Jobo developer system

[Varakan Ten Tipprapa]

Hey everyone,

I've been taking B&W picture by 4x5 for couple years now it's the time to change my process system from Yankee tank to something better.

Please anyone give me more advices, by far I've been checking from many webs. My final choice will go for Jobo system. I checked they have two or three Jobo system..What’s the difference? It's difficult to handle? Will be any problem if I will buy the pre-owner one?

Thank you very much for your time.
10.

[Bruce Watson]

I've been using a CPP-2 with an expert 3010 tank for several years now, mostly Tri-X in XTOL 1:3. An excellent system for B&W, which gives me perfectly processed negatives.

I think the Jobo website (http://www.jobo-usa.com/products/processor_comparison.htm) gives a pretty good comparison of the various systems. Notice that if you want to use the expert series drums (and you do want that, trust me on this), you need either the CPA-2 or the CPP-2. Of these, the CPP-2 has a digital temperature controller and a cold water inlet (useful if your cold water source is cooler than the 20C most often used for B&W processing).

Other than that, you will want to get the lift. The lift makes pour in and pour out much easier. Either of these units, with a lift, is just amazingly easy to use. I think you'll be pleased. I know I am.

[Bob Douglas]

Varakan,



If you are looking at used ones be aware that JOBO has modified the motors and the spin rates over the years to handle the larger Expert Drums. BTW IMHO they are the only way to go for large format film processing. The JOBO website (http://www.jobo-usa.com/index1.html) has all the info on the changes.

There are times when you might want to consider having the Rotation Motor Circuit upgraded in your CPP-2 or CPA-2 Motor Unit. The strength of the circuit depends upon the manufacturing date of your processor. Newer systems like the 3000 series EXPERT Drums, have necessitated the need for increased strength in the Rotation Motor Circuit. You may want to consider upgrading the Rotation Motor Circuit if you experience the rotation speed of the tank or drum being sluggish or seem to struggle with heavier loads. The 3000 series EXPERT Drums create the heaviest possible load for the rotation motor circuit.

Serial number identification (http://www.jobo-usa.com/bulletins/b019.htm)

Also be aware that the lfts were improved over time. The latest version of the lift has improvements in the tank coupling system. You can identify the version you have by examining the tank retention clips (they hold the lid's cog gear to the lift). The current version has black, horizontally aligned clips. The earlier version has white, vertically aligned clips. Both versions work well in holding the tank to the lift. The newer version allows an easier method of replacement for these clips, in the event of a failure.

In addition to the clips design, the method of tank coupling selection has been changed. The earlier version used a sliding set of pins, that traveled in a diagonal slot, to change from the upper and lower coupling position. The newer version has a red, bell shaped cap, that is transferred from one coupling position to the other instead of the sliding pins.

Lift improvements (http://www.jobo-usa.com/instructions/instructions_manual_cpa-2_cpp-2_lift.htm)

Good luck!

-bob

[Jim Davies]

Hi,
I bought a secondhand basic unit (without the lift). A modern tank and 5x4 reel cost almost as much as the basic processor and I was not overly impressed with the quality. A little bit of work was required to correct various errors, but now eighteen months on the unit has performed flawlessly.
I set up the system to develop film only, and when complete empty the water and store the processor dry. The unit does seem to work very well, just be careful to syphon out the water before moving the bath.
Loading the film onto the reel (without the expensive loader) is nailbiting initially, Once you realise the reel is flimsey and hold it by the centre core life gets easier. I'm very pleased with my negatives and repeatability, only pictorial content is missing.

[Michael Kadillak]

Great advice from previous respondants.

I would add that while the JOBO Expert drums are truly engineering marvels (the 3010 that will process up to 10 sheets of 4x5 film in a run), each sheet will get exactly the same development per run. If you have the volume, then you will be extremely pleased with the system albeit high priced.

Conventional rotary activity is clearly not the ticket for compensating development for controlling high contrast scenes via highly dilute developers although I guess you could use the drums themselves separate from the processor.

While I have used a JOBO CPP2 for the last five years (and will probably continue to do so), I find myself tray developing my films more often the last year as it provides me a faster and more flexible result with variable Zone system requirements. In other words, I can develop up to 12 sheets of film from 4x5 to 8x10 at a time with N-, N and N+ objectives and with the assistance of infrared goggles to not only identify the individual exposure while they are fresh in my head but qualify the extent of the desired development and "pull" it from the developer and set it in the stop tray when I want. This takes away any variables associated with shutter speed or f-stop errors among the older or newer shutters and/or lenses I may want to use.

At the end of the day it is all about results and many seasoned professionals such as Ron Rosenstock continue to tray develop their films because it simply works and you probably already have the components to kick it in gear. Just an alternative perspective to consider.

Cheers!

[Richard Littlewood]

I've got a flimsier CPE-2. If you overlook the 'lightweight' appearance it's not a bad processor. I've put hundreds of sheets through mine without a cock up, 12 or 6 sheets per cycle, 700 0r 350 ml of chemicals, stable temp, reels and tanks OK - although I had to glue little plastic 'pips' at strategic places on the spirals to keep the film away from the spiral surface. I used to curse edge build up, now the negs are almost as good as I'll get. Select a developer ( pyro perhaps - I use, and am happy with ID-11) and there's no looking back!
If you have the cash go for a more 'pro' model, but dont be afraid of the lesser models - although I wouldn't get one without the lift.

[Ted Harris]

All of the posts to-date have concentrated on the 'manual' Jobo processors and they are fine machines. However, if you are primarily interested in processing sheet film in the expert drums remember that the entry level machine, the CPE, will not handle these drums. Second, for total consistency and maximum time savings you should also look at the automated processors. These are the ATL 2200, 2300, 2400 and 2500. New, they are all vastly more expensive than the manual machines but on the used market often bring only marginally more than the manual machines and sometimes even less. If you decide to shop for one of these remember that most of them came out of professional/commercial labs and may have had a lot heavier use than many of the CPP's you see for sale. OTOH they are likely to have been well maintained. The biggest plus of the ATL series machines is that you set the program you want to run (either a pre-installed program or one you customize to the times and temperatures you prefer) push the start button and come back later. Today, with many labs finding that their consumer clients have gone all or mostly digital there are more and more of these machines coming onto the market.

Older Jobo ATL machines are also worth considering with some caveats. The original ATL was simply a CPP with a different, automated head slapped on the machine and the next version, the ATL 2 was quite similar. None of the automated parts for either machine are available from Jobo today. The first of the 'modern' series of ATL machines (again excluding the ATL 1000/1500, 500 and 800 which do not handle expert drums) was the ATL 2 Plus which was followed by the ATL 2000. The 2000 was replaced by the current series around 1997-1998 as I recall. There was also the ATL 3 which was basically replaced by the 2400/2500 in the current series (all three of these machines are very large and I have even seen them being given away if you would remove them). All the machines from the ATL 2 Plus forward are solid performers as long as they are in good shape.

You will find the Jobo technical support guys among the most knowledgeable and helpful in the industry. They will spend as much time as necessary with you discussing your needs and the relative merits of one machine v. another. They will also be happy to help you walk through the possible issues with a specific used machine.

Jobo, however, is not the only manufacturer of tube/rotary processors worth considering. Both Wing-Lynch and PhotoTherm make excellent machines easily the equal of the Jobo machines. They are harder to find and hard to get parts for though. Finally while a number of the models manufactured by Wing-Lynch and PhotoTherm are the equal of or superior to comparable Jobo models the companies do not provide the ease of access to or level of technical support that you will get from Jobo.

[Donald Hutton]

Ted

I can't comment on Wing Lynch, but the tech support at Phototherm is at least as good as Jobo - in fact, I have found them easier to access as well. I use a Jobo CPP for the expert drum compatability, but if I was just looking for a unit to do E-6, I'd get a phototherm on the second hand market. Anyone who has owned one will tell you that they are a great company to do business with.

[Varakan Ten Tipprapa]

Thank you very much for all helpful opinios. I'll decide to buy it so soon. I may decide to CPP-2 to fit with my cost. Thans you guys again.

10.

[Ted Harris]

Don,

Good news regarding Phototherm tech support and I must confess that myt experience with them is very limited. I can tell you that Wing-Lynch has fine tech support when you can get there but it is a bit sketchy as photo processors are barely still a part of their corporate business.

[ZoneIII]

"While I have used a JOBO CPP2 for the last five years (and will probably continue to do so), I find myself tray developing my films more often the last year as it provides me a faster and more flexible result with variable Zone system requirements. In other words, I can develop up to 12 sheets of film from 4x5 to 8x10 at a time with N-, N and N+ objectives and with the assistance of infrared goggles to not only identify the individual exposure while they are fresh in my head but qualify the extent of the desired development and "pull" it from the developer and set it in the stop tray when I want. This takes away any variables associated with shutter speed or f-stop errors among the older or newer shutters and/or lenses I may want to use."

For the same reasons you do, I prefer to tray develop my large format b&w film. However, it is incorrect to say that your development by inspection method "takes away any variables associated with shutter speed or f-stop errors." I'm actually suprised that you said that As you know, development times (and that is what you are adjusting with your development by inspection method) have virtually no effect on exposure. It only affects contrast which has nothing to do with your your f-stop/shutter speed (exposure) settings. Sure, you could increase the low densities slightly but, by doing so, you would greatly increase the contrast as well. If your exposure is off, you can't do much if anything to correct it while processing the film.