Fujinon 600mm C f11.5 vs. Red Dot Artar 600mm Leses on 8x10?

[neil poulsen]

What differences in performance, effective apertures, etc., might one expect between a Fujinon 600 Compact f11.5 and a Goerz Red Dot Artar 600mm (mounted in a shutter) when used on an 8x10.

For example, the Fujinon will have a larger image circle, but as a practical matter, does this really matter for 8x10?

I know that the Goerz lens is optimized for shorter distances, so what aperture must one use on a Red Dot Artar for acceptable sharpness at infinity, assuming that the negative might be enlarged to 2x to 3x the negative size?

[Luis-F-S]

As a practical matter for 8x10: No. Use f22 on the Artar unless you need more DOF.

[Ken Lee]

Lenses of symmetrical design like the Artar are reputed to hold their correction at all distances. Mine does.

When in doubt, inspect the image on the ground glass with a loupe. Rotate the aperture and watch the resolution reach its peak and then decline as diffraction sets in. For mine, f/19 is the best: between 16 and 22, but either of those two are great.

The Fujinon C has more modern lens coatings. Even so, with long lenses - and the long bellows which accompany them - a lens shade is always helpful to keep the low values clear of flair.

[StoneNYC]

I can't report on the Artar mounted in shutter as mine is not mounted but I use it with a Sinar-Copal so it still works at full aperture.

Really do need a dedicated mounting flange for it as it's just in one of those universal iris'

Anyway with 8x10 it's really hard to compare them, the C is just SO SMALL and light compared to the beast of the RD ARTAR to me there's no contest just on weight alone you're working habits change, you need a stronger front standard and larger mounting board (the 600 C fits on a Technika board, the 24" RD Artar I THINK needs a 5 size shutter right? Or does it fit in a copal 3?

Either way there are weight issues to consider, you're already racking the bellows way out so added front weight means more chance of vibration from any wind. Both lenses are fairly sharp so it's more of a contrast difference. And a price difference of course the artars are plentiful and cheap, the C's are NOT.

[David Lindquist]

Yes, back when C.P. Goerz American Optical Co./Goerz Optical Company Inc. sold the 24 inch Red Dot Artar mounted in a shutter they used the No. 5 Ilex. SK Grimes's website shows that they have shoe-horned this lens in to a No. 3 Copal but at a loss of a third of an f-stop so the maximum aperture would be f/12.5 rather than f/11.
David

[neil poulsen]

Thanks for the information. It sounds like there's not much difference optically. But, the difference in weight makes a difference.

[Daniel Stone]

You won't see a difference, unless you need to do 12" of rise for an architectural shot (on 8x10). The extra image circle of the Fuji will be helpful here, in this case. In 95% of photographs made, the 24" RDA will provide more than enough IC for 8x10.

The RDA will weigh more(especially in a brass barrel(some later ones were housed in aluminum barrels)). But c'mon; you're shooting 8x10, you want extra ballast to help keep the camera steady ;)

I had a 24" RDA in a Copal 3, and it was a beautiful marriage of the two. The Ilex shutters are great, but personally I preferred the Copal operation-wise.

YMMV

-Dan