View Full Version : Wista RF/SP/VX comparison- Is there something I'm missing?
senderoaburrido
7-Apr-2016, 10:24
So I've read the spec sheets for each, and here is what I understand - RF & SP have the micro-movements in the back, the RF has a rangefinder unit embedded in it, and the VX is stripped of everything but the necessities. Now, I want to make the jump to a technical camera for the sake of portability. I've been looking at the Toyo 45A, and the Wista series. The latter seems to accommodate more movements than the Toyo, and so I'm leaning towards it. RF's are outside my budget, but I've seen a few SP completed sales from months ago that are juuuuust within my budget.
Although I'd like an SP, I'm wondering if the micro-focusing back is worth the addition of somewhere between two and four hundred US dollars. There are dirt cheap VX's out there, and I'd be completely satisfied with one if it turned out that the micro-focusing wasn't that important. Is there anything I missed? If the RF or SP have extra movements, like drop where the other two don't, then I may just have to go back to saving. In fact, the presence of drop is confusing. None of the spec sheets say it has front drop, though one page mentioned that you can "drop out" the bottom. Can someone please elaborate on that?
All the Wista cameras should have from drop.
Drop the bed and tilt the lens panel back to make it parallel to the back, use the rise to position the lens.
As far as usefulness of the micro-focus, that depends on the type of photography you do.
Hope that helps
senderoaburrido
7-Apr-2016, 11:20
As far as usefulness of the micro-focus, that depends on the type of photography you do.
Hope that helps
I assume that would be more important for macro, as tiny movements can significantly shift the depth of field forward or backward. Is that correct? To be frank, I don't understand what the spec sheets mean by "micro-focus". If I wanted to shift the depth of field, I could just as easily move the front standard a smidge back or forward, no?
I'm looking for a jack of all trades that is portable. I do portraiture most, and then architectural/urban landscapes second most. Dunno' if those would require this feature.
B.S.Kumar
7-Apr-2016, 23:44
Here is a comparison of the Wista metal field cameras:
149310
Note that "Micro-Focus" is actually achieved by using both the "Micro-Swing" knobs in tandem. It is not very easy to maintain the same degree of movement on both sides, and should be used carefully.
There is no one camera that can do it all - which is why there are many kinds of cameras - for many kinds of photographers. As you get more experienced with LF photography, you will understand why some movements are easier done at the rear of the camera than the front. Focusing with the front changes the distance between the lens and the subject, altering perspective and magnification. These are magnified when doing close-up photography. Monorail cameras are best for such photography.
Kumar
I guess it depends on what you're shooting, but I started with a VX and I loved it. If you need micro swing or micro focus, then it sounds like a monorail would be better anyway.
But it sounds like you're looking to simplify things by moving to a technical camera, and the VX is the simplest option. It actually took me a while to find one, I didn't want the extra bells and whistles of the SP and definitely didn't want the RF due to the extra size and complexity.
My only complaint about the VX was that it has no direct lens fall. You can, of course, drop the bed since the VX does have rear tilt. But it's a bit more cumbersome than a direct movement. The Toyo fields do have some lens fall, but at the expense of not as much rise. So you'd need to decide what's more important to you.
My one other complaint was that the rotating back does tend to vignette the corners of the frame, especially with longer lenses. It's been a while now, but from what I remember this was visible at 150mm and pretty bad with 210mm. My technika does this too, but not nearly as much. It's not a huge issue but if you like to print full-frame it can be a problem. I've never used a toyo but from what I understand, they don't have this issue.
As a side note, I now use a Master Technika 2000, and I've never used the back movements at all. I don't think I've ever used rear tilt or swing on a camera except as a demonstration while teaching a workshop, but obviously your style and type of photography may require these movements so that's something you need to decide.
But if you don't use back movements (other than maybe some tilt, which the VX has), then by all means, I'd save the money and go for the VX.
mike rosenlof
8-Apr-2016, 11:05
I own the SP, two of them actually, long story.
As I understand it, the micro swing feature is basically a geared rear swing. It's *really* intended to use one side or the other to get parallelism and not both together for focus.
I like the SP a lot. I've used the micro swing rarely, but it's nice when you use it. The regular back swing is fine too. The GG is nice and bright, the locks lock when they're supposed to and unlock easily too. The VX omits the micro swing and I think has a different method to attach the back. I'm sure it's very nice to use, and a bit lighter than the SP.
There's a good chance I'll put one of them up for sale before too long. I *really* don't need two of them! I'm just not shooting 4x5 that much. I've moved bigger.
senderoaburrido
8-Apr-2016, 12:18
My only complaint about the VX was that it has no direct lens fall. You can, of course, drop the bed since the VX does have rear tilt. But it's a bit more cumbersome than a direct movement. The Toyo fields do have some lens fall, but at the expense of not as much rise. So you'd need to decide what's more important to you.
My one other complaint was that the rotating back does tend to vignette the corners of the frame, especially with longer lenses. It's been a while now, but from what I remember this was visible at 150mm and pretty bad with 210mm. My technika does this too, but not nearly as much. It's not a huge issue but if you like to print full-frame it can be a problem. I've never used a toyo but from what I understand, they don't have this issue.
...
But if you don't use back movements (other than maybe some tilt, which the VX has), then by all means, I'd save the money and go for the VX.
I like using back movements to subtly play with perspective, both in portraits and the urban shots. What discouraged me from looking at a Toyo is that the Toyo 4x5 technicals have half as much swing (8 degrees vs. Wista's 15 degrees), back and front, and significantly reduced lateral shift (7mm vs Wista's 40mm) for approximately the same price used.
To be honest, I haven't really played much with rise or fall so far. Only in a few shots. Tilts and swings are a lot more obvious in their utility to me, be it back or front. I'd like to learn where and when rise and fall is appropriate, as I'm clearly missing a piece of important technique in eschewing them.
This vignetting you're describing is very off-putting. That added versatility is useless if there's noticeable, enlargement-affecting vignetting. Do you mean to say that when the back is rotated to the horizontal rather than vertical orientation, it causes problems? Or does this issue appear with both configurations? I've become accustomed to my Cambo monorail's rotating back, as it's a much more convenient than holding the camera on its side, as you would a 35mm. I'm not sure I want a technical with which I cannot reliably use a rotating back.
It is not obvious to me which features or which versatility is most worth sacrificing in the purchase of a technical. I simply want something sub 1000$ CDN that is significantly more portable than my Cambo monorail; a camera that I could take on a long trip, or a hike.
I've had an SP for 25 years. I bought it in part because of that way cool micro-swing, which I've probably used 5 times in all those years.
B.S.Kumar
8-Apr-2016, 17:01
I like using back movements to subtly play with perspective, both in portraits and the urban shots.
To be honest, I haven't really played much with rise or fall so far. Only in a few shots. Tilts and swings are a lot more obvious in their utility to me, be it back or front. I'd like to learn where and when rise and fall is appropriate, as I'm clearly missing a piece of important technique in eschewing them.
This vignetting you're describing is very off-putting. That added versatility is useless if there's noticeable, enlargement-affecting vignetting. Do you mean to say that when the back is rotated to the horizontal rather than vertical orientation, it causes problems? Or does this issue appear with both configurations? I've become accustomed to my Cambo monorail's rotating back, as it's a much more convenient than holding the camera on its side, as you would a 35mm. I'm not sure I want a technical with which I cannot reliably use a rotating back.
It is not obvious to me which features or which versatility is most worth sacrificing in the purchase of a technical. I simply want something sub 1000$ CDN that is significantly more portable than my Cambo monorail; a camera that I could take on a long trip, or a hike.
a. Before spending any money on a camera, I suggest using the Cambo you have, and noting down the movements you might require, for the images that you make. This will help you narrow down the choice of camera.
b. I have shot with all the Wista cameras with a Betterlight scan back, using lenses from 65mm to 360mm, using rise and shift movements extensively. I cannot recall any instance where there was vignetting. Perhaps other members who have used Wistas can comment on this.
c. For 1000 CAD (85,000 JPY), you could buy most any Wista you want. The "lack" of front swing on the far cheaper N and D models is easily overcome by the generous rear swing, and the "Micro-Swing" on the D. This is an often overlooked and extremely useful feature.
Kumar
... I have shot with all the Wista cameras with a Betterlight scan back, using lenses from 65mm to 360mm, using rise and shift movements extensively. I cannot recall any instance where there was vignetting. Perhaps other members who have used Wistas can comment on this. ...
Don't the better light scan backs have something like a 3x4 inch scanning area? If so, you would never see the vignetting. I've read about it elsewhere so I'm not making it up, but it might not bother some people. Do a quick search and I'm sure you'll find more posts about it (other than mine). It's just in the corners, it doesn't affect the image quality outside of the area that's blocked by the rotating back assembly. It just looks like the corners of the image are cut off slightly. It's not too bad with a 150 but with a 210 I definitely had to crop more than I would have liked. I like to compose in the camera and crop as little as possible. With lenses shorter than 150 there is no issue. And I don't mean to harp on this, it's not all that big of a deal and my current Technika does the same thing, although to a lesser extent.
...I'd like to learn where and when rise and fall is appropriate, as I'm clearly missing a piece of important technique in eschewing them. ...
You generally use lens rise and fall (rise is more common) to keep vertical lines vertical. I'm sure you've noticed that if you point a camera up, say to include the top of a tall building, that the vertical lines will converge. Lens rise lets you include the top of the building without tilting the camera, so the lines will remain vertical. Lens fall is often used for the same reason, but often it's used when you're shooting from an elevated position. I use it often when shooting urban landscapes from bridges or tall buildings. Of course, rear rise and fall can be used for the same reasons, but most field cameras don't have any.
Only you can say how much camera movement you need. B.S. Kumar made a great suggestion, note how much and what kind of movements you're using with your combo then make sure to get a field camera that can do what you need.
B.S.Kumar
8-Apr-2016, 18:41
Yes, the Betterlight has an image area of 72 x 96mm, but I do use extensive rise/shift movements. I think that would get close to 4x5 film territory. I've not shot much film on the Wistas, so you are probably right. And if that does happen, it may be possible to minimize it using rear tilt/swing in combination with front movements. A little convoluted, and not as easy as with a monorail, but it can be done.
Kumar
Alan Gales
8-Apr-2016, 18:57
I had an earlier model with the micro rear swing like the SP. The micro rear swing seemed gimmicky to me. I would prefer the VX for the slightly lighter weight and cheaper price over the SP.
senderoaburrido
8-Apr-2016, 19:04
I'm starting to wonder if perhaps the smartest thing to do is to find a more portable monorail. I really enjoy using all the different movements.
Despite the fact that I am intrigued by the idea of being able to shoot shots in hand, without a tripod, it would probably not be a common occurrence. I'm also concerned about this vignetting. Do other technicals or field cameras have this vignetting issue on longer focal lengths? My current collection of lenses is 90mm, 150mm and 210mm. I was looking at a 240mm, too. I also tend to compose in the camera rather than in the darkroom or on the computer.It would be obnoxious, having to frequently crop my images.
As it stands, what appeals to me about technical field cameras is the metal construction (less likely to rot or warp, potentially cheaper, definitely sturdier), shorter setup-time, and portability, including a very low profile when folded. The only thing I couldn't get from a more travel-friendly monorail or a normal field camera is the handheld photography potential. I can always use the Hasselblad for that, I guess.
Perhaps I should look at field cameras, then? Almost every single one I've seen is both over 1000 CAD and wooden. I would really prefer to avoid wood construction if possible. The possibility for a revolving back is essential, too. I tend to use that feature quite a bit.
B.S.Kumar
8-Apr-2016, 20:03
Despite the ads that Linhof used to put out showing photographers using Technikas hand-held, technical cameras aren't really meant to be used like that. The movements can't be used reliably to their full potential, and if you're going to do P&S, the TravelWide, DaYi and Fotoman do it well enough.
A revolving back vs. a reversible back is not so much of an issue for me. My Sinar has a reversible back, the Toyo D45M and Wista D have revolving backs.
For really portable, tough and inexpensive monorail cameras, my vote goes to the Toyo D45M. It is not much bigger than the Wista, has geared rise/fall and shift, and accessories are available at very reasonable prices. If you don't need the Graflok back, and can use a spring back, the older beige, green and gray versions are even better deals. You can simply bung it into a backpack with a groundglass protector on a short rail. The Sinar F is a close competitor, but not as tough. Others like the Technikardan are very good, but become expensive.
Kumar
The only time I've noticed vignetting with my SP has been when I used significant movements. Probably 60% or more of my shooting is with a 135mm, and I rarely shoot at infinity, so maybe it wouldn't show up in those circumstances.
I'm curious why focal length has anything to do with this "problem" if its root cause is the rotating back.
Yes, the Betterlight has an image area of 72 x 96mm, but I do use extensive rise/shift movements. I think that would get close to 4x5 film territory. I've not shot much film on the Wistas, so you are probably right. And if that does happen, it may be possible to minimize it using rear tilt/swing in combination with front movements. A little convoluted, and not as easy as with a monorail, but it can be done.
Kumar
It's just the corners and the shading happens in the camera back itself, very close to the film plane. It's the circular track that allows the back to rotate. So even with shifts you won't see it on your Betterlight. With normal 4x5 film, you can get rid of some of it by using shifts, but the problem is you'd be making it worse on the opposite corners! I don't want to overstate this issue though. It's a great camera and that's not why I sold mine. It's a minor annoyance, although it might be slightly more serious if you like to print full-frame with the film edges showing. But I loved that camera and do recommend it.
...I'm starting to wonder if perhaps the smartest thing to do is to find a more portable monorail. I really enjoy using all the different movements...
You might consider a Linhof Technikardan. I hate to sound like a broken record because I recommend that camera often. But it's just so good for getting full movements with a very compact camera. It's a monorail design, but the standards fold up parallel to each other in line with the rail, so it's not all that much bigger than a metal field camera.
I occasionally ran out of movements on my Wista VX, mostly I was trying to use substantial rise with wider lenses. Also I really like the option of direct lens fall, since I often shoot from elevated positions. That's the real reason I sold it, and I bought a Technikardan 45S. The TK45S is one of the few cameras that can really do (almost) everything well. The price may be higher than you're looking to spend, but the prices seem low right now. And you might find that it could also replace your current monorail.
I actually made the mistake of selling my TK a few years ago, figuring that my other camera, a Master Technika 2000, could do everything I needed. But I missed it and needed it for some specific reasons. I bought a new one a few months ago for around $1200 and it looks like new, it's much nicer than the one I sold. I think you could find a good user for around $1000 or maybe even less.
It's heavier than a wood field for sure, but it's really nice to work with, fast to set up and very precise. The newer "S" version is best, it has center detents on the swings and tilts which make it faster to set up and probably more precise.
My advice would be to forget about handholding 4x5. You'd probably be better off with your 'Blad.
senderoaburrido
8-Apr-2016, 21:59
You might consider a Linhof Technikardan. I hate to sound like a broken record because I recommend that camera often. But it's just so good for getting full movements with a very compact camera. It's a monorail design, but the standards fold up parallel to each other in line with the rail, so it's not all that much bigger than a metal field camera.
...
I actually made the mistake of selling my TK a few years ago, figuring that my other camera, a Master Technika 2000, could do everything I needed. But I missed it and needed it for some specific reasons. I bought a new one a few months ago for around $1200 and it looks like new, it's much nicer than the one I sold. I think you could find a good user for around $1000 or maybe even less.
The problem for me is that 1200$ USD in CDN comes out to about 1500$. I work minimum wage in Quebec, which is approximately 8$ an hour USD. Now I've heard the refrains again, and again, "Photography is expensive." or "Film photography is expensive, you should know that." Despite its cost, a few hiccups granted, I've managed to keep the monetary strain of this hobby at levels commensurate with my wage. I can skimp on food, and heating in the winter to save 100$ here and there, which might get me a VX after 5 months worth of saving. I'm currently trying to sell two lenses I don't use much in order to pay for either a new camera (the tentative one being discussed here) or a panoramic back. Even with that extra cash, 1500$ is out of orbit for me. I wouldn't even feel comfortable taking that camera outside. The Toyo 45D can be had for very little comparitively, and I can live with it getting banged up.
Believe me, I'd love a Technikardan. Saw one at a camera show and it was a fine lookin' machine. Certainly something to aspire to. I appreciate the advice, but I'm not sure I can apply it.
This actually makes me think of another criteria, a sub-criteria related to portability that is important for me: ideally my camera is something I can travel with on my back, or on my bike. I don't have a driver's license, and it's my only way of getting around outside of public transit or friend-provided lifts. That was why the very compact package of a technical field camera caught my eye in the first place.
Another question: Someone said "reversible back". What is that? How does it compare to a rotating one?
Tim Meisburger
8-Apr-2016, 22:43
Well, I don't even remember which one they said vignettes, but I would buy the other one. I cannot even imagine anyone selling a camera with a built in mechanical vignette. As for the micro swings, I've never used them, but every other camera on earth gets by without them.
A reversable back can be put either in landscape or in portrait direction, a rotating back can also be put in all the positions in between, rotating 360 degrees. I can't commend on the Wista's but my experience with the Toyo is that the revolving back indeed vignettes, except when it is either (almost) in landscape or portrait direction. As I level the camera with my tripod head I had not much use for a revolving back and had preferred a much lighter reversable back on the camera.
Why do you limit your choice between a Wista and a Toyo? There are quite a few other field camera's out there that have loads more movements, for instance the Chamonix and Shenhao camera's. And those are pretty rugged and well build camera's too - having lugged one around for three years now without much of a problem.
miesnert
9-Apr-2016, 01:31
I make large fullframe analogue prints shot with a Wista VX and have never seen any evidence of vignetting in any of my shots (I use 90, 125, 180 and 210mm lenses).
... I've managed to keep the monetary strain of this hobby at levels commensurate with my wage. ...
This is very smart, sorry I suggested something so expensive. I wasn't aware of your budget, but it's smart to stick to it. Two TK's sold on eBay recently for $860 and $990. But when every penny counts, I totally understand that's a lot of money.
Larger monorails are going to be a bit big to put in a backpack. So if you can live with the amount of movements, then you're right that a field camera is a good choice. Even if it's not as flexible as a monorail, you'll be more likely to bring it along so it'll get more use. And you can probably adapt to its limitations.
I'll try to dig up an image with the vignetting in a little while so people can see what I'm talking about. But I didn't intend to make such a big deal of it. The Wistas are great cameras, and I think the VX is a great value. I would decide on it vs the Toyo based on the specific movements you need.
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 08:17
I can't commend on the Wista's but my experience with the Toyo is that the revolving back indeed vignettes, except when it is either (almost) in landscape or portrait direction.
Why do you limit your choice between a Wista and a Toyo? There are quite a few other field camera's out there that have loads more movements, for instance the Chamonix and Shenhao camera's.
Ah! I thought that they had meant it vignetted with a revolving back regardless of position. That makes a big difference. I have never used my revolving back outside of portrait or landscape, as, like you, I use the level on my tripod. Maybe a reversible back is in the books for me, on one of these technicals.
As for a Shen Hao or Chamonix, I haven't been able to find one that is sub-1000$ CAD, let alone a more comfortable price of sub-700$ CAD. I looked for some beater Canham DLC's, too. Lowest price I saw was 900$ CAD for one that needed obvious repairs. I saw a Technikardan that sold in the last few months for 800$ CAD, which also needed repairs and may have had bent standards. The Technikardan and Canham DLC are the dream: portable, versatile cameras of completely metal construction. For now, they're outside of my reach. I wish I had more to sell, really. One thing about being young is that you don't have any long-untouched goodies that you can dig out of the closet to pawn off for an extra buck here or there. I've got no more equipment to sell, only books.
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 08:36
Late model entry level Cambo and Calumet monorail cameras go for next to nothing. Cheaper than a VX. Weight difference isn't much between them and a Wista or Toyo Technical field camera. They are just more bulky. I'm sure you could figure a way to pack one on a bicycle. I'd be more worried about transporting the tripod. Pick up a 210mm lens and away you go with plenty of movements and money left over for film.
The only time I've noticed vignetting with my SP has been when I used significant movements. Probably 60% or more of my shooting is with a 135mm, and I rarely shoot at infinity, so maybe it wouldn't show up in those circumstances.
I'm curious why focal length has anything to do with this "problem" if its root cause is the rotating back.
Ha, no wonder I've never noticed this "vignetting". Its not that I haven't noticed, its because I haven't paid attention because there is no falloff from it as you would expect from typical vignetting. I would call it "cropping". Its a cutoff, not a falloff.
I looked at some recent negatives shot at close range with my 135, and you can even see it on those. These corners shown aren't from closeups but I see no difference in the cropping. So obviously this occurs even on shorter lenses.
The other reason I've never paid attention is because it doesn't matter. The cropped corners lie 100% outside of the projected area on either of the 2 Omega 4x5 carriers I own, and they make nice places to attach the clip for drying.
These are 100% a non-issue unless you are contact printing or using different carriers with full-frame openings.
i wonder what other entirely inconsequential things escape my notice in everyday life.
149356
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 10:05
Late model entry level Cambo and Calumet monorail cameras go for next to nothing. Cheaper than a VX. Weight difference isn't much between them and a Wista or Toyo Technical field camera. They are just more bulky. I'm sure you could figure a way to pack one on a bicycle. I'd be more worried about transporting the tripod. Pick up a 210mm lens and away you go with plenty of movements and money left over for film.
That's actually what I have right now. I've got a Cambo SCX. Very not portable because of its tremendous profile. The weight could be manageable. If I could get the damn standards off, it would be extremely portable.
Someone told me, in another thread, that the standards should be able to slide off the rail. I recently updated that post to no response. There is a knob that I should be able to loosen, which would allow me to pop the end cap off. The knob unscrews without popping out completely, leaving the plastic rail cap attached. Not sure how else to remove the cap and slide the standards off. It's not mentioned in the camera's manual, and there are no videos or illustrative pictures that I could find.
Here is the same corner of the negative on the right above, in the lower half of my Omega carrier with the sleeve removed. I've pulled the top edge into the frame so you can see that the top of the cropped corner doesn't show. The left edge of the negative is also hard against the left side guides, showing that the cropped area clearly doesn't appear AT ALL. This is with the top of the carrier off; with the top on its possible even a sliver more more of the edges are covered up making it even more of a non-issue.
149370
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 12:10
That's actually what I have right now. I've got a Cambo SCX. Very not portable because of its tremendous profile. The weight could be manageable. If I could get the damn standards off, it would be extremely portable.
Someone told me, in another thread, that the standards should be able to slide off the rail. I recently updated that post to no response. There is a knob that I should be able to loosen, which would allow me to pop the end cap off. The knob unscrews without popping out completely, leaving the plastic rail cap attached. Not sure how else to remove the cap and slide the standards off. It's not mentioned in the camera's manual, and there are no videos or illustrative pictures that I could find.
I had a Cambo Master once. On that camera you unscrewed the knob (it did not pop off) and pulled the rail apart into two pieces.
Yeah, I called it mechanical vignetting because that's what I've heard it called elsewhere on this forum. But it's basically cropped corners. From what I understand the toyos do not have the problem when the back is in landscape or portrait mode, at 0 or 90 degrees. The Wista has it all the time regardless of the back position. Although the extent of the clipped corners depends on the focal length and also on lens movements.
But as I've been saying, it's not an issue for some (or most) people. It doesn't really show up at all under 150mm. I found it annoying at 150 and 210mm, but I really try to compose very carefully in-camera and I don't like to crop more than necessary.
It's also a non-issue if you make analog prints or use a flatbed or imacon/hasselblad scanner, since the negative carrier will likely crop it out. But I drum scan my negatives, and I'd have to crop as much as 1/8 inch on all sides (or 1/4 inch off of both ends if I decided I wanted to keep the full height of my neg).
This is a typical example shot with a 210.
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 12:33
I had a Cambo Master once. On that camera you unscrewed the knob (it did not pop off) and pulled the rail apart into two pieces.
149378 Does it separate in the middle of the rail, as per the green arrows, or does the seam rung lengthwise and you pull the top half of the rail from the bottom? Right now the knob has been unscrewed, and nothing budges. I gave a gentle tug both ways.
149379 Here's the knob unscrewed.
149380 This is the knob end of the rail.
149381 The opposite side.
This is a typical example shot with a 210.
That's much less terrible than it sounded. It's not like there's anything very important lurking in that tiny bit of corner.
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 13:25
149378 Does it separate in the middle of the rail, as per the green arrows, or does the seam rung lengthwise and you pull the top half of the rail from the bottom? Right now the knob has been unscrewed, and nothing budges. I gave a gentle tug both ways.
The Master rail separated in the middle of the rail as per your green arrows. You should be able to see a seam. The knob turns a screw that threads into the opposite rail piece. There are also two pins in the rail that fit into two holes on the other rail if I remember correctly. It should just pull apart after the knob completely unthreads the screw. Maybe it's just stuck.
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 13:31
The Master rail separated in the middle of the rail as per your green arrows. You should be able to see a seam. The knob turns a screw that threads into the opposite rail piece. There are also two pins in the rail that fit into two holes on the other rail if I remember correctly. It should just pull apart after the knob completely unthreads the screw. Maybe it's just stuck.
There is no seam to seen, as far as I can tell. Here is a picture of the exact middle of the rail:
149382
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 14:23
There is no seam to seen, as far as I can tell. Here is a picture of the exact middle of the rail:
149382
Check this picture out from KEH. Pay attention to the knob and end cap. https://www.pinterest.com/pin/320951910919176238/
It appears that the end cap comes loose when the knob is loosened. Maybe it has a slot in it and it drops out of the way. Or maybe the knob can come completely off so you can take the end cap off.
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 14:58
Check this picture out from KEH. Pay attention to the knob and end cap. https://www.pinterest.com/pin/320951910919176238/
It appears that the end cap comes loose when the knob is loosened. Maybe it has a slot in it and it drops out of the way. Or maybe the knob can come completely off so you can take the end cap off.
I've tried that before. It must be really jammed. Hm. Maybe I can WD-40 it?
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 16:32
I've tried that before. It must be really jammed. Hm. Maybe I can WD-40 it?
It may not have been removed since the camera was made. :)
I'd try using a screwdriver and hammer. Place the blade of the screwdriver against the end cap and gently tap the end of the screwdriver with a hammer. I'd try all 4 sides to loosen it up. If you are afraid of scratching something then place a wash cloth between the screwdriver blade and the end cap.
If you can't get it off then start a new thread asking about it. I'm sure someone on here owns or has owned a similar camera.
Good luck to you!
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 16:37
https://youtu.be/o2YXASrFjiw
Here I am unscrewing it and attempting to remove the cap.
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 16:56
https://youtu.be/o2YXASrFjiw
Here I am unscrewing it and attempting to remove the cap.
Huh! That is weird. The cap did come loose. I saw separation.
Have you tried unscrewing the knob and removing the other end cap?
I wish I had it in my hands. That is a puzzle!
senderoaburrido
9-Apr-2016, 17:04
Huh! That is weird. The cap did come loose. I saw separation.
Yeah, it definitely does separate, ever-so-slightly. The way the cap feels stuck makes me think that it's not supposed to be removed, though.
I've already tried the other end before.
I have no idea why they didn't just put this procedure in the manual.
Alan Gales
9-Apr-2016, 17:17
Yeah, it definitely does separate, ever-so-slightly. The way the cap feels stuck makes me think that it's not supposed to be removed, though.
I've already tried the other end before.
I have no idea why they didn't just put this procedure in the manual.
Start a new thread asking about this. Someone here has your answer. I agree, it should have been in the manual.
I've owned a lot of Cambo and Calumet cameras. I'd buy someone's kit and then part them out and sell them. Most have rails that have a little chrome pin that you depress so the standards can slide off. Like I told you the Master had a rail that separated in two pieces. I've never had a rail like you have.
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