Tetenal 3-bath E6 kit and Velvia 100F sheets

[Richard Abrahamsson]

Im trying to gain confidence to do my first E6 development and this with Fuji Velvia 100F 4x5" sheet film. However I am uncertain how to choose processing time.

I will be doing my E6 in a Cibachrome drum for 8x10 sheets. Where minimum of 75ml and maximum of 100ml of chemistry can be used. I've used this for B/W development before and used constant manual rolling agitation in a waterbath. If being carefull 2 sheets can be processed simultaneously (there is no separator for 4x5" sheets).

Listed time for first developer is, if 500ml solution is used:

6'15" for first two rolls, 6'30" for the next two rolls and 6'45" for last two rolls¨

And if 1000ml solution is used:

the same times but using four rolls instead of two in the tank each run.

Can I assume linearity, extrapolate and use the same times using 100ml of solution each run and with sheet film corresponding to the same emulsion area as 2/(500ml/100ml)=4/(1000ml/100ml)=0.4 rolls of film and do 3 runs before disposing the chemicals? Similarly for the other baths. I guess I could use one-shot chemicals but also the chemistry is expensive in Sweden.

What is the area of a 36 frame 135 film or a 120-film? I remember T-max RS used an equivalence of 1 roll of either 135 or 120 film corresponded to one 8x10" sheet in the replenishment rates. Can I assume the same here?

What is the rotation rate of rotary development systems that I'll try to mimic?

Lastly, I've heard somewhere that Fuji films should use extended development times in Tetenal 3-bath E6 kit as compared to Kodak films? Can anyone confirm or dismiss this? I guess it is reasonable to do this kind of pushprocessing for Velvia 50 which by many are rated lower than 50 but I've been told that Velvia 100F is truly a iso 100 film. Anyone tried this combination of Tetenal 3-bath E6 and Velvia 100F in particular and can share their findings?

Again I could try and see but I am trying to gain that extra confidence before starting and sheet color transparancy film and E6 chemistry is quite expensive so I'd prefer getting it right the first time. I am so looking forward to watching that first 4x5" slide on the lighttable.

Thanks,

Richard

[mark anderson]

can't help with the rotary processing as i have only done 36mm in small tanks. fuji films require you to ad 16% to your first developer time.

[Eric Jones]

All fuji films require 16% more time in the first developer with Tetenal Chemicals EXCEPT Astia. I toasted a whole batch 1-stop this way. I read it on the Tetenal web site after the fact when troubleshooting, it was not in the original instructions. This has nothing to do with 100F but hey, I thought I would throw it out there and always check those websites for updates.

[Paul Metcalf]

Richard-
You can linearly interpolate the amount of chemical/film quantity, as long as you have enough to cover the film adequately, which is a function of the tank. One thing I've find, however, is that running a batch of chemicals, independant of the film quantity, will accelerate the oxidation of the first developer, so you have to keep track of the number of runs per batch of chemicals. I use the Jobo 4x5 reel/tank system, which handles 6 sheets at a time. I get four cycles out this as follows: 1st run with 270ml (to cover film), mix this back with rest of chemicals, 2nd run with 270ml, mix back with rest of chemicals, 3rd run with 270 ml, add enough of this to the remaining batch (which is around 200ml for the first developer as the dry film absorbs some for each run) to make 270ml and make 4th run. This covers a box of readyloads, and has been consistent for me. I've also substituted roll film in place of each sheet film run in quantities per the Tetenal instructions, but have never exceeded the total number of cycles. The only real answer to this will be through testing which is expensive, but so are lost picture opportunities.

[Paul Metcalf]

I need to add that I seperate the liter Tetenal kit into two 500ml batches, so I can get two readyload boxes developed.

Haven't done 100F, but I shoot Velvia 50 at 40 ASA and process same as Kodak's film (per instructions).

For me, 2 rolls of 36 frame 35mm film equals 6 sheets of 4x5. I rarely have more than one 120 roll film to develop, so that consumes one of the chemical cycles described in previous post.

I bank my color film development until I have enough to make best use of chemicals. Sometimes that takes several months, so I'm not on anyone's schedule except mine!

Don't know about rotation rate, but my guess is that avoiding any rotation method that creates constant flow is desireable. Probably just easily rolling on flat surface back and forth far enough to overlap is sufficient. I'd be more worried about keeping temperature up and within range specified.

Good luck.

[mark blackman]

First off, I always develop Fuji film for 7:30 minutes (at 38 Centigrade) in my Jobo processor when using the tetenal 3 bath chemicals. I use 500ml when running 6 5x4 sheets or 1 litre for 5 10x8 sheets. Then I dump the chemicals. I really do not understand why anyone tries to cut corners and save a few quid on film processing, given the overall cost of LF. Work out the cost of your camera, lens, tripod, meter, film, filters, holders - the price of transport and your own time when taking a shot. A 5 litre kit of the 3 bath E6 costs me £55, sufficient to process 25 sheets of 5x4 (so 50p a sheet). A day off work means £250 of lost earnings, I challenge anyone to shoot 500 useful images in a day!

[Donald Qualls]

Well, since no one else has answered this part:

A single 135-36 or 120 roll is about the same area as an 8x10 sheet or four 4x5 sheets. If you'd normally use 500 ml for two rolls, that's calling for 250 ml for one, or about 64 ml for a single 4x5.

[Larry Gebhardt]

Mark, I reuse the chemicals because I have tested it and I see no difference between the first set and the last. I tested by taking two identical shots and doing one in the first batch and the second in the third batch, all using the max film in a liter (12 4x5 sheets per run). I couldn't tell the two appart when they were done, so that is why I try to save a few quid.

Also, your price is for 4x5, but the quantity should be for 8x10 from your description. From your description you should get 60 sheets of 4x5, not 25.

[Richard Abrahamsson]

I think I got a plan now.

The one litre kit is good for 12 rolls in total (with three runs, each of 4 films in one litre or alternatively three runs, each of 2 films in 500ml but times two) which corresponds to 48 sheets of 4x5", hence 1/48 litre=20.8ml per sheet of total capacity. Hence if I load my cibachrome drum with two sheets and 4x20.8=84ml I should be able to reuse that chemistry once (with prolonged development ofcourse) without exhausting the developer more than I would do in the recomended three runs with roll film. Staying with two runs per 84ml chemicals is probably good from an oxidizations point of view as well.

The remaining thing to worry about is now how to keep the temperature constant, but that is something I can test and practice without film and water instead of chemicals.

Thank you all for your input, Cheers,

Richard (who photographs on weekends and hollidays only)

[Richard Abrahamsson]

Ha that was some great fun. Looking at a 4x5" transparancy on the light table is impressive. Heres a link to a scan of the resulting first test shot:

http://www.fotosidan.se/gallery/viewlarge.htm?ID=352928&target=_blank

Thanks again for your help. I'll definately will keep at least one of my film holders loaded with slide film in the future in case I come across a great color motiv.

Cheers,

Richard

[zone]

Hallo, sorry for my english...
I'm going to e6 develope with tetenal 3 bath, today the first process develope.
I've developed 2 dia sheet film (astia 100) but no good, there is a strong green tint.
I've developed with a jobo cpe, and i read on the tetenal user manual: "for rotary machine increase temp to 39C and time to 7 min. In many posts i read for Fuji film slide increase time to 16% for 8.12 min total. This is correct?
Thanks!

[Lachlan 717]

A 5 litre kit of the 3 bath E6 costs me £55, sufficient to process 25 sheets of 5x4 (so 50p a sheet).

Um, not in the world of mathematics.

£55/25 sheets = £2.20

[kleinbatavia]

I routinely develop 4x5 provia and velvia in tetenal kits. Depending on conditions and requirements, I shoot quite a few sheets, but work with one later kits to keep everything as fresh as possible. I always het 36 sheets done with a struggle to get an additional 6 sheets at longer times. To be clear, I mix the chemicals and use them the same day in my jobo drums and tbe2. To prevent any issues, I now discard chemicals after 36 sheets and mix a new liter batch.