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Ted Harris
26-May-2005, 06:01
As a follow on to Steve’s post yesterday there was also a lot of discussion at the conference on 5x7 film. Steve mentioned that he told several folk that I might act as a point person for making more 5x7 available in the US.

As most of us who shoot 5x7 know both Kodak and Fuji provide many more emulsions in 5x7 and/or 13x18 than are sold through their US channels. Of course there are also emulsions available from efke, Foma and Bergger.

As Steve suggested, I am happy to act as a point person for the possible establishment of a ‘collective’ to make more of these emulsions readily available to us. I discussed just buying 13x18 film from Europe with several people but European postage costs make that highly impractical unless you are willing to buy 5 or more boxes at once; not to mention the need for 13x18 holders if you do not already own them.

Please let me hear from you if you are interested and detail the emulsions of interest (e.g. 100VS, Velvia, etc.). I will then see what I can arrange in terms of film. As far as 13x18 holders go they are available new in this country from J&C at the same cost as 5x7 holders.

Mark_3632
26-May-2005, 08:43
Delta 100, delta 100, delta 100. Did I mention I would like to see delta 100 in 5x7

QT Luong
26-May-2005, 11:33
Wasn't 5x7 film available commercially from Fuji in Japan ?

Ted Harris
26-May-2005, 12:02
QT,

5x7 Fuji is commercially available from Japan. The problem is simply that if you want to buy it one 20 sheet box at a time you eitehr need to speak Japanese well enough to deal with Japanese stores or deal with the few who deal in export. Those who export the film regularly do so at an outrageous price of $130 per box for Velvia. Sometimes Jeff at Badger and Jim at Midwest have Provia in the range of $100 for a 20 sheet box but not always and very very seldom Velvia. Contrast that to 40-50 Euros for the same emulsions in Europe in 13x18.

My hope si that if I can put together a large enough order .... say 50 or 100 boxes I can get it to us at a more reasonable cost and I'll do the work if folk are interested. Hey, I may even get the cost down to where it won't be worth your while to cut your own as I know you do now <smile>.

Oren Grad
26-May-2005, 12:14
I just checked the home-market catalog pages on the Fujifilm Japanese web site, and spotted the following current listings for 5x7:

Provia 100F
Velvia
Velvia 100F (special order)
Velvia 100 (special order)
64T Type II (special order)

Ted Harris
26-May-2005, 14:13
Oren,

Youa rwe absolutely correct. The problem is that the filmis not available in North America through normal distribution channels. Why? Two different answers:

1) According to Fuji US Senior Product and marketing people ... those who were present at the View Camera Conference last week .... the US market would not support their bringing in the film .... whenbever they have tried it sat on the slelf and went short dated .... e.g. market not large enough for them to consider. When asked how couldit be possible that the Europena market is so different and how could it be so much largr they had no answer.

2) When Fuji corporate officials were asked the same question at Photokina the gist of their answer was basically that they just were not in terested in the US market ... no further explanation.

BTW, I believe that Velvia 100 and 100F are NOT special order in 13x18 but will ahve to go look to confirm.

Oren Grad
26-May-2005, 14:58
Ted -

Yes, that's right. I thought the listing from their Japanese catalog might be of value because it probably puts limits on what would be possible here even for an independent importer. If it's not a catalog item somewhere in the world - whether Japan or Europe - I expect it would be impossible to convince Fuji to produce it at all. That's all that I had in mind - I know that the home-market stuff is not readily available here.

I think it's great that you're willing to take on a facilitator role here. As it happens, my own 5x7 needs are well served by the B&W emulsions currently available from Ilford and Kodak - FP4 Plus, HP5 Plus, TMX and TXP. My unmet needs are more in the way of odd and ultralarge formats for B&W, as discussed in the thread on larger formats that's running in parallel to this one.

But I really appreciate the effort that you and others are currently making to communicate our needs to the manufacturers and help re-establish reliable channels for obtaining quality product as the film market consolidates. Many thanks!

Oren Grad
26-May-2005, 15:11
A quick follow-up - I checked the Fujifilm global site, and all of the following emulsions are listed in 13x18cm:

Velvia
Velvia 100F
Astia 100F
Provia 100F
64TII
NPS

It certainly seems as though picking up some 13x18 holders and looking to Europe might be the best bet for these products.

Emmanuel BIGLER
26-May-2005, 15:56
Just for curiosity : what about color negative films in either 5"x7" or 13x18 ?
My understanding was that Rollei bayonet accessories in size V would soon be easier to find than 5"x7" or 13x18 color negs ;-);-)

Oren Grad
26-May-2005, 16:13
The only color negative films I'm aware of are Fuji NPS in 13x18 as noted above, and Kodak 160NC in 5x7. Slim pickings...

Robert A. Zeichner
26-May-2005, 16:31
T-Max 100,
T-Max 400,
Delta 100,
Delta 400,
EPR

Ted Harris
26-May-2005, 17:33
Nord Foto in Germany lists the following as currently in stock and available:

Black & White ...

AGFA Pan APX 100 13x18 25 Sheets
KODAK T-Max 100 13x18 50 Sheets

Color Negative ...

KODAK Portra 100 T 13x18 10 Sheets

Color Positive ...

AGFA RSX 100 13x18 10 Sheets **11/04 (I bought 15 boxes of this film several months ago and it is excellent value if you like the film. It is nice saturated colors and somewhat warm, I have also used it in 120/220 and 8x10 don’t really know how to compare it to any kodak or Fuji emulsion)
FUJI Provia 100 F 13x18 10 Sheets
FUJI Velvia 100F 13x18 10 Sheets
FUJI Velvia 50 13x18 10 Sheets
KODAK E 100G 13x18 10 Sheets
KODAK E 100VS 13x18 10 Sheets
KODAK EPP 100 13x18 10 Sheets
KODAK EPR 64 13x18 10 Sheets
KODAK EPY 64T 13x18 10 Sheets
KODAK Duplicating EDUPE 13x18 10 Sheets

To give you some price ideas all of the color films run around $50 to $58 + shipping. As mentioned in my initial post shipping starts to get reasonable if you are shipping large quantities. For example from Germany to the US via DHL standard air services you pay 35 Euros for 5 kilos.

Nord is not necessarily the least expensive either ... just an idea of what is available on the retail market.

Also, following up on a lead from the Fuji US’ film product manager I contacted his counterpart at Fuji Hawaii (a separate company from Fuji US). He promised to email me early next week with prices and minimum quantities for all of the emulsions Fuji produces in 5x7. Once we know (or if we know) it is available to them in Hawaii we will worry about how to get it to me .... he thinks he can sell to me direct since Fuji USA doesn’t sell this stuff. If not I can go through several contacts I have in Hawaii.

Finally I may be able to lay my hands on some used 13x18 holders for anyone who is interested. Again, shipping is the kicker in the price and thus cost will depend on how many we get. They will be in the range of half the new cost including shipping and are plastic with the newer style plastic pulls on the darkslide. Please contact me offlist if you are interested and I will see what we can do.

Kevin Klazek
26-May-2005, 19:14
I shoot Delta 100 in 4x5. I am just getting into 5x7 so would like to see it in 5x7 also.

Isaac Crawford
26-May-2005, 19:37
Just FYI, J and C photo sells new 13x18 film holders.

Isaac

QT Luong
26-May-2005, 19:50
I am wondering why Fuji films imported from Japan are so expensive. About half a decade ago, I bought many boxes of 5x7 Velvia over the counter at Yodobashi in Tokyo (I do not speak Japanese), and if I remember well, the price was quite comparable to what B&H charged before it was discontinued. On the other hand, price of film in France always had me sticker-shocked.

BTW, I certainly applaud the efforts you are making for the community, but personally, I am done with buying film for the next few years (my cost per sheet of 5x7 is about 30 cents, which I think would be pretty hard to beat with fresh film, and when I am not out of practice, I cut down 50 sheets of 8x10 in an hour).

Stephen Willard
27-May-2005, 00:15
Ted, I would love 5x7 Kodak VC 160 color negative film. Currently, I am cutting it from 8x10 and it is something I do not enjoy doing. So press the flesh and make some magic, and you will be my new best friend.

Mark_3632
27-May-2005, 09:43
QT,

Market availability decides the price. If you are the only game in town and people need your service you can charge whatever someone is willing to pay.

Christian Marquess
27-May-2005, 11:45
I'd like to see Kodak bring back T-Max 400 in 5x7. Fat chance that will happen...but one can always hope.

Jim Grimes
15-Jul-2007, 13:27
Please let me hear from you if you are interested and detail the emulsions of interest (e.g. 100VS, Velvia, etc.). I will then see what I can arrange in terms of film. As far as 13x18 holders go they are available new in this country from J&C at the same cost as 5x7 holders.

Ted, I would be interested in a group purchase of 13x18cm film for my 5x7 Kodak 2D. I just picked up some holders and am ready to go.

What was the website you told me about at the View Camera Conference workshop? I believe you said www.noad.de and I tried it, but it did not work.

James

Dave Aharonian
15-Jul-2007, 17:01
I would love to get my hands on some colour neg film - preferably Fuji 160 Pro-S but Kodak would be fine too. I aquired a few boxes of Kodak Tmax 400 from Rob Skeoch in Toronto but it seems to be gone now. I'd like to get more of it but I'm not even sure if its being manufactured any longer.

Ted Harris
15-Jul-2007, 17:20
Jim, www.nordphoto.de; right now thwy are showing E100G, EPP, EPR, Provia, Delta 100 and FP4 in stock. There is also a Swiss dealer with a good selection ... it was posted on a recent thread; anyone remember? I believe thy were ready to special order 160.

Emmanuel BIGLER
16-Jul-2007, 02:12
Ted
The Swiss dealer who has offered his services fo 5x7" on special order is probably :

http://www.ars-imago.ch/

Gudmundur Ingolfsson
16-Jul-2007, 03:11
I am desperate for either 5x7" or 13x18cm color negative film. B&H still list Portra 160 NC 5x7"(50 sheets) and they quote a price of $186.95 but the minimum order is 80 boxes and delivering time is two to ten weeks. I have been trying Fuji here in Iceland but 13x18 cm Pro 160S has been discontinued. I have been calling labs in Germany and swiss lab and a dealer without any luck. They say though that I am one of many looking for this film. Would it not be possible to convince some nice dealer or a lab in the US to organize this. I would be an eager supporter but my geographical location (in Iceland ) is somewhat of an hinderance. But anyone that can organize 5 ( @ 50 sheets) boxes will have my Visa number.

Ted Harris
16-Jul-2007, 04:10
LOLOL ... what B&H is probably doing is taking advantage of Kodak's "minimum order" policy where Kodak will cut any filmmanufactured to any size requested with a minimum order (to them) of $10,000 from an established dealer. They are then taking a nice markup.

I have offered in the past to work with Midwest Photo or Badger to assist thrm in putting together and placing such an order but no takers. Let me know if there is interest and I will talk with Kodak and then Jim or Jeff and see waht price we get to the end user.

Gudmundur Ingolfsson
16-Jul-2007, 06:06
The ideal thing would be to convince Kodakto split up this minimum order between the 5x7" and the European equivalent 13x18cm and offer some labs that also sell film to order or advertise this. Or at least to look for subscribers on both sides of the Atlantic. There is a lab in Dusseldorf (HSL) where the "strufskyes" have their
C-41 processed and they have no more 13x18 cm film to offer.

Jim Grimes
23-Jul-2007, 18:40
Jim, www.nordphoto.de; right now thwy are showing E100G, EPP, EPR, Provia, Delta 100 and FP4 in stock. There is also a Swiss dealer with a good selection ... it was posted on a recent thread; anyone remember? I believe thy were ready to special order 160.

Ted,

I tried this link and a few variations of it and it isn't working. Any ideas?

James

jshanesy
23-Jul-2007, 19:57
Where can I get 13x18cm holders in the US? B&H sells my favorite emulsion (Ektachrome 64T) in that size here in the US, but not 5x7. Don't ask me why not. If I had the holders I'd buy a few boxes in a heartbeat.

PaulBremer
24-Jul-2007, 01:54
Ted,

I tried this link and a few variations of it and it isn't working. Any ideas?

James

It is www.nordfoto.de

regards,
Paul

Ted Harris
24-Jul-2007, 04:25
Thnks Paul ..... sorry James

eddie
24-Jul-2007, 05:27
my wife speaks, reads and writes japanese very well.


let me know if we can help.

eddie

Jim Grimes
24-Jul-2007, 06:32
Where can I get 13x18cm holders in the US? B&H sells my favorite emulsion (Ektachrome 64T) in that size here in the US, but not 5x7. Don't ask me why not. If I had the holders I'd buy a few boxes in a heartbeat.

I just got five, in two separate auctions, off ebay for about $15.00 each. If you get on German ebay, there are quite a few film holders in the metric sizes listed.

James

Jim Grimes
24-Jul-2007, 06:38
It is www.nordfoto.de

regards,
Paul

The link worked. Thanks Paul; thanks Ted. Now, all I have to do is to navigate through the German language site. I see they have Fuji Provia available in 13x18. Is their price, in Euros, competitive?

James

Ted Harris
24-Jul-2007, 07:06
Their price in Euros works out to somewhat less than you would pay for 5x7 from Badger (but not much less) and Luftpost charges may kill you unless you are buying in quantity, they are high for overseas shipping. The Kodak flavors that are available are more interesting since none of that film is available in 5x7, period.

Ole Tjugen
24-Jul-2007, 08:35
Nordfoto has a minimum order of €200 per order outside Germany. Unfortunately (?) I don't find this difficult at all, although I now have enough APX100 in 6.5x9, 9x12 and 13x18 to last me a while. And all I really wanted was 20 sheets of 13x18 EPP...

Ted Harris
24-Jul-2007, 08:59
LOLOL ... Ole I found that out last year when I first used them.

To all, I am working on a deal to get a large quantity of 5x7 Fuji Film (Provia,Velvia, NC160, Astia) if there is sufficient interest in buying it. Details in a new thread.

Nick_3536
24-Jul-2007, 10:10
Could some body who reads German give me an idea how much NordFoto charges for shipping within Europe?

Ole Tjugen
24-Jul-2007, 10:20
Could some body who reads German give me an idea how much NordFoto charges for shipping within Europe?


Bei Lieferungen au&#223;erhalb Deutschlands berechnen wir stets die tats&#228;chlich anfallenden Versandkosten (= 18,39 EUR Basis-Preis + 1,16 EUR pro Kilo Warengewicht). Ausgenommen davon sind lediglich schwere Ger&#228;te oder gro&#223;e Warenmengen, die per Spedition versendet werden m&#252;ssen. F&#252;r diese berechnen wir stets die tats&#228;chlich anfallenden Frachtkosten.

EUR 18.39, plus EUR 1.16 per kilogram (I believe this is within EU). Very heavy orders are shipped in a different way, with different prices.

Nick_3536
24-Jul-2007, 10:22
I just hope the quote is in English then :D