So its that time to get a 8x10 Svedovsky

[ndwgolf]

Okay I have now been using my 4x5 Wisner for roughly 5 months and enjoy the process very much. I had a look last night at a New Svedovsky (http://svedovsky.com/cameras/8x10-camera/) and I have decided to buy one.

I'm only guessing but I would imagine anyone who has experienced LF photography has had the urge to get a 8x10.......I'm not getting any younger and seeing as I am still working and can afford to buy one I might as well take the plunge and get one now before I retire in 18 months time. The camera will come with two lens boards............. I am guessing the current lenses that I have will also work on the 8x10 (I'm only guessing)
My current lenses are
Nikon 360mm f8 (I think)
Fuji 210
Fuji 150
90mm not sure what brand

I'm currently at work so unable to give you the exact details of the lenses

Please can you offer recommendations for developing tanks/lenses and basically anything else that I am going to need

As always really appreciate any feedback

Neil

[Dan Fromm]

360/8 Nikkor-T? No.
210/5.6 Fujinon? Perhaps, probably not. See http://www.subclub.org/fujinon/index.htm
150/5.6 Fujinon? No.
90, any brand? No.

Think again, and hard.

[ndwgolf]

Think again, and hard.
About what??

[biedron]

Neil,

As Dan said, you will need other lenses. I also started with 4x5 and then also acquired an 8x10, at which point my lens acquisition started again.

Beware: once you start using 8x10 you will probably be less inclined to pull out the 4x5!

The Fuginon "C" lenses are small and high quality. Fuji on 240 A is also small. Depends on whether small size or faster lens is a priority.

Dan gave you a link for lens info. You can also google "ebony lens tables" to find another useful lens resource with tons of lens info.

Bob

[Jac@stafford.net]

About what??

Lenses.

...and did you find the Svedovsky was really steady? How about with a lens? No rear movements.

[ndwgolf]

Neil,

As Dan said, you will need other lenses. I also started with 4x5 and then also acquired an 8x10, at which point my lens acquisition started again.

Beware: once you start using 8x10 you will probably be less inclined to pull out the 4x5!

The Fuginon "C" lenses are small and high quality. Fuji on 240 A is also small. Depends on whether small size or faster lens is a priority.

Dan gave you a link for lens info. You can also google "ebony lens tables" to find another useful lens resource with tons of lens info.

Bob
Sorry I missed the link

[ndwgolf]

Neil,



Beware: once you start using 8x10 you will probably be less inclined to pull out the 4x5!


Bob
Its okay I have found a nice spot in the corner of my living room to sit the 4x5 on a nice wooden tripod and something else for my wife to dust :( :) :) :)

[ndwgolf]

Lenses.

...and did you find the Svedovsky was really steady? How about with a lens? No rear movements.
I've just this minute found out that there is a 5 to 6 month lead on the camera :( :( :( Not to happy about that.
The camera does not come with a lens.
Rear movements are limited to back and forward.
I'm now looking on Ebay and Google for another option as I don't want to wait 5 months, but I do want to buy NEW :)

Neil

[vdonovan]

I've had a Svedovsky 8x10 for about three years. I find it to be very well made, sturdy, compact, and the bed can extend a nice long distance. I miss having rear swing, and I don't like the setup for combined front swing and shift, which I find hard to adjust accurately. I also find the ground glass to be dim compared to the glass on my 8x10 Sinar. I bought mine with the case, and I'm really glad I did, it's bullet proof.

You are going to need new lenses. Here is useful list of 8x10 lenses:
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF8x10in.html

Wide lenses are expensive in this format. For my wide, I have the Fujinon CM-W 210/5.6 It's reasonably priced, but barely covers 8x10, with no room for movements. I wish I could afford a wide lens with better coverage.

I process my film in a CL81, which I like a lot. http://www.catlabs.info/product/catlabs-cl81-an-8x10-sheet-film-processing-reel

8x10 film is expensive, so I shoot a lot of X-ray film. The CL-81 tends to scratch the super-cheap double-sided X-ray film (it's hard not to scratch it no matter how you process it) so I spend more for single-sided film. https://www.zzmedical.com/8x10-in-carestream-kodak-ektascan-b-ra-single-emulsion-video-film.html

I still shoot 4x5, but the other posters are right, 8x10 is addictive.

[John Kasaian]

FWIW, there are two other capital expenses that go with the move to 8x10---
A tripod that can handle the greater weight and bulk
Film holders

As for lenses, Fuji seems to be getting all the accolades, and the prices appear very attractive.
As for lens boards, if you intend on sticking with more modern lenses, boards drilled for Copal "1" and "3" should accommodate
most of the lenses you'll come across.
However, if you want classical glass
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S33tWZqXhnk
then wait and get them drilled to fit.

8x10 is a heck of a fun format. Good luck & enjoy the ride!

[ndwgolf]

Yea I knew about the film holders, I already have a strong enough tripod and head.............Svedovsky replied and said they have recently had a bunch of orders (which is good) so that is the reason for the long lead time. I will probably send them the deposit when I get back home to Malaysia in a weeks time :)

[ndwgolf]

Okay back to the lenses. Looking at the list of lenses that Donovan sent me, I can see that they run about 1 to 2k per lens..........i'm cool with that. What about focal length, would my 360 Nikor T have the same FOV that it has on my 4x5 or would it be different..........is there a rule of thumb to convert 8x10 back to 35mm like what I was told for 4x5 i.e. my 360mm is like a 120mm and my 150mm a 50mm i.e. (3x)??

Neil

[Dan Fromm]

Your 360/8 Nikkor-T barely covers 5x7 at f/22. As I said, think hard.

[ndwgolf]

Your 360/8 Nikkor-T barely covers 5x7 at f/22. As I said, think hard.
Your all confusing me with this think hard stuff.

Someone else has already explained that my current lenses are no good for 8x10, thats fine I will and want to buy the correct size lenses obviously for the 8x10 camera.

What I'm trying to fathom out is what lenses are suitable for the 8x10 especially for landscape and portraiture .............say 21, 50 and 100 in 35mm format
Thanks

Neil

[Luis-F-S]

[QUOTE=ndwgolf;1391765]Okay I have now been using my 4x5 Wisner for roughly 5 months and enjoy the process very much. I had a look last night at a New Svedovsky (http://svedovsky.com/cameras/8x10-camera/) and I have decided to buy one. /QUOTE]

Five months hey? I used my 4x5 for 6 or so years before I thought of getting something larger, but then again, that's just me. It gave me time to learn about the process so when I moved up format, I didn't do something stupid. I first moved up to 5x7 then up to 8x10. As far as 8x10 lenses, I'd get a 12"-14" lens. You can find a 12" (300 mm) "modern" plasmat made by Rodenstock, Schneider, Fuji or Nikkor pretty easily and cheaply, or you can get a classic Dagor, or Commercial Ektar. I'd use that for at least 6 mo. to a year before getting something else. Otherwise you'll spend a bunch of money on lenses you may not like, but again, we'll get them at a good price when you sell them on the LFF!

L

[ndwgolf]

[QUOTE=ndwgolf;1391765]Okay I have now been using my 4x5 Wisner for roughly 5 months and enjoy the process very much. I had a look last night at a New Svedovsky (http://svedovsky.com/cameras/8x10-camera/) and I have decided to buy one. /QUOTE]

Five months hey? I used my 4x5 for 6 or so years before I thought of getting something larger, but then again, that's just me. It gave me time to learn about the process so when I moved up format, I didn't do something stupid. I first moved up to 5x7 then up to 8x10. As far as 8x10 lenses, I'd get a 12"-14" lens. You can find a 12" (300 mm) "modern" plasmat made by Rodenstock, Schneider, Fuji or Nikkor pretty easily and cheaply, or you can get a classic Dagor, or Commercial Ektar. I'd use that for at least 6 mo. to a year before getting something else. Otherwise you'll spend a bunch of money on lenses you may not like, but again, we'll get them at a good price when you sell them on the LFF!

Lwhat is the 300mm equivalent FOV in 35mm??
Is this a 8x10 lens..........?? Kowa Graphic 360mm F9 lens for Large format and ULF (Computar) in copal #3

[Alan Gales]

What I'm trying to fathom out is what lenses are suitable for the 8x10 especially for landscape and portraiture .............say 21, 50 and 100 in 35mm format
Thanks

Neil

Hi Neil.

There are plenty of normal focal length lenses out there with lots of coverage. Look for a 300mm to 360mm or 12" to 14" in an older lens.

Schneider made a 165mm lens and Rodenstock a 155mm lens. They are pretty wide and have plenty of coverage. They are also expensive. I read that the 165mm is huge and weighs a ton. Think boat anchor. I'm assuming the Rodenstock is similar. I've got a Schneider SA 121mm f/8 lens that was cheap but it just covers 8x10 straight on with no movements. I use it for 4x5 since I have not found a need yet to shoot it on 8x10. It's really wide! My wide angle for 8x10 is a Fujinon 250mm f/6.7 lens but it's more like a 35mm lens for a 35mm camera.

A 600mm lens would be similar to the 100mm on a 35mm camera. It is also big/heavy and expensive. You also need to draw your bellows out a long way. Ok for studio use but not always that practical in the field with any wind. An 8x10 bellows is like a sail anyway. A lot of photographers who shoot 8x10 use shorter focal lengths for their "long" lenses. Something more like my 19" (480mm) Artar. It's just more manageable. A lot of portraiture done with 8x10 is done with a 300 to 360mm lens. Yousuf Karsh used a 14" (360mm) Kodak Commercial Ektar for most of his work.

[Luis-F-S]

[QUOTE=Luis-F-S;1391808]what is the 300mm equivalent FOV in 35mm??
Is this a 8x10 lens..........?? Kowa Graphic 360mm F9 lens for Large format and ULF (Computar) in copal #3

150 in 4x5 and 50mm in 135, but it really doesn't strictly translate that way. My most used lens for the past 25 years in 8x10 is a 12" Dagor. You really don't need a 14" KG as your first lens. You might want to PM B.S.Kumar on this site, he gets a lot of lenses and is pretty reasonable with prices on them. He can also tell you what will and won't cover 8x10. You really should also get some books, because you're unlike to get all the answers, or even all the correct answers on this site. You'll get a lot of opinions, and as they say, opinions are like axxholes, everybody has one! Everyone wants to move from 35mm to 8x10! Yeah, right! If it were me, I'd shoot 4x5 for another year or so, and learn about 8x10. You'll make a lot fewer mistakes. There are probably a thousand posts on 8x10 on this site. You might want to read at least some of them, also, re-read Alan's post! L

[vdonovan]

Here is a very nice discussion of lenses for 8x10:
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?8916-What-8x10-lenses-to-get

[Serge S]

I've been thinking of going to 8x10 for quite sometime.
I'm leaning towards getting a Ritter of I go new, as it is so light that I could use my existing tripod, plus it weighs about the same as my existing camera
I already own a few lenses that would work in the format: a 12" commercial Ektar & a 9 1/2 in Dagor.
So all I would need to add would be some film holders.
Still I feel 4x5 quite nice. I am going to try 5x7 next I think just to see as I can swap the back to my Deardorff.
I like the 4x5 aspect ratio better than 5x7 though.

Lot's a nu=ice equip to choose from. Good luck with your choices & decision.

[Fred L]

I think the trap some photographers fall into when entering 8x10, is trying to replicate equivalent lenses from 35mm. Try making photographs with one lens and go from there, as large format is a very different beast and you may find yourself 'seeing' differently compared to smaller format work.

fwiw, I use the Fuji 210 WS (inside lettering and fine coverage for 8x10) and a 300 Schneider Apo Symmar. Also have 355 G Claron but seldom use that other than for 7x17.

or spend more time with 4x5 before leaping into 8x10, because as noted by others, costs are exceptionally more expensive and work flow is, for me at least, noticeably slower the larger the format one goes.

[ndwgolf]

A couple of lenses that I have found on Ebay are the;
Color Tamron 240mm F6.8 Dagor type ULF lens in copal #3 shutter Multicoated
Kowa Graphic 360mm F9 lens
450 M Nikon F9

They all mention that they have large coverage...........I like to shoot landscape and portraiture

Thanks

Neil

[Pfsor]

They all mention that they have large coverage...........I like to shoot landscape and portraiture

Thanks

Neil

In that case you are made for the Nikon M 300mm/9 beauty! A very natural choice for 8x10 landscape pictures. A small lightweight jewel.

[Dan Fromm]

In that case you are made for the Nikon M 300mm/9 beauty! A very natural choice for 8x10 landscape pictures. A small lightweight jewel.

Claimed coverage at f/22 325 mm. Not a lot of scope for movements on 8x10.

[Pfsor]

It's my understanding that with long focal lengths you don't use much movements in landscape photography. YMMV.

[ndwgolf]

Claimed coverage at f/22 325 mm. Not a lot of scope for movements on 8x10.
Dan for my own understanding had it been 350mm at f22 would that have been better coverage ??

[Luis-F-S]

I've been thinking of going to 8x10 for quite sometime.
I'm leaning towards getting a Ritter of I go new, as it is so light that I could use my existing tripod, plus it weighs about the same as my existing camera
I already own a few lenses that would work in the format: a 12" commercial Ektar & a 9 1/2 in Dagor.

Both your lenses will work, and though Richard makes a fine Camera, don't buy an 8x10 just because it's "so light that I could use my existing tripod"! I use V8's which are right at 12#s, and I think the weight is fine! L

[Pere Casals]

Okay I have now been using my 4x5 Wisner for roughly 5 months and enjoy the process very much. I had a look last night at a New Svedovsky (http://svedovsky.com/cameras/8x10-camera/) and I have decided to buy one.

I'm only guessing but I would imagine anyone who has experienced LF photography has had the urge to get a 8x10.......I'm not getting any younger and seeing as I am still working and can afford to buy one I might as well take the plunge and get one now before I retire in 18 months time. The camera will come with two lens boards............. I am guessing the current lenses that I have will also work on the 8x10 (I'm only guessing)
My current lenses are
Nikon 360mm f8 (I think)
Fuji 210
Fuji 150
90mm not sure what brand

I'm currently at work so unable to give you the exact details of the lenses

Please can you offer recommendations for developing tanks/lenses and basically anything else that I am going to need

As always really appreciate any feedback

Neil

When you know the details of your glasses you can see it here, what works for 8x10 and 4x5:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF8x10in.html
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF4x5in.html

For 8x10 I develop in trays, a 8x10 paper safe in fact is very convenient. When developing finished I close lights and I place the sheet from the paper safe in a tray with stop, I open lights after 15s and continue like this, fixing lights open.

Developing in trays alows to control by agitation the best, it's simple, plain and minimalist. One sheet at one time. This is good and bad for obvious reasons.

You can start like this because it's straight and then considering other ways like rotary, I'm adict to trays because I like to control highlights with diluted developer and little agitation.

Also trays are good for reduced agitation because as film is horizontal gravity don't helps bromide drags.

Regards

[Luis-F-S]

When you know the details of your glasses you can see it here, what works for 8x10 and 4x5:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF8x10in.html
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF4x5in.html

Although an excellent source, it mostly covers "modern" lenses at list prices at the time. By modern, I mean lenses that were discontinued 20-30 ago, vs vintage lenses that were discontinued 40-100 years ago or more! There are probably even more vintage lenses than the number of modern lenses on the lists.

[Pere Casals]

Hello Luis,

I guess I'd consider to apply "modern" lenses even in some 4 ways.

1) Last batches manufactured, since say 2000

2) Multicoated, since say 1975/80

3) Way more than sharp enough lenses, say since 1960/65

4) Lenses with shutter, since...

What is clear to me is that for true artists any glass is good enough, and if it has a defect that artist is to take advantage of it, as a nice creative resource, as it was an strenght.

[mike rosenlof]

8x10 is a great format, but it is a lot more demanding than 4x5. Everything is bigger and slower. Try and find an 8x10 film holder. If you're going to carry more than two of them with you, the weight of the camera almost doesn't matter. The film holders add up!

One thing to consider is what "you" intend to do with those 8x10 negs. Contact prints or wall-size enlargements or something in betwen? If you're going to be the contact print purist a la Edward Weston. Don't worry about lens sharpness too much as long as you have coverage and the lens is not from the soft-focus era it will probably look pretty good on a contact print. If you're going to go for huge printing, you must have more money than I do, or expect to make some good money, and you'll probably want some fancier modern glass. Enlarging 8x10, or even scanning and printing big digital takes a lot of resources.

You do need to be aware of lens coverage. It's in the spec sheet for the lens, if you can find that. Most lenses list the coverage at infinity, and often f/22. Process lenses and other macro-type lenses are often listed at 1:1 and the infinity coverage is half of that. The 210 the OP mentions probably does not cover 8x10 at infinity, but might at portrait distances, might not.

8x10 is a lot of fun. Don't go there just because bigger is better. That's an American myth. :) I shoot 8x10 and contact print the negs. If I want bigger prints I need to shoot smaller film because I only have a 4x5 enlarger. I'm pretty happy working that way. 8x10 prints just work better *** For Me ***. Easier to store, easier to share (showing or giving away), etc. I like to hold an 8x10 in my hands and enjoy it that way.

have fun whatever you choose!

[ndwgolf]

Loads of fantastic information on here....... thank you all for your input and patience. Yesterday I was pretty much down to two 8x10 cameras and I was going to buy one of them. Last night I messaged Tim Layton via FB asking him his thought on both the Chamonix and also the Svedovsky 8x10 (the Svedovsky has a 5 month lead time but the Chamonix is ready avaliible but also $1200 bucks more expensive. While waiting for Tim to reply another guy pops up and said to look at intrepid view cameras and there's is less than a $100 dollars new........ I did look at it and it looks cheap when compared to the others two. Anyway I'm in no hurry. I've been down the road of buying cheap before and regretting it later. I really like the look of the Svedovsky but don't want to wait 5 months so my impatience could end up costing me 1200 bucks :( :(
Thoughts and comments welcome

Neil

[Christopher Barrett]

While I think Stanislaw does a really solid job with his cameras, just from looking at them... I don't think they quite compare to the Chamonix. The carbon fiber bed of my 4x10 is just rock solid and the entire design is very thoughtfully done. I feel they're worth the extra $1200.

As for figuring out focal lengths... that's easy. You already shoot 4x5, just double those for 8x10. Your 150 yields a normal perspective for 4x5. You'd want a 300 for 8x10. Also, though, I find this depth of field calculator really handy as it also gives a multitude of comparable focal lengths over different formats...

Depth of Field, Angle & Field of View, & Equivalent Lens Calculator (https://www.pointsinfocus.com/tools/depth-of-field-and-equivalent-lens-calculator/#{"c":[{"f":21,"av":"32","fl":305,"d":914}],"m":0})

[ndwgolf]

While I think Stanislaw does a really solid job with his cameras, just from looking at them... I don't think they quite compare to the Chamonix. The carbon fiber bed of my 4x10 is just rock solid and the entire design is very thoughtfully done. I feel they're worth the extra $1200.

As for figuring out focal lengths... that's easy. You already shoot 4x5, just double those for 8x10. Your 150 yields a normal perspective for 4x5. You'd want a 300 for 8x10. Also, though, I find this depth of field calcualtor really handy as it also gives a multitude of comparable focal lengths over different formats...



Depth of Field, Angle & Field of View, & Equivalent Lens Calculator (https://www.pointsinfocus.com/tools/depth-of-field-and-equivalent-lens-calculator/#{"c":[{"f":21,"av":"32","fl":305,"d":914}],"m":0})
Thanks for that

[ndwgolf]

Okay so I decided on the 8x10 Chamonix. They have stock and it will be waiting for me when I get home next week. I'm still in negotiations with Omar for a Kowa Graphic 360mm F9 lens and film holders.
I will now need to go to B&H and get some accessories, so need some help on what I need to get me going with 8x10 and contact prints;
1/. Film holders.......coming
2/. Film... thinking TRI-X
3/. Contact paper for 8x10 contact prints......need advice on that
4/. Chemicals....got already
5/. Lens Board .....coming
6/. xxxxxxx
7/. xxxxxx

Please add as necessary ?

[John Kasaian]

Okay so I decided on the 8x10 Chamonix. They have stock and it will be waiting for me when I get home next week. I'm still in negotiations with Omar for a Kowa Graphic 360mm F9 lens and film holders.
I will now need to go to B&H and get some accessories, so need some help on what I need to get me going with 8x10 and contact prints;
1/. Film holders.......coming
2/. Film... thinking TRI-X
3/. Contact paper for 8x10 contact prints......need advice on that
4/. Chemicals....got already
5/. Lens Board .....coming
6/. xxxxxxx
7/. xxxxxx

Please add as necessary ?
What works for me---
Film holders---mine are all used, mostly wooden ones and a few plastics. They work.
I shoot mostly Ilford Hp-5+ or FP-4+ these days
I use graded, fiber base printing paper for my contacts---Fomabrom N111
What works for me may not work for you!

For some time now I've been using a Printfile proof printer under a small format enlarger to hold my "sandwich" for contact printing. So far this has been the best set up for me---easier than printing out frames or a big thick piece of glass.
It's worth considering anyway.

[MMELVIS]

2 good lens options for 8x10 that will not break the bank are the Gundlach Radar Extreme Wide Angle Anast 6 1/4 or a 210mm F9 Eskofot Ultragon.

[Andrew O'Neill]

My 4x5 lenses I use for 8x10:

Nikkor SW 120
Nikkor W 210

[ndwgolf]

So I ended up buying the "Kowa Graphic 360mm F9 lens" and I will stick with just one lens for the next month or to until I can replenish some funds. The 8x10 Chamonix should be waiting for me at home when I get home in a weeks time............Pictures to follow

Neil

[ndwgolf]

Happy chap

[DennisD]

Great choice !

Congratulations and best of good luck !

(P.S. Did you remember to order a mule to carry all your equipment ? ):o

[ndwgolf]

Great choice !

Congratulations and best of good luck !

(P.S. Did you remember to order a mule to carry all your equipment ? ):oCompared to my Leica S and three lenses..........I would carry the Chamonix

every time.........and have a lot more fun doing it :) ;)