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John Dey
9-Jan-2017, 08:55
Iíve recently aquired a Sinar P. Iíve worked with view cameras for over 20 years but have no experience with Sinar shutters. Can someone explain how Sinar shutters work and their history? [yes i know how to use Google etcÖ] I plan to use the camera for close-up tabletop work. At present I am using a 150mm Ronar in a Copal 0 shutter. The Ronar is very sharp and works great for closeup work. The coverage is not an issue since the bellows is typically at 300mm or more. But the Ronar is f9 and with the large bellow produces a very dim image on the ground glass. I own a 150mm f5.6 Rodagon enlarging lens I would like to try this since it is faster. My only requirement for a shutter is to trigger studio lights. An old Packard with one speed would meet all my needs.

Bob Salomon
9-Jan-2017, 09:32
Then for best results you will need to reverse mount your enlarging lens and block the illuminated aperture port on the bottom of the lens.

Peter De Smidt
9-Jan-2017, 09:33
Sinar Copal shutters been around for a long time, as there's a Norma version. So the oldest is greenish, i.e. the Norma generation, and the newer ones are black. With the black ones, one had a maximum f/stop of f/5.6 and another f/4. I have one of the black f/5.6 models. They attach behind the front standard carrier frame. So you remove the bellows from the front standard, attach the shutter, and then attach the bellows to the shutter. The rear cell of lenses needs to stop just in front of the blades to maximize coverage. To do that, you can use DB mounts, or you can DIY, building a spacer on a lens board to put the lens at the right depth. There are two cables for the latter ones: a very long throw shutter release, and a cable that connects to the back. The back cable allows the lens to be at max aperture for viewing, and then it stops down to the taking aperture when a film holder is inserted into the camera. I don't use this, but it could be handy in a high volume environment. The shutter release cable is proprietary and expensive. Don't but a shutter without one. The shutters go from 8 seconds to about 1/60th, and there's bulb. Some people claim that the shutter vibrates a lot. Others say it doesn't matter. They have a noticeably softer release on the 'B' setting. I like mine a lot. I use it mainly in the studio. Maybe I've had lemons, but my Packards have never been as reliable.

Amedeus
9-Jan-2017, 13:29
I second Peter here. I have 3 mechanical Sinar Copal shutters and 2 electric Sinar shutters and they are workhorses. Make sure you get the release cable. You can adopt these shutters with some work to other camera systems.

I only use Packard shutters when I need an aperture > 3".

YMMV,

Cheers,

Rudi A.


Sinar Copal shutters been around for a long time, as there's a Norma version. So the oldest is greenish, i.e. the Norma generation, and the newer ones are black. With the black ones, one had a maximum f/stop of f/5.6 and another f/4. I have one of the black f/5.6 models. They attach behind the front standard carrier frame. So you remove the bellows from the front standard, attach the shutter, and then attach the bellows to the shutter. The rear cell of lenses needs to stop just in front of the blades to maximize coverage. To do that, you can use DB mounts, or you can DIY, building a spacer on a lens board to put the lens at the right depth. There are two cables for the latter ones: a very long throw shutter release, and a cable that connects to the back. The back cable allows the lens to be at max aperture for viewing, and then it stops down to the taking aperture when a film holder is inserted into the camera. I don't use this, but it could be handy in a high volume environment. The shutter release cable is proprietary and expensive. Don't but a shutter without one. The shutters go from 8 seconds to about 1/60th, and there's bulb. Some people claim that the shutter vibrates a lot. Others say it doesn't matter. They have a noticeably softer release on the 'B' setting. I like mine a lot. I use it mainly in the studio. Maybe I've had lemons, but my Packards have never been as reliable.

Bernice Loui
10-Jan-2017, 01:41
Been using a Sinar shutter for about three decades, they are reliable, repeatable and accurate enough. Once a Sinar shutter has been purchased, it is prudent to have it cleaned, lubed adjusted by a qualified individual. Once the shutter has been made known good, they tend to stay that way for years.

To prevent the hard kick when the shutter closes, hold down the cable release for the entire duration of the exposure time. If the shutter is released, letting go of the shutter release before the entire shutter cycle time has completed will result in significant kick from the shutter. The shutter kick does not appear to have any effect on image sharpness.


Bernice

Daniel Unkefer
10-Jan-2017, 07:09
^^^ Agree with all above. I own three of the green Norma Mechanical Shutters, and five or six of the Norma release cables, and have used them around the studio for 30+ years. I've never produced an unsharp negative or chrome due to shutter vibration. Not an issue for me.

I also use the Norma cables on my three Plaubel Makiflex cameras. A machinist friend made threaded adapters to fit the sockets of the Makiflexes.

petervd
21-Feb-2017, 03:47
Hi,

I have a nice Sinar P set here. But, I think there is a issue with the shutter?
It hasn't been used for 10+ years, before that heavy (studio) use by a professional.
The issue is that the releasing the shutter is extremely heavy. I found this thread, and opened up the cover. A tiny drop of watch oil in the release cable got rid of a lot of tension. A tiny drop in the sliding mechanism got rid of friction feeling when the shutter is in Bulb.
But, when I set the timer to 1/60th (or any other) it's so heavy I have to put quite some force with my thumb to get the ring going round till the end. I've looked carefully, it doesn't seem to damage anything.
I can't figure out where the friction comes from. I've put a couple of tiny drops of watch oil around the ring, that doesn't change anything. It could be the spring that seems quite tense already in 'rest' position, but that would mean it's supposed to be this heavy?

I can't imagine this to be the case, would it?

Here is a short video.
There is no 'thingy' on the thumb-side of the release cable so I'm using a coin now, otherwise it really hurts my thumbs. Actually I wouldn't be able to do it, that much force is needed.

https://youtu.be/m9g8pwtzixg

I hope somebody here can help figuring out if or what the problem is, thanks!!

Peter

rdenney
21-Feb-2017, 13:33
The heavy actuation is normal, near as I can tell. It's a large shutter and the cable release is cocking it before releasing it (one reason the throw is so long). I'm not sure a video of mine would look any different. Hold the cable with a 180-degree bend so that hand motion can't be translated to the camera easily.

But you can also have it serviced, as Bernice suggested.

Rick "who bought his responding to a unique buying opportunity, with the ultimate intent of using it with a 30mm fisheye" Denney