Status of Azo

[Michael A.Smith]

I spoke with Kodak today. Here is the quick version of my report:

There is plenty of Azo on hand. No one needs to panic.

A few years ago Paula and I saved Azo from extinction. We didn't do this just to get everyone excited about silver chloride paper and then leave them in the lurch. So we are having silver chloride paper made elsewhere. There will be silver chloride paper available as long as we are around.

[Bobby Sandstrom]

You Rock Man!

[S. Preston Jones]

If you are going to have it made, please have in made in double weight and in more grades.

Thanks,

Preston

[Bruce E. Rathbun]

Michael,

I think that I can say everyone does appreciate your efforts. Please keep us up to date as much as possible.

-Bruce

[Jim Rhoades]

I have to second the motion for double weight.

[Michael Kadillak]

Fabulous! I am also sure that you will collaborate with the replacement manufacturer to secure a similar tonal scale to your liking. Time lines? 2006 2007?

Just curious. Is Azo a patented Kodak formula or is a silver chloride emulsion a generic known product that can easily be produced by another manufacturer? On the drawing board I see an opportunity to provide technical input as to how the paper should optimally perform by grade. Anything beyond that (additional grades or paper weights) would be icing on the cake.

If we can assist in any way or if you need financial commitments to demonstrate a market interest, please let us know. I for one want to make sure that we support your and Paula's efforts in any manner necessary.

Onward!

[Richard Årlin]

Good news.. it would have been a sad thing to start using azo only to see it disappear. By the way I was made a gift a few days back of maybe 50 lbs of photographic paper including a 250 sheet double weight 11 x 14 in grade 2 and a 100 box of normal single weight 8x10 grade 3. Since Amidol is not easily available here in Sweden I took notice of the recommendarion on the box of either Dektol or Ektaflo type 1. What about it ?

[Merg Ross]

Richard,

Some folks like the look of Azo developed in Agfa Neutol WA. In lieu of Amidol you might give it a try although nothing matches Amidol. I think Neutol might be a better choice than Dektol.

[Jay DeFehr]

If a new paper is to be manufactured form scratch, wouldn't this represent an opportunity to improve on the Azo formula, rather than just duplicate it? Shouldn't we be wishing for a paper with Azo's tonal range, but fast enought for enlarging without a special light source, wether that paper is wholly silver chloride (which it has never been clear that Azo is), or some combination of sensitizers? I wish the very best of luck to all involved in bringing a new paper to market in this financial climate.

Jay

[Dave Moeller]

Given that Azo's been around for 100 years, I doubt that patents are an issue. There might be some issues regarding duplicating the latest "improvements", but anyone can make a paper like the original Azo with impunity. (Given the change to grade 2 that occurred recently, it's entirely possible that lots of people would be happier with an older style paper.)

Thanks to Michael and Paula for all of their hard work to save Azo, and now to find another supplier for silver chloride paper.

[David A. Goldfarb]

I tried Dektol and Neutol WA before amidol, and after amidol, there was no turning back, but if you want to try Neutol WA, use the 1+7 dilution.

[Mark Sawyer]

Just out of curiousity, would it be possible/feasible to make a variable contrast silver chloride paper (Poly-Azo?) with similar aesthetics?

[Michael A.Smith]

I'll try to respond to the comments and questions.

First, thanks for the expressions of support. Paula and I are working very hard at this. We'll have enough Azo for ourselves to last us forever--we are making sure of that--but we are having this new paper made so that others can also make prints on silver chloride paper. (Just silver chloride, Jay. That's definitive and has always been definitive.)

Paula and I are attempting to have the new paper made even better than Azo. Those of you who know us personally know that we are somewhat fanatical about quality--in our prints and in our books. We don't really care how someone makes a print--platinum, Azo, enlargement, etc., as long as it is of quality. So we will not compromise on the paper to the extent that we have any say in it--and since the paper is being made to our specifications, we do have at least some say in it. How much say, we don't know, but we'll certainly do our best.

No double weight. It is almost twice as expensive for one thing, and once you get used to single-weight papers you prefer them. At least we do. But the cost alone is a more than significant issue.

No poly Azo either.

We do hope to eventually have it made in three grades (2, 3, and 4) and we plan to be able to have it made in other sizes in addition to those that are currently available. With the advent of the new enlarging light for Azo (see the comments by users of this new piece of equipment on the Azo Forum under "Enlarging on Azo" at michaelandpaula.com), we anticipate demand suffucuent to have 11x14 paper made, and perhaps other sizes as well.

[Brian Ellis]

I used Amidol for a while but didn't care for the warmish look and switched to Ilford Universal. My unscientific obsersations indicate no difference in terms of tonal separation, tonal range, detail, etc. The only difference readily observable is the more neutral look that Ilford Universal (and I suspect Dektol) produces. I think it's just a matter of taste as to print tone, if you like a warm look Amidol is fine, if you don't other developers seem work equally well.

[Charles Hohenstein]

I'm following this situation with extreme interest. It's been 30 years since I used Azo, and was about to get some, but since Michael and Paula are going to offer a replacement, perhaps I might as well wait for that instead of having to switch to it from Azo later on. No one seems to mention the contact printing paper from Bergger, which I believe was more expensive than Azo and perhaps not even sold in the U.S. Should I conclude that it was either not competitive or is no longer made?

[Michael A.Smith]

The Bergger "Contact" paper really isn't a contact printing paper. It is not a silver chloride paper. While some have made fine prints on it, it does not have the long tonal scale of Azo. It seems it was a marketing decision to call it a contact paper. They should have called it something else.

[Sidney Cammeresi]

Any idea when this new paper will be available? 2006? 2007? I'd love to get a hold of some silver chloride paper in 11x14 in as many grades as are available. (And I would have done so already if I could get it in 11x14.)

[Jim_3565]

The ultimate irony, which I for one would dearly love to see, would be for the new paper to prove superior in quality to the Azo being packaged now. Then Michael and Paula would sell off part of their lifetime supply of the inferior Azo.

I'm sure that most Azo users who have used Azo (particularly grade 2) from earlier production runs will agree that this is not such an outlandish scenario.

I can also tell those of you who don't know M&P personally that any suggestion or request viz a vis "improvements" such as double weight or VC emulsions is mere whistling in the wind. There's no doubt in my mind that nothing will divert their focus on obtaining the finest prints possible from a silver halide printing paper. That means contact prints.

[Andre Noble]

Don't you just love how the net is helping to save and improve traditional photography!

[Jan Van Hove]

I have to say, great news for all contact printers !

Keep up the amazing work you're doing, it's through passionnate people like you that traditional photography will thrive for years to come !

PJ

[Paul Metcalf]

Michael-
Your first comments confuse me:

"I spoke with Kodak today. Here is the quick version of my report:
There is plenty of Azo on hand. No one needs to panic. "

"So we are having silver chloride paper made elsewhere. There will be silver chloride paper available as long as we are around."

Are you having the Azo formula made elsewhere, or is Kodak still committed to making Azo despite their announcement to end B&W paper products?

thanks for your efforts
Paul

[Michael A.Smith]

No definitive word on when the new paper will be ready, but we will be busting our ass to have it ASAP. We are shooting to have it before the end of the year--and a lot sooner than that if at all possible.

Yes, Paul. We will be having silver chloride paper made elsewhere, not by Kodak.

[Wayne]

I'm even more confused than paul Did I miss notice of the discontinuation of Azo?

[Wayne]

Screw Kodak. They just lost my business for life-not that they still make anything I would buy anyway...

[Pablo Coronel]

Excellent!

Haven;t printed anythong on Chloride paper, but the look itself is more than worth it!