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newtolf
7-Aug-2005, 17:06
Has anyone used or have heard of this reseller? If so, have you had a positive experience?

Thanks!

David A. Goldfarb
7-Aug-2005, 17:17
He advertises in _View Camera_ magazine. I know someone who has been down to his studio (he sells out of his studio, not a regular retail store), and he apparently sells a surprising number of cameras. I haven't bought from him myself, but from what I've heard, he's legit.

windpointphoto
7-Aug-2005, 17:29
His prices are on the high side. He does however send out very clean and adjusted equipment. Shutters are CLA, etc. Which is often times worth paying a little more for, i.e. Midwest Photo than some of the eBay crapshoots.

newtolf
7-Aug-2005, 19:24
Thanks guys. He says that he sells the Linhofs at the lowest prices in the US. Just wondering whether he's legit. Thanks David and Leonard.

Oren Grad
7-Aug-2005, 19:48
You might want to double-check with Bob Salomon of HP Marketing about the warranty and service status of the Linhof merchandise that Bruce is selling. If you read carefully his postings for Rodenstock lenses, he appears to be selling gray import. Since both Rodenstock and Linhof are imported to the US by HP Marketing, it does at least raise a question.

Juergen Sattler
7-Aug-2005, 20:12
And just to make it VERY clear - if it is a gray import, HP Marketing will not do any repairs on the camera - no matter where you bought it from. If you want to buy a new Linhof, you'll have to buy it at an official Linhof importer. THey are very iffy on that subject.

David A. Goldfarb
7-Aug-2005, 20:17
She's in Canada, no, just to make matters more complicated? Who does official Linhof service in Canada, and what are their policies?

Oren Grad
7-Aug-2005, 20:51
Linhof lists the following agent for Canada:

BLAZES Photographic
361 Steelcase Road
West Unit 3
Markham, ON, L3R, 3V8
Tel. Northamerica Free Phone +1 416 / 888 561 0906
Fax +1 416 / 915 8904
blazes@blazesphoto.com
www.blazesphoto.com

Michael Kadillak
7-Aug-2005, 21:35
Purchased a couple of Wisner lens boards from him. No problems - even with refunding the Paypal double pay. If I am not mistaken, I believe that I called him in New York city or somewhere in the general vicinity.

Surely someone else will chime in. He has feedback on that auction site.

Cheers!

darr
7-Aug-2005, 21:47
I can confirm Bruce did sell excellent quality used and new gear to me and gave very good service. Some of the products I have purchased from him have included Ebony accessories, back issues of B & W magazine, and Wisner lensboards for my 5x7" and more. I have made three different purchases from him via eBay auctions and found shipping to be quick. I did not purchase my Ebony SV45U or Wisner Tech from him, but I would not hesitate to purchase from him again. Hope that helps.

David A. Goldfarb
7-Aug-2005, 22:09
Yes, he's in Manhattan, down in Chelsea or the West Village I believe.

newtolf
8-Aug-2005, 04:26
Thanks again guys!

I will call Bob Salomon at HP Marketing to make sure Bruce is a legit (not gray market) for the Linhof if I decide to buy from him. It would either be from him or Badger Graphics.

Yes, I'm in Canada. I will give Blazzes a call, but usually, prices in Canada are a lot higher than if I buy from the US, I find.

Margaret

Oren Grad
8-Aug-2005, 07:12
Margaret -

You need to check on Badger as well - in the past, their prices on Linhof were suspiciously low. Now they're not any more, but I wouldn't take anything for granted.

But there's another issue as well. As Bob has explained here in great detail on many occasions, HP Marketing is very strict about defending the authorized distribution channels. They can certainly refuse to service anything that was bought gray in the US, but you should check with him as to whether they may also refuse to service a US camera bought into Canada, so as not to undercut the authorized Canadian distributor.

Similarly, you would need to check with Blazes about their policies re equipment imported into Canada outside the authorized channel.

I think the worst-case scenario would be nobody anywhere being willing to service under warranty, and needing to ship the camera to Germany for out-of-warranty service.

Sorry to belabor the issue, but Bob has really beaten this one into us over the years, and if you're going to spend $5000 on a camera, it's probably a good idea to understand exactly the terms of sale.

Good luck...

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 08:00
"HP Marketing will not do any repairs on the camera - no matter where you bought it from."

Not so.

We will not service a gray market item.

That is a camera BOUGHT FROM A DEALER WHO IS IN THE USA AND THE DEALER IN THE USA IMPORTED HIMSELF FROM OUTSIDE THE USA. or

You buy a camera from A DEALER OUTSIDE THE USA AND HAVE IT SHIPPED TO YOU INSIDE THE USA.

We do service the camera if:

You live outside the USA and buy a camera outside or inside the USA we will repair it although under the factory warranty (if it applies) of 1 year if it was bought outside the USA or for the USA warranty of 5 years if it was purchased from one of our dealers in the USA.

You live in the USA and buy a camera on a trip to outside the USA it is covered by the Linhof 1 year factory warranty and we will repair it in or out of warranty. It is your responsibility to prove to the service center that it was purchased outside the USA and was picked up by you outside the USA.

In short. Buy a gray market camera we don't service it. Buy a camera on a trip while outside the USA we do fix it. Come visit the USA with your camera and we fix it.

Paddy Quinn
8-Aug-2005, 08:25
""HP Marketing will not do any repairs on the camera - no matter where you bought it from."

Not so.

We will not service a gray market item.

That is a camera BOUGHT FROM A DEALER WHO IS IN THE USA AND THE DEALER IN THE USA IMPORTED HIMSELF FROM OUTSIDE THE USA. or

You buy a camera from A DEALER OUTSIDE THE USA AND HAVE IT SHIPPED TO YOU INSIDE THE USA. "

interesting - the second clause there falls outside of the generally accepted legal and academic definitions of "gray market"

A comparison would be the (legal) importation of prescription drugs from outside the US by individuals for their own use. This is not considered as a gray market activity. For one thing, "gray market" nearly always requires some form of re-distribution, which is clearly not the case with the second clause above. It is more of an arbitary decision justified by the term "gray market"

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 08:30
Paddy,

The simpler way to phrase it is that the American importer of the specific camera bears the responsibility of the repaair and service of the caamera inside the USA. Also the cost of supplying catalogs, brochures, technical support, advertising, shows, dealer training and support as well as the other costs associated and required to be an authorized distributor of a product in the photographic industry.

David A. Goldfarb
8-Aug-2005, 08:35
Presumably, if one is willing to buy something outside the US (particularly something with a relatively low defect rate like a Linhof), I don't see any problem in this age of international overnight shipping to having it serviced outside the US. International shipping might be an inconvenience, but then again, if Marflex is out of a necessary part and has to order it from the factory, it might have been better to have sent the camera to Germany anyway. It is easy enough to calculate the cost of international shipping against domestic shipping and factor that into the price of the camera up front.

Paddy Quinn
8-Aug-2005, 08:38
Which, of course, isn't what you said.

You said you wouldn't repair gray market cameras and then listed what that meant. Rather, this is a protoectionist action taken by the distributor in the new global market and justified by the misuse of the term "gray market" - which does have it's own leagal meaning in some circumstances protections for manufacturers and distributors. But the second one you list isn't one of them.

Throwing in "gray market" puts a legal bogeyman into play who really isn't there in the second case (but who may, possibly be, in the first case).

It does however make it sound a bit better when a customer comes knocking at your door for service and you turn him away.

"oh terribly sorrry, grey market, we can't do that".

jerry brodkey
8-Aug-2005, 09:13
Bob -

What if I buy a used Linhof? How can I find out if you all

would repair it?

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 09:42
Paddy,

I will make it plainer.

You import it you fix it.
A dealer imports it he fixes it.
We import it we fix it.

Paul Butzi
8-Aug-2005, 09:44
You buy a camera from A DEALER OUTSIDE THE USA AND HAVE IT SHIPPED TO YOU INSIDE THE USA.

Buy a gray market camera we don't service it. Buy a camera on a trip while outside the USA we do fix it.]

I'm confused. How can you possibly know whether visited the UK and bought the camera from Robt. White, versus just having them ship the camera to me?

Paddy Quinn
8-Aug-2005, 09:49
"I will make it plainer.

You import it you fix it.

A dealer imports it he fixes it.

We import it we fix it."

But also, apparently,

"You live in the USA and buy a camera on a trip to outside the USA it is covered by the Linhof 1 year factory warranty and we will repair it in or out of warranty."

(which is actually also point 1 above? but you seem to make an arbitary distinction between the two)

Can you actually manage to get all the machinations straight?

Paddy Quinn
8-Aug-2005, 09:57
BTW, what exactly is the difference between

" Buy a camera on a trip while outside the USA we do fix it."

and

"You buy a camera from A DEALER OUTSIDE THE USA AND HAVE IT SHIPPED TO YOU INSIDE THE USA." and you won't fix it?

It is not, as you initially asserted, "gray market"

The end result of both is the same.

Jow Blow make business trips a year aroudn the globe and buys his new Linhof in Bulgaria at a very decent price and brings it home from one of his trips. You will apparently service and repair it.

Fred Blogs only ever vacations each year in Florida and so buys his Linhof at a decent price by mail from the same dealer in Bulgaria. You won't service or repair his Lihof.

So what is the difference between the two?

(and how exactly does a person prove one or the other to the Court of HP Marketing?)

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 10:21
Paddy,

Don't make it more difficult, it is very simple.

You or your dealer imports it you or your dealer is responsible for service.

We import it we are responsible.

How do you proove it?

Bill of sale and a copy of our warranty card. Missing one or the other we verify serial number.

Pascal Quint
8-Aug-2005, 10:37
I will make it plainer.

You import it you fix it.

A dealer imports it he fixes it.

We import it we fix it.

--Bob Salomon HP Marketing Corp.

I bought a Linhof camera in Munich last summer and brought it back with me as a personal import.

I understood HPMarketing would service this if required (I was going to be camming it for other lenses).

But now you are clearly saying you will not. Why has this changed?

How do you proove it?

Bill of sale and a copy of our warranty card. Missing one or the other we verify serial number.

My bill of sale and warranty card obviously show it was bought be me in Munich, not in the USA.

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 10:50
Pascal:

Your bill of sale shows that you bought it in Munich and it was delivered in Germany, doesn't it?

There is no charge to ship it to the USA from your store, correct?

Therefore if you bought it in Germany and picked it up in Germany it is not gray and we repair or cam it.

If your receipt shows that it was bought in Germany and the dealer shipped it to you in the USA then the work will not be available to you in the USA.

From what you wrote in your response you are entitled to a 1 yeaar factory warranty in the USA (not the 5 year HP Linhof warranty) and are entitled to service in the USA.

Eric Leppanen
8-Aug-2005, 11:06
Bob,

Say I purchase a used Linhof camera on Ebay, which comes with no paperwork. Will you repair it?

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 12:21
Eric,

We may check the serial number if we have any reason to believe it is gray market. If it prooves to be we would not fix it.

Paddy Quinn
8-Aug-2005, 12:24
"Your bill of sale shows that you bought it in Munich and it was delivered in Germany, doesn't it?

There is no charge to ship it to the USA from your store, correct?

Therefore if you bought it in Germany and picked it up in Germany it is not gray and we repair or cam it. "

Of course, nor would it be gray if the dealer shipped it to the US for the purchaser.

So it would seem as long as you get the foreign dealer to invoice any shipping charges seperately from the actual purchase, then warranty and service via HP is no problem?

Bob Salomon
8-Aug-2005, 13:33
Paddy,

In most of Europe, if not all there is a VAT tax. That is refundable when you leave the country with the item and show the VAT receipt and the item to Customs at the airport.

You would probably like to get that tax baack and the dealers would like to stay in business by not making out false receipts.

If you hand carry the camera with you back from Europe you are fine. If you don't it is gray.

If we suspect it is gray we verify the serial number. If we find it is gray we enforce the service and warranty restrictions.

Why not spend the time you are wasting by trying to work around the gray restrictions by taking or printing photographs?

tim atherton
8-Aug-2005, 13:37
Presumably, if one is willing to buy something outside the US (particularly something with a relatively low defect rate like a Linhof), I don't see any problem in this age of international overnight shipping to having it serviced outside the US. International shipping might be an inconvenience, but then again, if Marflex is out of a necessary part and has to order it from the factory, it might have been better to have sent the camera to Germany anyway. It is easy enough to calculate the cost of international shipping against domestic shipping and factor that into the price of the camera up front.

you might also want to factor in what the extra cost of the extended warranty is if the Distributorship changes hands. As Gitzo tripod owners found out after paying through the nose for a Lifetime Warranty, it was for the "lifetime" of the distributorship, not the tripod!

Paddy Quinn
8-Aug-2005, 13:51
"If you hand carry the camera with you back from Europe you are fine. If you don't it is gray."

Only according to HP Marketing. By the US Dept of Commerce, ITA and WTO definitions this doesn't make it gray market goods. In the first instance there is no re-distribution. Why you insist on referring to such an import as gray market is not clear at all.

CP Goerz
8-Aug-2005, 16:07
To answer the original question I have had a few transactions with Bruce and they all went very smoothly and without fuss, a rarity these days!

CP Goerz

Eric Leppanen
8-Aug-2005, 17:04
I've had only one transaction with Bruce, and it was a good one. Bought a used lens in excellent condition and received excellent service.

Oren Grad
8-Aug-2005, 17:22
As Gitzo tripod owners found out after paying through the nose for a Lifetime Warranty, it was for the "lifetime" of the distributorship, not the tripod!

No, it was for more than that. Karl Heitz used to offer "full warranty for life - plus reincarnations". There must be someone out there who has been reincarnated and had his Gitzo break and can tell us whether the reincarnated Karl Heitz honored the warranty...

David Wooten
9-Aug-2005, 21:17
I visited Bruce in NYC he is just around the corner from the Stevenson Gallery and does work out of his apartment....I have purchased from him and no problems.....he does have a lot of interesting "stuff" on hand and is also an artist, paints, and a photographer. an interesting fellow....

David Crossley
28-Aug-2005, 21:26
I purchased an Ebony view camera from Bruce back in May. Living here in Canada the purchase was a leap of faith on many fronts.

However, Bruce is a consumate professional, extremely knowlegable and gave me the best price out of 3 US dealers. I would not hesitate to check with him first out of the box on my large format purchasing requirements. Both new and used equipment.

Bruce also came highly reccomended by the people at Ebony Cameras.

David Crossley/Crossley Photography....

Bruce A Cahn
13-Jul-2010, 10:07
I just came across this old thread and thought it should be updated. It is July 2010. I am still stocking & selling Ebony cameras in Chelsea, NYC. We no longer have much used equipment, and the size of the inventory has been reduced because of the recession. We have some Fidelity holders left in 4x5, 5x7 and 8x10 sizes, and still are competitive on lens orders.

erie patsellis
13-Jul-2010, 20:16
As Gitzo tripod owners found out after paying through the nose for a Lifetime Warranty, it was for the "lifetime" of the distributorship, not the tripod!

No, it was for more than that. Karl Heitz used to offer "full warranty for life - plus reincarnations". There must be someone out there who has been reincarnated and had his Gitzo break and can tell us whether the reincarnated Karl Heitz honored the warranty...

I realize that this is an old thread, but I have two Gitzos that I need to buy new sleeves and other odds and ends for, a Studex Rapid Performance and a TeleStudex Performance, good luck if you think lifetime means your lifetime. (maybe the lifetime of a cat, mouse or gerbil though)

darr
25-Jun-2011, 05:13
I just came across this old thread and thought it should be updated. It is July 2010. I am still stocking & selling Ebony cameras in Chelsea, NYC. We no longer have much used equipment, and the size of the inventory has been reduced because of the recession. We have some Fidelity holders left in 4x5, 5x7 and 8x10 sizes, and still are competitive on lens orders.

I recently purchased an Ebony 45S from Bruce. I needed it shipped overnight and realized my knock-off #3 board was not fitting my PS945 after he had it all wrapped for FedEx pick-up. Bruce came through like a pro. I received everything on time and in pristine condition. I would not hesitate purchasing another camera and/or accessories from Bruce. Thanks again Bruce!! :)

Kind regards,
Darr

Brian Ellis
25-Jun-2011, 06:51
When he posted in the large format section of photo.net he used to rave about the cameras he sold, without revealing that he was a dealer in those cameras. He'd say things like "just got my new camera X the other day, took it out for the first time this morning and wow, what a great camera it is," sounding for all the world like he was just a user. And he often would say someting disparaging about cameras he didn't sell when someone asked for information about particular cameras. For all I know everything he said about any camera was correct but I wouldn't buy from him just because I figure if he has questionable ethics in one area, he probably has questionable ethics in others as well.

cdholden
25-Jun-2011, 07:07
It must have been pointed out to him. I've seen Bruce's posts, and on more than one occasion, add the dealer disclaimer to his comments when providing opinion on a specific camera feature.
I can't say if the lack of such early on was intended to be deceptive, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt since I've seen him reference being a dealer at other times. The numerous satisfied customers is also something to note.

bruce cahn
21-May-2014, 10:34
Has anyone used or have heard of this reseller? If so, have you had a positive experience?

Thanks!
Bruce's Field Camera Store is now closed because I have retired. I am still the east coast US importer for Ebony cameras and can provide Ebonys on special order at the lowest prices. Thanks to all you large format photographers for your years of support.--Bruce Cahn:D

bruce cahn
21-May-2014, 14:07
Though it no longer applies because the store is closed, I want to set the record straight on the import status of the items we sold. All cameras came from authorized US importers, including Linhofs. The same for Schneider lenses. Rodenstock lenses were either from HP, the authorized importer or from Calumet, the authorized UK importer. The Calumet imported lenses might be called grey market. We were the authorized importer for LF Rollei film, but dropped it because of quality problems. When everything was right it was a great film, but there were problems. All tripods were from authorized US importers. The same for Ilford and Bergger film.