Best compact 4x5/rollfilm camera for architecture?

[artcorr]

Hi everyone

I've been lurking here for a while but haven't posted much, have to say thanks to everyone for all of the information I've taken in.

I'm in the market for a new camera for shooting architecture on 4x5 and with a 6x7 roll film back. The 4x5 will be mostly for my personal work, the 6x7 for commercial work which I'll continue to do some on digital (Canon outfit) and some on film. I currently have a Toyo 45A, which has been great but won't play nicely with the super wides + rise/shifts. I also want this to be as compact as possible, I'm hoping to cram the camera, film holders (either 2x roll film or 5x sheet, not all at the same time), 5 lenses (45, 55, 75, 90, 120), Canon 5D, 17 TSE, and 24 TSE, in to a carry on backpack.

At the moment the two cameras that look the goods are the Arca F Field C and Technikardan, but I'm leaning towards the Arca since I should be able to store it sideways, saving a heap of space.

Does anyone have any thoughts on which way to go, or am I completely missing anything?

[Bob Salomon]

You mean the Tk since that folds and stores sideways and opens into a 20" monorail camera..

[AtlantaTerry]

I'm in the market for a new camera for shooting architecture on 4x5 and with a 6x7 roll film back. The 4x5 will be mostly for my personal work, the 6x7 for commercial work which I'll continue to do some on digital (Canon outfit) and some on film. I currently have a Toyo 45A, which has been great but won't play nicely with the super wides + rise/shifts.

I also want this to be as compact as possible, I'm hoping to cram the camera, film holders (either 2x roll film or 5x sheet, not all at the same time), 5 lenses (45, 55, 75, 90, 120), Canon 5D, 17 TSE, and 24 TSE, in to a carry on backpack.



Personally, I don't see how all of that will easily fit into a backpack. And don't forget you will need a light meter, filters, tripod, dark cloth, loupe, cable release, stopwatch, level, notebook, etc. that will need to be transported as well.

[artcorr]

You mean the Tk since that folds and stores sideways and opens into a 20" monorail camera..
by sideways i mean arca with the rail across the width of the bag, standards on their sides

[Bob Salomon]

by sideways i mean arca with the rail across the width of the bag, standards on their sides
You had best look at the TK. It easily fits in a backpack when folded and is about the size of a hard back novel. Opens into a 20" view camera in seconds.

[Tobias Key]

What about a Toyo VX125? I guess it really depends on how much you want to spend on a camera that won't earn you any money (or at least not directly). The Toyo would have the advantage that it would share some compatability with your 45a and is rather cheaper than the TK - although still not cheap.

[LabRat]

Depends...

What focal length lenses do you want to use??? If you just want to shoot WA, the camera only needs a little front rise, as the lens will cut off quickly and the distortion/light fall-off looks most natural with the lens nearly on-axis... If you also shoot longer FL's, a range of movements will help, but will also require a more advanced camera that will be harder to backpack around...

Steve K

[Two23]

I don't see how you're going to get a wide enough lens on a 4x5 to shoot wide angle with a 120 back? Wouldn't something like the Fuji 680 work better?


Kent in SD

[Bob Salomon]

I don't see how you're going to get a wide enough lens on a 4x5 to shoot wide angle with a 120 back? Wouldn't something like the Fuji 680 work better?


Kent in SD

You can easily use a 35mm Apo Grandagon on the TK.

[Charlie Strack]

If your intent is to use 4x5 format for your architectural work, then look at the 120mm Angulon (not Super Angulon) lens, available used at reasonable prices. It's much more compact than lenses with a larger angle of view, but provides a lot of movement with 4x5. You might find it works well enough with your 45A. Its compact size means there's not much lens behind the lensboard to interfere with movements.

If you're intent is to use 6x7 for architectural work you'd probably be better off with a 6x9 view camera especially if you're looking for wide angle lenses.

There's just so much compromise you can get in trying to cover two different formats with the same camera. Definitely you should consider a camera with bag bellows for a 4x5 when using wide angle lenses for 6x7.

Maybe you could find a used Calumet 4x5 with wide angle bellows--it's like their standard 4x5, but a shorter rail, and pleated bellows to permit more movement with wide angle lenses. The front standard is mounted closer to the back standard so recessed lensboards aren't needed.

[JMO]

I have no experience with the Arca Swiss cameras you're considering, but Mr. Salomon is correct regarding the foldability and portability of the Technikarden 45S. It folds up pretty compact for storing and transport, and then sets up quite quickly once you get the hang of it. And it has all the movements you're ever likely to need on BOTH the front and rear standards. ...


You had best look at the TK. It easily fits in a backpack when folded and is about the size of a hard back novel. Opens into a 20" view camera in seconds.

[Jeff Keller]

Look at the Canham DLC45 or MQC57. The standard bellows allows a lot of movement. The camera folds up quite compact. The MQC57 allows you to take 6x17 roll fill pictures using the Canham roll film holder. Of course you can also do 6x9 or 6x12 with a standard Graflok roll film holder.

If you only using wide lenses, an Ebony SW45 would also be worth considering. It doesn't fold but it is quite small with the bellows at minimum extension. It handles wide angle lenses very nicely.

The 90mm super angulon XL is a big lens. You might want to consider a 110 super symmar. Judging by the focal lengths it looks like you might be using Grandagons though.

jeff

[biedron]

You can pack the Arca Swiss into a backpack if you store the camera on a 6" (15 cm) rail section that is part of the telescopic bench option. I may have the nomenclature wrong, but I think the version with the telescopic bench is called the "Field" and not the "Field C" (C=compact). The Field C, with the folding rail, is actually less packable. If you look around on the Forum you will probably see that most Arca owners prefer the telescopic bench rather than the folding rail.

My 4x5 pack (Photo Backpacker) holds my Arca on the 6" rail, the telescopic rail, 6 lenses (+2 alternate rear elements for a Nikkor 360/500/720 set) plus all the other stuff needed for shooting. Of course there is no space left over :)

Most responders (including me) can tell you about the camera that they own or have experience with. Ideally you will hear from someone who has used both cameras you are considering.

Bob

[Mark Sampson]

You have architecture clients who still want film? It's a long time since I've seen any of those. Nowadays I have a 4x5 for myself and shoot digital for the clients... life is much easier that way.

[AtlantaTerry]

You have architecture clients who still want film? It's a long time since I've seen any of those. Nowadays I have a 4x5 for myself and shoot digital for the clients... life is much easier that way.

Here in Atlanta, I have one corporate account who requires my photography to be delivered on 4x5" sheet film. When I first acquired the account, I already had some 4x5" equipment but knowing of their requirement, I spent a LOT of money on additional equipment.

I am also working with other accounts to show them the benefits of creating a corporate archive of their architectural (corporate facilities) growth using sheet film because digital archives can all be lost if a hard drive fails or is attacked by a virus. Like many people and businesses, they have not experienced a catastrophic image data loss so their brains do not seem to be able to grasp the concept. A work in progress... LOL!

Speaking of that, back in the early part of this century, I once received an email with a virus attached that deleted EVERY image file - RAW, TIF, JPG, GIF, etc. So I have experienced catastrophic image data loss. :(

[Ari]

In 4x5, the TK45-s wins on may fronts, especially when considering versatility and folded size. It's about as big as a folded up Technika, but can do most anything a monorail can do.
It's not the lightest, but it's quick to set up and use, offering stability and precision.
Most roll film backs won't fit under its GG; the Linhof GG will have to be removed for exposure, so that's a minor hassle to consider.
I think that's the clear winner in capability, versatility and packability.

The VX125 is a good camera, though somewhat limited in extension, unless you also get accessory rail extensions; it also uses most Toyo G accessories, so parts are cheap.
The synthetic bellows are good, but not as impressive as the TK's bellows.
It's also more of a wide-angle camera, pretty comfortable with 55mm-180mm lenses, not so good with a 210 or longer.
Despite its remarkable design, it needs more room to pack, and awkwardly so, than does the TK45-s. The rail ends stick out of an otherwise compact camera, making a slight T-shape when packed.

The Fuji GX680 is a great system with superb lenses, but it offers front movements only.
And since you want to have 4x5 as a personal option, maybe the Fuji is a non-starter.

Seeing as you want to use 4x5 and roll film, consider getting a (more expensive) Sinar Zoom roll film back. There are at least two versions, maybe a third.
It will fit under the Linhof's GG, and gives you the option of using every 120 format from 645 up to 612.
My personal fave for buildings and such is 6x9, which helps with taller buildings, but that's entirely a subjective opinion.

And no matter how much gear you want to take with you, there's a case out there that can hold all of it. :)