Camera Movements

[alanmcd]

Just wondering... with regard to tilt/shift/swing movements...
Is there a camera which provides continuous movement in all dimensions similar to the focus movement we all have?
I jst wonder how much more pleasure it would be if tilt especially, could be wound back and forth like focus, instead of the sticky method of pushing and pulling standards and clamping.
I suppose that the most expensive camera does this?
Alan

[B.S.Kumar]

Cameras with geared movements - Sinar P/P2/X, as well as some Cambo, Horseman, Linhof and Toyo models do have "continuous" movements in all axes. That's the reason they are more expensive, large and heavy. Though now you can get a Sinar P for $400~500.

Kumar

[Lachlan 717]

Perhaps consider how many cameras there are that don't deploy this functionality to gauge its actual importance...

[alanmcd]

Cameras with geared movements - Sinar P/P2/X, as well as some Cambo, Horseman, Linhof and Toyo models do have "continuous" movements in all axes. That's the reason they are more expensive, large and heavy. Though now you can get a Sinar P for $400~500.

Kumar

Where does the Sinar F fit in here?
Alan

[alanmcd]

Perhaps consider how many cameras there are that don't deploy this functionality to gauge its actual importance...

Quite right and this is comforting in some regard.
But it's matter now as to why it's unimportant.
Is it unimportant because we don't care?
Is it unimportant because DOF takes care of and hides a wide range of issues?
I find that the old 'tilt to the far and focus to the near' is good practice but no matter how much I tighten after a tilt, it never gives me the impression that it's where I intended it to be. The tightening process moves the tilt. Even the focus tightening moves my focus. I mean, the camera has a tendency to spring away from my adjustments.
Are you saying that since most manufacturers disregard this issue, that it's not as important as I think it is? Perhaps the camera DOF and focus/tilt is robust enough for me not to worry more about it.
Interesting discussion
Alan

[B.S.Kumar]

Geared movements make life easier, particularly when you are on a job. They save time and frustration. That is paid for by the weight, size and expense of the camera. There is nothing that cannot be accomplished using cameras without geared movements. You just need to prioritize, like everything else in life.

The Sinar F series does not have any geared movements, except for a small range of fine focusing. It is a great camera, and I used an F2 extensively for architecture and interior photography, where tilt and swing are rarely used. I have a P and a C2 now, and use them more often.

Kumar

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

Is there a camera which provides continuous movement in all dimensions similar to the focus movement we all have?

The Arca Swiss M Monolith has focusing and all movements geared.

The Arca Swiss F-metric has focusing and rise + shift geared.
Base tilts remain manually operated on the F-metric, but if you add the micrometric orbix, you get a geared tilt control in front.

[John Layton]

There are indeed materials (such as a good quality rubberized cork) which can be utilized in areas of rotational and lateral contact, which give just the "right" degree of "slip and grip" to afford both a high degree of smoothly controllable adjustments - where the user can continue to finely tweak a particular function in a manner which allows for a secure "semi-lock" while still being moveable, while also providing for a secure lock when tightened down.

If designed in properly, I sincerely believe that such materials can provide for a better/more direct/more intuitive experience than is the case with geared movements, and even more so when such movements that may be adversely affected by gravity when combined (such as rise/fall and axial tilt) can be separated, so that adjusting one of them does not jeopardize the other. Just IMHO - and other's mileage may vary. But maybe don't give up on non-geared movements until you've tried, or at least researched, a few more cameras.

[John Layton]

PS: Also keep in mind that geared movements can, when either poorly executed and/or not properly maintained, exhibit a degree of backlash/free play which may place an adjustment at risk.

[Ken Lee]

I jst wonder how much more pleasure it would be if tilt especially, could be wound back and forth like focus, instead of the sticky method of pushing and pulling standards and clamping.

A lot more pleasure.

To state it conversely, I've used my Tachihara and Kodak 2D wooden field cameras for close work: compared to the Sinar P, the same operations are distracting enough to interfere with the creative process.

As long as I'm shooting at reasonable distance from my car, I will carry the Sinar P, even though it is heavy (especially with a 5x7 back on it).

[David Lobato]

I have cameras that differ greatly. My Toyo metal field camera adjustments stay where I lock them. My well worn wooden 8x10 Deardorff is a whole 'nother story. It requires a good guess to under or over estimate the amount of movement before locking the knobs. Repeat adjustments to get the right amount are too common and just stopping down another couple of stops is tempting.

The subject matter also is significant. For still life and close ups, very fine adjustments are necessary to render finest details. In the field with distant subjects, precision is less necessary, though still very helpful.

[Doremus Scudder]

Alan,

If your movement locks and focus locks are not functioning properly, then check the washers, etc. to make sure they are in good working order. FWIW, yes, dealing with minute amounts of tilt can be a bit of a pain without geared movements, especially if you need to position just past a zero-detent, but for me, the trade-off in weight is worth it. My cameras stay put where I lock them. If yours don't then there's likely something you can do to remedy the problem.

Doremus

[Lachlan 717]

I think that Nick Thorley had a "remote" tilt control on one of his ULF DIY cameras. His was more for easy of use (not having to keep moving around the behemoth until desired movements were obtained) than what you're mentioning, but it shows that it can be done.

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

Another camera, not large format except the camera itself which is huge, where all movements are continuously driven by computer-controlled electric actuators. With an automatic focus/Scheimpflug control program.

The CapCam as seen at the 2014 Photokina in Cologne.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/43175600@N00/15420633879/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/43175600@N00/15583582926/