Can someone please give few main coordinates about which are the bests B&W enlarger?

[gabriele turchi]

Hi there
apologies the ignorance i am bringing here ,
i naver had the pleasure of owning a darkroom but now i might be able to build one,

as for cameras i assume that exist a plethora of enlargers new/old , lenses etc... which i know nothing about .
i was wondering if any of you could give few main coordinates about what make an enlarger a good or excellent enlarger (i am assuming : quality and type of the lamp , the the way it handle the variable contrast system , lens , size etc...
over the years i have been in few different darkrooms ( someone else printing for me) and i have seen a wide variety of different enlargers (especially the way they handle variable contrast and timings ( controllers and such ) , so i assume the choice among used material could be very large (and i not even familiar with which are the most respectable brands)

for now i am am looking to learn printing B&W up to 4x5 neg size and perhaps being able to make prints perhaps up to 16x20 . (but i am open to color as well )

i am open to used or new , i don't not necessarily nee to be on a tight budget , for now i would love to understand what makes an enlarger a great enlarger and than start searching for it (if is no longer made) or buy it new .

thanks so much !!!
g

[Luis-F-S]

Easy LPL 4500 VCCE series. Check out KHB Photografix in Canada.

[Pawlowski6132]

I don't think there's much variability in enlargers. There's not much to it. I would recommend getting one you an grow into that has accessories readily available and that is in excellent condition. I would like to get a Zone VI but, out of my league for now.

[gabriele turchi]

I don't think there's much variability in enlargers. There's not much to it. I would recommend getting one you an grow into that has accessories readily available and that is in excellent condition. I would like to get a Zone VI but, out of my league for now.

thanks,
but as i said i have zero knowledge about enlargers , therefore i would not even know where start from the hundreds offers on eBay etc... if someone could easily and and quickly direct me to to a few web resources or mention brands or names (possibly quickly saying the reason ) would be really helpful
thanks!
g

[John Kasaian]

An enlarger where everything stays aligned, is free from dust, and has an excellent lens are the primary qualities most desire. Being in alignment is the only one of these qualities organic to the enlarging machine it's self. Everything else is kind of subjective.

I've noticed that the opinions on what's best are usually colored by what model enlarger a photographer learned on, much like aviators who consider either a Piper or Cessna more desirable than the other.

Respectable brands to look for?
Omega
Beseler
LPL
Durst
(there are probably more which I'm not familiar with!)

My own preference would be to have a basic enlarger with a very good lens as opposed to an enlarger with all the latest technology but with a cheap lens, but that's just my opinion.

Happy hunting!

[LabRat]

Most 4X5 enlargers are not too bad for B/W printing, but some will allow for bigger prints, have better alignment (but not as critical an issue as when using smaller formats), ease of operation, some are more simple (or some are very overly complex), some have lamps that are harder/easier to find, lock and focus better, etc...

The main thing is to find a complete set-up with all the accessories (like lens boards, neg carriers, condensers sets, lens cones, lamp head, etc) and all parts are present/working... Some older types might be hard/easy to find these parts, but some parts might not be located so try to find a complete working unit... Steer away from units that have separate electrical control/supply boxes as these might be missing, not work, or fussy (something with just a lamp bulb will be more reliable)... The bellows should be in good shape...

See what you can find locally first (as enlargers are big, heavy, and hard/expensive to ship)... Sometimes a photographer or school in your area might have one for little or nothing you can get...

Look around and do some research first...

Good Luck!!!

Steve K

[Luis-F-S]

thanks,
but as i said i have zero knowledge about enlargers , therefore i would not even know where start from the hundreds offers on eBay etc... if someone could easily and and quickly direct me to to a few web resources or mention brands or names (possibly quickly saying the reason ) would be really helpful
thanks!
g

Already did that in the first reply. LPL is not going to be the cheapest but it will be the easiest to learn on. I own two LPL 4x5 and DeVere and Durst 8x10 enlargers (and I've owned most of the major brands). Did you look up KHB? They carry several good brands why not ask them? If you want a "project" buy an old enlarger on the auction site.

[paulbarden]

The "best" one is going to be the enlarger that 1) does what you need it to do (since you mentioned 4X5, you will have to acquire one that accommodates negs up to that size), 2) is in good condition (not too beaten up) and 3) which you can afford.

I can only speak about personal experience with an enlarger that met my needs and that was an Omega D2V, which was a superb enlarger. The lens(es) you equip it with is by far the most important single detail, of course. Poor glass will make the best enlarger seem like garbage.

[Jac@stafford.net]

I can only add that an enlarger that can be easily aligned is important - at least to me.
Readily available parts - bulbs, timer, fans if necessary. Perhaps poor luck has led
me to avoid Ilford's variable contrast timer.

Good luck!

[adelorenzo]

IME the best enlarger to start with is the free one. People are literally giving them away these days, I had to start saying no lest I become a hoarder.

[xkaes]

You are in luck -- at least if you live in a metropolitan area. People have been basically giving away enlargers -- and gear -- since digital "hit". If you have access to Craigs List or schools, colleges, photo shops, etc. you can find some amazing gear for very little. If it's cheap it might be a good place to start and figure out what you want. I bought a used Beseler CB7 with two Schneider lenses for $400. I sold the lenses for $400, so I got the enlarger for free.

[xkaes]

I had to start saying no lest I become a hoarder.
I know. Just a couple of years ago a friend who has a GREAT darkroom with two GREAT Durst enlargers, etc. contacted me because be wanted to shut down his darkroom. He tried colleges, high schools, etc. no one wanted any of his gear because they were doing the same thing he was doing. EBAY was no good due to competition and shipping costs. He wanted to give me all his stuff, but I didn't need any of it. He eventually got rid of everything -- and he got nothing. BUT that was OK with him!!!

[Bruce Barlow]

I have an LPL/VCCE. It replaced a Beseler 45MX, and I have never looked back.

[xkaes]

I have a Beseler CB7. It supplemented my Beseler 45MX II, and I have never looked back.

[Luis-F-S]

You did say that



i am open to used or new , i don't necessarily need to be on a tight budget , for now i would love to understand what makes an enlarger a great enlarger and then start searching for it (if is no longer made) or buy it new .

thanks so much !!!
g

The beauty of LPL is that it is still being made, can be bought new or used (look in Craigslist) and accessories are readily available. There are many fine enlargers out there that parts can be a nightmare to find.

For B&W, a VCCE enlarger is the only way to go to make your life simple. If you want to make it complicated, then go for one of the other suggestions! Did you look up the KHB Photografix website? They carry Omega, LPL, DeVere, etc. and are a wealth of information.

http://store.khbphotografix.com/

You can also search this website, there must be hundreds of My Enlarger is the Best threads!

L

[Leigh]

For B&W, a VCCE enlarger is the only way to go to make your life simple.
What's a "VCCE enlarger"?

- Leigh

[Luis-F-S]

What's a "VCCE enlarger"?

- Leigh
Variable contrast constant exposure

[xkaes]

Ilford, and probably others, made VC heads to fit some enlargers. Convenient? Yes. More expensive? Yes. Intermediate filtration? Yes. Can you do the same thing with a color head? Yes.

[bob carnie]

For someone starting out an Ilford head on a good chassis is an excellent choice.

[Luis-F-S]

For someone starting out an Ilford head on a good chassis is an excellent choice.

Ilford made great heads until they break.....

[John Kasaian]

Elwood.
Gotta love an enlarger named after the protagonist in Harvey
https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/5391652.Elwood_P_Dowd
Yes, I'm drinking wine. Doctor's orders :o

[gabriele turchi]

thanks everyone ,
from my experience in darkroom (as spectator ) a VC head or VCCE feels more attractive to me ,

few doubts questions :

an ilford VC head (like the old 500H (not sure if is the only one ever made by ilford) , is considered a less "advanced/precise concept" than a more current VCCE made by LPL ?

which enlargers can mount an ilford 500H head?

how many different VC or VCCE heads exist? are VC heads made by almost every brand ?

thanks!
g

[Luis-F-S]

thanks everyone ,
an ilford VC head (like the old 500H (not sure if is the only one ever made by ilford) , is considered a less "advanced/precise concept" than a more current VCCE made by LPL ?

which enlargers can mount an ilford 500H head?

how many different VC or VCCE heads exist? are VC heads made by almost every brand ?

thanks!
g

When it breaks, it makes a great paperweight. I've already suggested you get an LPL and contact KHB and ask their opinion. I see no point in adding to this so, at this point good luck, you're on your own.

L

[gabriele turchi]

When it breaks, it makes a great paperweight. I've already suggested you get an LPL and contact KHB and ask their opinion. I see no point in adding to this so, at this point good luck, you're on your own.

L

thanks luis ,
i appreciate, i was inquiring about the ilford because the LPL 4500 VCC seems to be not to be much available used/refurbished and new is about 3500$ + accessories i guess ...

ps; do you know how you dial the various contrast/timing combinations? is there a remote or my hand by dialing some wheels?

thanks!
g

[Huub]

In my opinion the very best you can get is a Heiland splitgrade head. These heads are made for almost any enlarger, supported by the manifacturer and do a very good job. Down side is the price....

[jose angel]

"... for now i am am looking to learn printing B&W... "

IMHO, you don`t need a 3000$ enlarger nor an automated or complex system to do so. In fact, I think you should start with a cheap enlarger (better if it is for free), and learn what works for you. Any condenser enlarger with basic alignment capability and an under-the-lens or drawer type filtering system is enough.
An enlarger is basically like a camera, so my advice is practically the same here, don`t try to buy the best camera as a starter. Just buy one, and start shooting/printing.
After that, you`ll know your own preferences, where to spend your money, which route to follow. Take it slowly.

[jose angel]

"... for now i would love to understand what makes an enlarger a great enlarger and than start searching for it."

Like with almost everything, overall design, small details and why not, personal preferences make the difference. The easiest to differentiate are materials (e.g., aluminum cast vs plastic, machined vs stamped), quality of parts, alignment system, stiffness, accessories, etc. etc. etc.
I think you`d need to acquire a little experience to know what really counts for you.

[xkaes]

"... for now i am am looking to learn printing B&W... "

IMHO, you don`t need a 3000$ enlarger nor an automated or complex system.

I agree. It's your choice. Would I spend $500 or more for a VC head vs $5 for a set of filters? I'm nut's but I'm not stupid!!! Sure, I had to spend a little bit of time making a set of small prints of a gray card negative to determine the correct, matching exposure for each filter -- a Stouffer's step wedge makes that easy. I have the results grid (factors, such as 0.5x or 1.5x) on my darkroom wall, so I can change from any filter to another using simple multiplication or division. You have to make one for yourself, because it will be different for every combination of factors, such as paper developer, development time, paper, etc. An automated head can't know all that -- just as auto-exposure and auto-focusing in a camera can't get it right all the time.

[Luis-F-S]

thanks luis ,
i appreciate, i was inquiring about the ilford because the LPL 4500 VCC seems to be not to be much available used/refurbished and new is about 3500$ + accessories i guess ...

ps; do you know how you dial the various contrast/timing combinations? is there a remote or my hand by dialing some wheels?

thanks!
g

Really? I bought one for $550 from Craigs list. There have been several listed for sale in the Forum for about a third of the price you quoted. Your original post said new or used and that you were not on a budget. You need to make up your mind and have to look. Good luck.

[gabriele turchi]

Really? I bought one for $550 from Craigs list. There have been several listed for sale in the Forum for about a third of the price you quoted. Your original post said new or used and that you were not on a budget. You need to make up your mind and have to look. Good luck.


my apologies , i have just discovered the advanced search button on the for trade sale in this forum ...
will take a better look .

thanks
g

[Bruce Barlow]

Elwood.
Gotta love an enlarger named after the protagonist in Harvey
https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/5391652.Elwood_P_Dowd
Yes, I'm drinking wine. Doctor's orders :o

"Well, I've wrestled with reality for 35 years, Doctor, and I'm happy to state I finally won out over it." - Elwood P. Dowd

[xkaes]

I should have added that VC filter manufacturers offer suggestions for changing the exposure as you change filters. But just like with ISO film speed, they should only be used as starting points. I did my own tests with my paper/developer, etc. Sometimes the recommended exposure changes were VERY close, other times WAY off. If you don't run your own test, you can waste a lot of time and paper -- and sweat.

I've never used a VC head so I can't comment on how accurate their automatic exposure system is when changing filtration density.

[seezee]

If you can find a used LPL on eBay at a reasonable price, I'd go for it. The other brands mentioned are all fine, too. Look for a model that isn't discontinued so you can get parts!

Check your local university — they may have darkroom equipment they're trying to get rid of. And Craigslist is rife with unwanted enlargers.

[alexmuir]

It would be a good idea to visit someone who has a working enlarger in order to familiarise yourself with the parts. That would make it easier for you to tell if one you saw for sale was actually complete and ready to use. A friend recently saw one in an online sale, and asked me to check it out. I could tell him that, although it was advertised as 'complete with negative carrier', the carrier was actually for mounted transparencies, and useless for negatives.
The other point to bear in mind is your own location. You don't find many Beseler, Omega or Saunders models in the U.K, or probably in Europe. Durst, DeVere and LPL are more common there,
although LPL is probably in the minority. You can buy the 4x5 LPL new in England, although it is expensive.
I use an LPL 4551 with colour head for B&W, and it works well. It has dial-in filters, and I think the optional VC head works the same way, but with filters designed specifically for VC papers. It is quite a simple enlarger with few parts. If you were interested in getting one, you could view the instruction manual online and you will see what parts should be included with a used example. You could do the same with any other model where a manual can be found online. It's important to know what should be there for a complete setup as there are lots of people selling used gear who either don't know, or don't care if it is complete.
Good luck, and I hope you find something suitable.
Alex


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[xkaes]

In summary "You're on your own!"

Glad that we group of informed photographers could be of help!

[MartinP]

It is unclear where the OP is in the world, but s/he did mention that they would consider a new enlarger. New 4x5" enlargers are still made and are available in (at least) Europe, North-America and Japan. If there are no budget constraints then supporting current manufacturers would be a 'good thing'.

In general, do not bother with any motorised or automated second-hand enlarger of any brand. It will fail and will be expensive/impossible to fix. Go with the simplest possible options. Most likely a large chassis 'professional' machine with a colour-head would be most suitable, as they will happily print fixed-grade or VC black-and-white, as well as colour -- but the brand will depend upon which continent one is searching on.

As many people have mentioned, look carefully at lens selection. For a second-hand lens, it's performance may depend as much on it's history as on the brand (which also goes for enlargers I suppose). Further, such ancillaries as focus-magnifiers and enlarging easels should not be forgotten, and perhaps borrowing a laser-align tool would be helpful for initial setup after the enlarger has been knocked about during transport.

[seezee]

thanks luis ,
i appreciate, i was inquiring about the ilford because the LPL 4500 VCC seems to be not to be much available used/refurbished and new is about 3500$ + accessories i guess ...

ps; do you know how you dial the various contrast/timing combinations? is there a remote or my hand by dialing some wheels?

thanks!
g

You dial wheels on the front of the head. Paper manufacturers have tables showing which settings to use for specific grades. Or you can buy a set of Ilford filters to accomplish the same results, and skip the tables.

[seezee]

"... for now i am am looking to learn printing B&W... "

IMHO, you don`t need a 3000$ enlarger nor an automated or complex system to do so. In fact, I think you should start with a cheap enlarger (better if it is for free), and learn what works for you. Any condenser enlarger with basic alignment capability and an under-the-lens or drawer type filtering system is enough.
An enlarger is basically like a camera, so my advice is practically the same here, don`t try to buy the best camera as a starter. Just buy one, and start shooting/printing.
After that, you`ll know your own preferences, where to spend your money, which route to follow. Take it slowly.

+1 to that. I have a very nice enlarger, but only because I got lucky. Otherwise I would by the most basic one available.

[seezee]

If you were interested in getting one, you could view the instruction manual online and you will see what parts should be included with a used example. You could do the same with any other model where a manual can be found online. It's important to know what should be there for a complete setup as there are lots of people selling used gear who either don't know, or don't care if it is complete.

I can vouch for this. I bought my LPL for $100 USD, but I had to acquire a power supply, a replacement knob, a filter holder, and an appropriate lens separately. I was probably $400 or $500 in to get a working setup. Still much less than buying it all new.

This does not count enlarging easels and a grain magnifier. I already had a timer (given to me). I still want to get the focusing aid that allows you to change focus without having to reach up when the head is raised to the top, but am having a hard time justifying the cost.

[xkaes]

You dial wheels on the front of the head. Paper manufacturers have tables showing which settings to use for specific grades. Or you can buy a set of Ilford filters to accomplish the same results, and skip the tables.

I'm glad I didn't skip making a personalized grid/table. While most of Ilford's filter/exposure recommendations were very close, some surprised me -- and needed adjustment. To each his own.

[gabriele turchi]

thanks everyone
all these are very important coordinates , and i now i know more about how and what to look for ( especially the tip of looking for a "declared" complete package)

ps: i am in New york city by the way (since somebody asked)

i have one question that has not beee3nn discussed much :

what type of light source do you guys like ?

while searching seems that i have stumbled upon options like (sorry for the ignorance again , i am going to write terms )

diffused
condensed
cold
LED ( this is new technology )

i like the concept behind VC heads , but i also like to know what type of image (sharpness wise i guess ) can be obtained using different light sources systems
especially considering that some enlarger allow the use of different heads .

thanks!
g

[Luis-F-S]

This is all been answered in the first post . The image sharpness it's going to be much better than anything you can produce . The weak point is going to be you not the enlarger. have you considered buying a book on darkroom and printing there are lots of very cheap one out there and it would answer a lot of your questions. Every used book store has them available

[angusparker]

In the US: Durst 1200 w 450/500/501 Color Head
For those in Europe: DeVere 504

Both are very high quality and have service available / parts.

Color heads make the most sense for B&W - you can dial in the filters for VC papers - they work better than B&W heads where you have to manually insert filters, or the fancy new B&W heads that can't be serviced and have electronics that will go kaput in a few years. I would recommend you buy a back-up power supply for the color head because these can burn out. The power supplies tend to be relatively cheap on the auction site. They are usually specific to the color head with different plugs etc.

[xkaes]

i have one question that has not beee3nn discussed much :

what type of light source do you guys like ?

while searching seems that i have stumbled upon options like (sorry for the ignorance again , i am going to write terms )

diffused
condensed
cold
LED ( this is new technology )

i like the concept behind VC heads , but i also like to know what type of image (sharpness wise i guess ) can be obtained using different light sources systems
especially considering that some enlarger allow the use of different heads .

thanks!
g

This is another question that will produce multiple responses. Everyone has their own preference(s). That's one reason why many photographers, like me, have multiple heads. Each has its pros and cons -- depending on who you ask. LED is not a new technology. Minolta & Beseler created one, together, back in the 80's. It used RED, BLUE, and GREEN tubes instead of the traditional MAGENTA, YELLOW, and CYAN filters. You also need to add POINT LIGHT SOURCE to your list of heads -- just to confuse things even more.

[jose angel]

"what type of light source do you guys like ?"
(Edit; xkaes has been faster than me, I agree with him... :) Anyway I keep my post).

This is the typical question where each photographer will give you a different answer... from the tiniest point light source to any oversized diffusion type head.

Personally, I like condenser heads with a straight (not reflected) LED source. Advantages: sharp, easy to change light output (a must for me), cold operation, bomb proof, comfortable to use. They use to ask for filter sheets, that as mentioned, have to be inserted manually, either in a filter drawer or into an under-the-lens kind of slot. I prefer filter drawers but I must admit that is a not so practical method; in the real life, the under-the-lens method is way easier to use, and with certain techniques, way more convenient. Disadvantages: the dust issue (not actually a problem, I work perfectly clean but it takes some time to clean), and filters must be used with care (even a drop of water could ruin them, not an issue at all too, filters are cheap, -I have ruined a couple filters in 40 years, thought-).

[gabriele turchi]

tanks for everyone who are giving their testimony preferences ,

and i would invite whom does not not want to share their preferences to avoid reply .
i know that everyone have their own preferences and i know that there is practice to be done and books

but here am asking people testimony to whom want to share ,
since for me is helpful to hear what you guys like and why ..in order to create some coordinates .

thanks a lot
g

[gabriele turchi]

Personally, I like condenser heads with a straight (not reflected) LED source. Advantages: sharp, easy to change light output (a must for me)

jose,

what you mean by changing light output ? you mean power (watts) ?

thanks

g

[gabriele turchi]

This is another question that will produce multiple responses. Everyone has their own preference(s). That's one reason why many photographers, like me, have multiple heads.

that was my thinking ... ( but yes , now someone now will say : buy a cheap one and start there ...)
:)

thanks
g

[Luis-F-S]

So are you buying an enlarger or taking a poll?

[jose angel]

"what you mean by changing light output ? you mean power (watts) ?"

Right. Depending on the task, you may need more or less light power (brightness) to get the *right* exposure time, which to my taste use to fall between say, 10 and 20 seconds (in order to make burning/dodging easier).
A dense negative will ask for more light, specially if it has to be printed big. In the opposite, a thin negative needs less light, same as smaller enlargements.
If you only have a full powered light source, you have to play with lens apertures to control light output, or to use ND filters to reduce light. Some enlargers, like the mentioned 4x5" LPL top dichro heads, enjoy a "light reduction" system (full/low), which is quite useful, but still too much bright to my taste (it is a quite powerful enlarger). You still have methods to lower brightness, but I think it is easier to simply change a bulb, or to use a dimmable system.
Obviously it depends on the density of your negatives, the size you prime to print, the format, the condensers/boxes, how fast you like to work, etc. Notice that I`m talking about my own preferences. For sure others could differ.

[John Kasaian]

You want a testimony?
Mine is an Omega D-II, condenser head.
It's identical to the storied D-2 only with an armstrong head elevator instead of a hand crank.
Works fine, I like it, no complaints and it was extraordinarily inexpensive.
Since it is used only for 4x5 I didn't need a lot of extra stuff.
Used parts are plentiful and can be cheap or expensive, depending of where you buy them.
I think either a D-II or D-2 is a fine machine to learn on.
Many Pros still use them (and Beselers) with excellent results.
Consider getting one and spending your $$ on a quality lens.

Let us know what you decide on