7 tire covers were seam-ripped and resewen into a personel sized tarp by his mother and seems to have served the Lt. well . . .he still hsd it.

Sadly, Bubby passed some years ago and I think the place is gone now.

[Drew Bedo]

Found this on Amazon. Looks workable for short hikes, urban or wild; or just getting through an airport.

Can't get the links to work.

Go to Amazon and enter "Ruc Pac".

Two models come up. One is just shoulder straps they show hooked onto a 1510 hard case. The other loks to be a full conversion backpack with padded back panel, shoulder straps and a padded waist belt. I am thinking these could also hook onto a different model Pelican case.

Maybe not for trekking, but an urban jaunt of short hikes in the wild.

[abruzzi]

Go to Amazon and enter "Ruc Pac".

Two models come up. One is just shoulder straps they show hooked onto a 1510 hard case. The other loks to be a full conversion backpack with padded back panel, shoulder straps and a padded waist belt.

Unfortunately, everyone's amazon search is different--I get hundreds of small backpacks when I make that search.

[abruzzi]

Same, but “rucpac hardcase conversion” worked

Thanks, I think that got me what Drew was referencing.

[Drew Bedo]

FRom e-Bay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/133652399995?hash=item1f1e4dc77b:g:9-0AAOSwL4tguMBv

https://www.ebay.com/itm/132007033765?hash=item1ebc3b7ba5:g:xN0AAOSw4i9guL9F

[Joshua Dunn]

I searched for "rucpac hardcase conversion" in Amazon and saw the hard case backpack you mentioned. As Drew mentioned it may be ok for short travel (walking from the car to 100 yards away) but it looks like a horrible backpack. To be fair I haven't worn one that pack or the backpack I am going to post a link to by Eberlestock, however I have several of their pack and they are very good packs it you wear them correctly. This pack (https://eberlestock.com/collections/packs/products/upranger) is a hard case design if that is what you are looking for. Keeping in mind this is a thread for 8x10 backpacks, and I don't see a way this (or many) packs are going to hold an 8x10, holders, lenses etc. So a pack like this is better suited for just the holders, lenses tripods and all the other oddities that go along with large format and carry the camera yourself.

-Joshua

[alberto_zh]

the divider were included with this backpack?

[alberto_zh]

I have been shooting 4x5 for a while now and have a great backpack setup that allows me and my OCD to keep everything separate and organized in one case (lowepro whistler 450). I recently moved into 8x10 and could not find very much at all about a similar setup for hikes more than a couple hundred feet from the car. After searching the internet / forums / dead links the most I could find is an F.64 backpack or a red flyer wagon (a cooler was thrown in a couple of times as well). I currently still own the F.64 bag but it was too limited in space and the hip belt was not very comfortable for long periods with a lot of weight.

Well all, I share with you the bag I bought on a whim and now love... the lowepro trekker 650. This bag keeps things organized the way I like, carries 6 film holders, a tripod, 4 lenses, all my accessories and does so with a frame that could be designed for long distance hiking. So far I've only used it over 12 miles but it is so comfortable compared to the F.64 I had to share.

Also, it fits in overhead bins.

175091 175089 175088 175087

the divider came with the bag?

[tykos]

the divider came with the bag?

https://www.lowepro.com/global/pro-trekker-650-aw-lp36777-pww/
it comes with a lot of dividers

[Drew Bedo]

I do not backpack any longer. However, my 4x5 kit is centered around the Photobackpacker lens boxes, a box for the Zone VI body and Cascade wrap for the film holders.

Its all good stuff and works for me.

[mikeh721]

I have the F 64 bag and found it to be a good bag though the waist belt was not as long as I needed it. A little searching on Amazon I found replacement buckets and materials to make a extension. It fits great now and I can make extensions for $10 .00 plus shipping cost.

[Drew Wiley]

My gosh, how brand names have changed their faces! I remember when Jeff Lowe and his brother were making climbing packs for their own use, and then got requests to customize one-offs for others. Hence the size-adjustment feature to the frames. Last time I ever saw him was at a slide show he was giving of his latest unsuccessful attempt of an especially difficult route up Nuptse. Slideshows, do-it-yourself pack factories in the USA, true frame packs - almost nobody nowadays would even know what those were.

[John Layton]

For years I'd used an LL Beans "Guides Pack Frame" with a lower shelf attachment to schlep my gear - which usually consisted of a 4x5 or 5x7 kit in a Tundra hard case, older (heavy!) Bogen tripod or newer (much lighter:)) Gitzo CF, plus an assortment of other photo and hiking related stuff - all held on with three heavy duty bungee straps. Worked well for travel as the Tundra case is the exact biggest size allowable as carry-on luggage, while the pack frame and tripod fit into a large duffel with my other gear as checked baggage.

Did lots of desert camping trips with the above...but man oh man - talk about weight! Sometimes strapped my diy 11x14 onto that frame, with a homebuilt box fitted to the back of that camera which held three holders plus lens, meter, and filters - and which also protected the camera back. But again...wow...heavy!

More recently I got into a nice P-3 setup with camera and 3 lens inserts, plus three cascade cases for 5x7 - which is still pretty comfortable, although at around 30 to 35 lbs. (40 plus if I'm carrying lunch, water, and emergency and/or rain gear), the weight can be a real downer. Gone are the days when this weight felt like nothing!

At any rate, lately, especially for shorter (less than one mile) walks, I've taken to ditching the backpack in favor of a camera on tripod carried over a shoulder, plus a smallish shoulder bag with four holders, two or three lenses, meter, filters, and black t-shirt dark cloth - which saves further weight and still leaves me with a free hand.

But if my chosen location involves any real amount of walking I'll still use the backpack as this is much safer/comfortable for the longer haul, especially if the ground is uneven and where I really like to have both hands free.

[esearing]

My gosh, how brand names have changed their faces! I remember when Jeff Lowe and his brother were making climbing packs for their own use, and then got requests to customize one-offs for others. Hence the size-adjustment feature to the frames. Last time I ever saw him was at a slide show he was giving of his latest unsuccessful attempt of an especially difficult route up Nuptse. Slideshows, do-it-yourself pack factories in the USA, true frame packs - almost nobody nowadays would even know what those were.

It would be interesting to see then vs now items in the pack. The short hikes I have done on the AT seem to be more of a fashion show and selfie opportunity than a wilderness experience. I myself have walked the entire width of the AT several times.

back on topic =. Look at Atlas and Shimoda bags for larger formats.

[Drew Wiley]

I can't remember all the gear details. There were outdoor factories all around here. Sierra Designs started just across the tracks from my own workplace, North Face up town, Marmot a few streets down from there. The first North Face factory itself was right across town; and a friends of mine bought the original Sierra Design factory in Emeryville the other direction, and turned it into law offices. I still have a Class V down sleeping bag, whose factory was in the same area as that of North Face down near the water.
I don't remember where Jansport was made; but some liked its frame adjustment system. I used Kelty, a high quality brand with an external frame made in southern Calif., but now more of an import book bag line by comparison. The ownership of all these companies has changed, and with it, the product lines have morphed into something else entirely. So yeah, "fashion show" pretty much defines it. I've often kidded a friend of mine in a store mgt position at REI when they're going to put in a full aisle of designer logo pee bottles at $35 apiece.

Classic high quality frame packs are fairly common, even unused or barely used. People paid a lot of money for them intending to become backpackers, yet maybe took one trip and threw in the towel, and tucked them away in some attic or closet for years and years; and those finally turn up on EBay or sidewalk sales. I traded a half-empty quart of marine varnish for the last one I found at a garage sale, mint condition, wholly unused; and it probably cost $250 originally. Those things were built far more seriously and durably than packs today. Too bad I'm not as durable myself, but I'm not taking treks as rough as I once did either.

[John Kasaian]

I remember when Ascente opened their shop in Fresno (late 1960's?) making down stuff.
Us high school kids could buy factory 2nds for next to nothing
Good times!

[Drew Wiley]

My Summer-Fall high country bag was made by Feathered Friends in Seattle, and has a Goretex outer - great for resisting frost buildup on cold nights. But Fresno? How did they test their bags there without dying of heat exhaustion inside them in the first sixteen seconds? Guess somebody had to make a quick drive up to Kaiser Pass. Sounds like way back when I briefly worked for the Pack Station at Badger Flat. That was sure memorable; but all I could afford was a nearly worthless ten buck Sears sleeping bag. Some of the cowboys customarily just rolled up in their smelly horse blanket next to a fire.

[John Kasaian]

My Summer-Fall high country bag was made by Feathered Friends in Seattle, and has a Goretex outer - great for resisting frost buildup on cold nights. But Fresno? How did they test their bags there without dying of heat exhaustion inside them in the first sixteen seconds? Guess somebody had to make a quick drive up to Kaiser Pass. Sounds like way back when I briefly worked for the Pack Station at Badger Flat. That was sure memorable; but all I could afford was a nearly worthless ten buck Sears sleeping bag. Some of the cowboys customarily just rolled up in their smelly horse blanket next to a fire.

A mule pack pad makes an excellent mattress. Keeps the sinus open as well.
The pack a mantys we used were the same heavy canvas as the canvas used in old time cowboy bedrolls.
A curious coincidence!